GP of Germany - Page 4

chapo · 07-21-2008, 10:58 PM

F1 sucks. there, I said it. The cars are ugly and suck. the drivers are boring and suck. After so many years of watching F1 I have come to the conclusion I don't care anymore. These cars are horrid. The drivers are boring. The tracks, my god, emasculate them some more. Where is the modern Arnoux and Gilles for gods sake? Laffite, Andretti, Peterson? Lots of passing this race? Give me a break. The Corvettes inthe ALMS had a better battle, and they were the only fricken cars in their class and they were both penalized twice for rough driving and banging into each other. At least they gave a damn, not like these F1 boys. I must hold my position for points! Pure crap, good job Bernie. Might as well watch the IRL race. And for the record the Grand Am blows. Ugly NASCAR inspired POS's. Where is the thinking that brought us Vettes vs. 934's and 935's and DeKon Monza's? Where are the v-12 vs v-8 f-1 cars? Turbos? Racing sucks today because you are penalized for being smart. No wonder vintage racing has such a huge following. Huge motors with drivers that had huge balls with cars that "should" work. Flame away, rant over. BTW go Ferrari.

rusnak · 07-21-2008, 11:34 PM

way to keep the 70s alive dude

JCF · 07-22-2008, 03:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chapo

F1 sucks. there, I said it. The cars are ugly and suck. the drivers are boring and suck. After so many years of watching F1 I have come to the conclusion I don't care anymore. These cars are horrid. The drivers are boring. The tracks, my god, emasculate them some more. Where is the modern Arnoux and Gilles for gods sake? Laffite, Andretti, Peterson? Lots of passing this race? Give me a break. The Corvettes inthe ALMS had a better battle, and they were the only fricken cars in their class and they were both penalized twice for rough driving and banging into each other. At least they gave a damn, not like these F1 boys. I must hold my position for points! Pure crap, good job Bernie. Might as well watch the IRL race. And for the record the Grand Am blows. Ugly NASCAR inspired POS's. Where is the thinking that brought us Vettes vs. 934's and 935's and DeKon Monza's? Where are the v-12 vs v-8 f-1 cars? Turbos? Racing sucks today because you are penalized for being smart. No wonder vintage racing has such a huge following. Huge motors with drivers that had huge balls with cars that "should" work. Flame away, rant over. BTW go Ferrari.

Some good points ;

Those 'vettes showed me something last weekend. That was very cool to see.
Too bad there is no other challengers in that class - imagine what THAT would be like !
And the Acura/Porsche battles are getting better and better.

Someone said it before - F1 needs to bring the drivers more visibly in to it.
Maybe a little more '70's, or even 60's attitude would be interesting.
Getting rid of traction control is a good step in the right direction.
Hamilton seems to be the best driver out there but makes some pretty young mistakes.
Too bad Shumi couldn't have stuck around and then we would know how good the kid really is. Would have been good for Hamilton.

Race of the weekend though ?

HOW SICK WAS THAT MOTO GP ?????!!!!!!!

911teo · 07-22-2008, 06:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aerkuld

i Think You Got That Backwards...

:d

+1

911teo · 07-22-2008, 06:39 AM

I do not think anybody can deny Hamilton has talent.

Wether or not he was copying Alonso's set ups he was certainly able to stay close (if not go faster) than the 2 times word champion last year.

Anybody here remembers Schumacher's and Senna's (or Prost's for that matter) rookie seasons? A couple of nice races in a Jordan and some funambolic laps on a rain soaked Monaco GP in a Toleman....

It would take Senna some years to become WC, and Schumacher had already quite an experience with the Sauber-Mercedes team in the Sport-Prototype racing.

Hamilton has certainly had some doors opened for him by Dennis but he's quick. He needs to mature, but he has the ambition, the car, the talent and the age to challenge Mr Schumacher's record, without no competion clauses on his contract

Jims5543 · 07-22-2008, 04:26 PM

'Hamilton nearly crashed into the Safety Car'

Quote:

Tuesday 22nd July 2008

Lewis Hamilton came within inches of crashing out of the German GP behind the Safety Car, it has been revealed.

While the deployment of the Safety Car nearly wrecked Hamilton's hopes of victory, causing a procession to become a dramatic charge to regain the lead of the race, it also nearly made a literal wreck of his McLaren.

The Independent claims that, in an incident missed by the television cameras, Hamilton 'almost came a cropper behind the Safety Car on the 41st lap, just before the race was restarted.

'He was following safety car driver Bernd Maylander through the stadium section of the track. At the exit of the Sachskurve Hamilton backed off a little to create some space between his car and the Safety Car as the latter was naturally unable to negotiate the kink before the final two corners at the same speed as the F1 machinery,' the newspaper reports.

'Hamilton then put his foot down again and accelerated just as Maylander slowed down - and eyewitnesses report that Lewis just managed to avoid impact with the rear end of the Mercedes-Benz. It was very close indeed, and those same witnesses report that there were literally only inches to spare.'

Hamilton has encountered difficulties behind the Safety Car before, most notably last October when his 'erratic' driving behind it during the Japanese GP was cited as the reason why Sebastian Vettel crashed into Mark Webber.

However, on Sunday in Hockenheim it was the Safety Car's instant eradication of the lead he had steadily built up over Massa that troubled the McLaren driver. "It is a rule they [the FIA] should have a look at," Hamilton mused before admitting that he couldn't think of a better solution in such circumstances.

Seric · 07-22-2008, 04:45 PM

Ramming speed?

If he keeps this up, nasty nicknames will start surfacing in the paddock...

Mule · 07-22-2008, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jims5543

Its beating the rules when any team other than Ferrari does it. When Ferrari does it, its cheating.

Come on now buddy, how much have they been fined?

Jims5543 · 07-22-2008, 06:46 PM

Who had movable front aero for the 1st 4-5 races this season before they were told to secure it?

When Ferrari tried that stunt they lasted ONE race.

legion · 07-22-2008, 06:51 PM

I'm sorry...who had the flexible underbody again?

Jims5543 · 07-22-2008, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by legion

I'm sorry...who had the flexible underbody again?

And how many races did it last?

And who had the plans to it to know it was their?

Mule · 07-22-2008, 06:57 PM

Yeah but how much has Ferrari been fined?

Jims5543 · 07-22-2008, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mule

Yeah but how much has Ferrari been fined?

You keep asking that question, do you even understand the severity of what McLaren did?

In addition to their fine (50 mil) their drivers should have been removed from the WC race.

If Ferrari was caught with the other teams car plans all hell would have broken loose.

I do not know why everyone feels Bernie and Max are favoring Ferrari the big draw to the sport is now a McLaren driver and going with the same philosophy that Schumacher and Ferrari got preferential treatment the same argument can now be made for McLaren and Lewis.

911teo · 07-23-2008, 05:11 AM

[QUOTE=Jims5543;4076664]You keep asking that question, do you even understand the severity of what McLaren did?

In addition to their fine (50 mil) their drivers should have been removed from the WC race.

/QUOTE]

And they were... come on... last year it was a farce that was kept alive just not to lose all the sponsors.

McLaren does not draw the crowds, money and popularity. Ferrari does. An F1 without Ferrari is nothing.

This is why they were the solitary signitor of the new concordia pact (eventually subscribed by all the others) and this is why they dictate the rules.

MFAFF · 07-23-2008, 06:07 AM

Quote:

An F1 without Ferrari is nothing.

This is why they were the solitary signitor of the new concordia pact (eventually subscribed by all the others) and this is why they dictate the rules.

Sad to disagree with you .... F1 without Ferrari....a couple of seasons of fuss then nothing....a historical note....afterall other names whose power was a influential have come and gone....Maserati.....Lotus... come to mind...

For a couple of years the sponsors would be miffed and pissed off.. that is the reason why the FIA have been so vulnerable to Ferrari for so long (Enzo was the master at it) and sadly old men like Bernie and Max have not moved on....the newer generation don't particularly care whether Lewis drives a McLaren, Ferrari or a BMW... they want to see HIM win...

The overall balance is different...a Williams or Red Bull is not the interest... the man driving it is.....the disappearance of owners as characters (Ken Tyrell, Bruce McLaren, Enzo, ACBC etc) has made the company less interesting and allowed dull as ditch water drivers to shine.
Lewis may win a dozen WDC but he will never have the eccentric character of a James Hunt or the purpose of a Gilles Villeneuve, he will however go into the record books as a 'better' driver...

rusnak · 07-23-2008, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MFAFF

Sad to disagree with you .... F1 without Ferrari....a couple of seasons of fuss then nothing....a historical note....afterall other names whose power was a influential have come and gone....Maserati.....Lotus... come to mind...

For a couple of years the sponsors would be miffed and pissed off.. that is the reason why the FIA have been so vulnerable to Ferrari for so long (Enzo was the master at it) and sadly old men like Bernie and Max have not moved on....the newer generation don't particularly care whether Lewis drives a McLaren, Ferrari or a BMW... they want to see HIM win...

The overall balance is different...a Williams or Red Bull is not the interest... the man driving it is.....the disappearance of owners as characters (Ken Tyrell, Bruce McLaren, Enzo, ACBC etc) has made the company less interesting and allowed dull as ditch water drivers to shine.
Lewis may win a dozen WDC but he will never have the eccentric character of a James Hunt or the purpose of a Gilles Villeneuve, he will however go into the record books as a 'better' driver...

I think you both raise some very good points. I'd have to say you are both partially right. By the way, you forgot Lotus and Colin Chapman.

In the drivers list you forgot Nikki Lauda, Prost, Senna, Keke Rossberg, as guys who drew the crowds with their personalities and ability. Hamilton is in my opinion, still a work in progress. We simply do not know his trajectory because he is still so new. He has one and a half seasons total in F1.

As for Ferrari having influence on FIA, only someone who is naive would say they don't. Do a roll call of the FIA board as to how many ex-Ferrari guys are voting members.

Jims5543 · 07-23-2008, 08:44 AM

I guess I am naive then. I see the new wonderboy Lewis Hamilton being the Tiger Woods of F1 and I think the FIA knows this.

rusnak · 07-23-2008, 08:48 AM

you might have a point with Hammy, Jim. But that has no influence on the FIA at all. They are a bunch of crusty insiders who do what they wanna do. Why do you think Mosely kept his job? Clearly the outside world is not their concern.

Mule · 07-23-2008, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Cesiro

I guess I am naive then. I see the new wonderboy Lewis Hamilton being the Tiger Woods of F1 and I think the FIA knows this.

We agree!

MFAFF · 07-23-2008, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rusnak

.... By the way, you forgot Lotus and Colin Chapman.

In the drivers list you forgot Nikki Lauda, Prost, Senna, Keke Rossberg, as guys who drew the crowds with their personalities and ability.

R,

I think I mentionned Lotus... and ACBC is Colin Chapman...his initials as they appear on the Lotus badge..

I'd say that Lauda, Prost, Senna were characters but their success in terms of number of WDC makes that a lessor aspect of their careers.

Rosberg...well his 160mph(average) lap of Silverstone, followed by a quick fag (cigarette) whilst perched on the wheel of his Williams in the pit makes him part of that group..

Jim,

LH is no Tiger Woods... he brings neither new exceptional never seen before talent to the game.. look at JV's first two seasons to see what can be achieved..and what LH should at least aim to match...nor a new level of professionalism.. MS set the drivers bar very very high in that department, arguably rasing it higher even than Senna.

LH's career to date shows no sign of originality, flair or innovation. He is very very good, with the potential to become a multiple WDC...but its the result of dedication and hardwork following others.. not leading them...that is the difference.....a fundamental one.

Tiger is a leader... he has changed the game, raised the bar etc etc as well as having a massive commercial/ media skill set. Perhaps it is in this domain that LH can find common ground.