Buick dethrones Lexus for #1 in reliability

[m21sniper]

Originally Posted by onewhippedpuppy

GMs run badly longer than anything else. The 3800 is a great motor, but very, ummm, uninspiring. Unless it has a turbo bolted to it. The Monte Carlo my wife had when we met sounded like it was lubricated with gravel.

The supercharged ones are plenty powerful for most people's tastes. My uncle has a 90 something Olds 98 with a SC'ed 3.8 in it. I think he's at 220,000 miles. It doesn't even smoke and still pulls really hard.

Buick 3.8L V-6's are among the greatest engine designs in history.

Originally Posted by CJFusco

Sure Lexus, Jag, and Buick win top prize for new car reliability, but what about long-term (i.e., 10+ years)? Can anything match the long-term reliability of a 1980s Mercedes Diesel or the Volvo 240 and 740 series?

My Volvo has nearly 255K and climbing - it did need a new transmission at one point, but other than that it's been as solid as a car can be. I seem to see more old Volvos on the road than any other brand; either owning a 25-30 year old Volvo is trendy, or these cars just last.

255 and climbing is just run of the mill mileage for any well maintained 3.8L V-6 powered GM.

Seriously.

Originally Posted by the

I doubt a 996 or Boxster would go that long on the original engine and transmission. It'd be a worn out, leaking mess well before then.

There are some 200,000+ mile original engine 928s around. A few of them are even supercharged i think.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Originally Posted by m21sniper

Buick 3.8L V-6's are among the greatest engine designs in history.

If you judge it by quantity, sure. Though I think that's more due to GM's lack of innovative design and badge engineering. They have adequate power, but aren't what most people would refer to as smooth. Perfectly adequate for a Buick, but not a match for a modern DOHC design. There's a reason why even GM has finally abandoned pushrods for many of their new engines.

[m21sniper]

I judge it by quality and durability. The Turbo variants of those engines readily support 800hp with stock bottom ends.

I think pushrod engines in many ways are superior- far more reliable due to far fewer moving parts. They also cost vastly less money to rebuild as well. Most OHC engines also use belts instead of chains, which further hurts their reliability.

The (real) SB Chevy, 5.0 ford and countless other US Pushrod V-8s are as strong, reliable and long lasting as any mass produced automotive engine mankind has ever made.

[onewhippedpuppy]

I don't think you can really quantify that the OHV configuration is any more reliable than an OHC. It depends on the manufacture, not the configuration. Any garden variety car can go 200k+ with regular maintenance, and there's a lot of other turbo motors that can support crazy power levels. A Supra instantly comes to mind.

But, I don't think many would argue that an OHC is a much smoother configuration. When I think great engine, I think of something that puts a smile on my face. A thrashy 3800 doesn't make the list. But if you bolt on a turbo or SC it helps even things up.

[m21sniper]

OHC is smoother, OHV is inherently less expensive to maintain/repair, and IMO far more reliable(if for no other reason than most of the legendary OHV's have chains and not belts).

How many naturally aspirated V-6s in large family cars can ever put a smile on someone's face?

Put a latest generation naturally aspirated 3800 V-6 in a Fierro(for instance) and you'd be grinning like a school boy for all the live long day. Hehe.

[Tishabet]

Mine still starts right up and it's over 70 years old

[Jim Richards]

Grant, that's a beauty. The first car I ever drove was a '39 Buick.

[CJFusco]

Originally Posted by m21sniper

255 and climbing is just run of the mill mileage for any well maintained 3.8L V-6 powered GM.
.

Oh, I believe you. I'm just saying that it seems as though there are more old Volvos on the road (in CT at least) than any other marque. I see 10-15 240s and 740s on the road EVERY DAY just in my general area - a very wealthy section of CT, more or less. I'm sure the GM V6 holds up well, but I really don't see old ones too much around here. Is it because the body falls apart? Or because the resale value is so low? Or because it just doesn't have the same cache as driving around in an old Volvo (somehow I doubt it)? I don't pretend to know.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Originally Posted by CJFusco

Oh, I believe you. I'm just saying that it seems as though there are more old Volvos on the road (in CT at least) than any other marque. I see 10-15 240s and 740s on the road EVERY DAY just in my general area - a very wealthy section of CT, more or less. I'm sure the GM V6 holds up well, but I really don't see old ones too much around here. Is it because the body falls apart? Or because the resale value is so low? Or because it just doesn't have the same cache as driving around in an old Volvo (somehow I doubt it)? I don't pretend to know.

It's hard to drive a 3800 V6 when the rest of the car has fallen apart.

[Zef]

Yea...sure...I will buy a GM crap next time...!!!!!!!!!!

[m21sniper]

Originally Posted by CJFusco

Oh, I believe you. I'm just saying that it seems as though there are more old Volvos on the road (in CT at least) than any other marque. I see 10-15 240s and 740s on the road EVERY DAY just in my general area - a very wealthy section of CT, more or less. I'm sure the GM V6 holds up well, but I really don't see old ones too much around here. Is it because the body falls apart? Or because the resale value is so low? Or because it just doesn't have the same cache as driving around in an old Volvo (somehow I doubt it)? I don't pretend to know.

It probably has a lot to do with where you live too.

In an affluent area you're just not going to see many buicks to begin with probably, but i would expect Volvos to be common. Likewise in the city in middle class neighborhoods it's probably the opposite. Lots of buicks, few volvos.

Point taken though- Volvos last a long time too.

Originally Posted by onewhippedpuppy

It's hard to drive a 3800 V6 when the rest of the car has fallen apart.

LOL.

[CJFusco]

Actually, I do see a lot of new Buicks - the ones with the portholes in the fender. The owners are usually aged 65-80.

[m21sniper]

I cannot stand those vents. Around here all the kids and young dudes stick those cheap pep boys add on vents on everything. And at every angle.

Hideous.

[Don Plumley]

Good friend of mine has a Maserati Qattroporte - with the three holes on the fender. When he drove into the parking lot for dinner and walked over to us, our friend said, "Oh, I see you drove the Buick." From me, a loud chuckle. From the Maserati owner, a pained grin and rolled eyes.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Originally Posted by m21sniper

I cannot stand those vents. Around here all the kids and young dudes stick those cheap pep boys add on vents on everything. And at every angle.

Hideous.

Amen to that. Plus the stupid stick on fender vents.

[m21sniper]

I've seen them on every body panel imaginable here. I have no idea what makes people do such things, but these are the same people that fed/feed the "curb sensor", spinner rim and DUB crazes.

[CJFusco]

Hmm, I know the "stick on vents" to which you refer, but I don't think I've ever really seen them around here.

[m21sniper]

Not really a surprise, you live in a nice area.

I guess you could say it's a "ghetto type thang."