The Death And Rebirth(?) Of A Double Barrel

Kistle · 09-27-2011, 08:33 PM

Many of you may have seen the original thread where I inquired about repairing "dents" in the barrel of a shotgun. This is an early 1900's Crescent .410 side by side double barrel. It was the very first gun I shot some 40 years ago, and my son (9 years old) has recently taken an interest in it.

Well, after a couple phone conversations with the double barrel wizard, David (targa911S), I packed it up and sent it to him last week.

He has started his initial inspection and disassembly, and I plan to document the restoration project here. Clearly, David has his work cut out for him, but he continues to be optimistic about the end product that we can expect, and we already know what kind of work he turns out.

Stay tuned here. I will provide periodic updates (with pictures), as I get them from David.

JA

SXSMAN · 09-27-2011, 08:48 PM

Not a high ender but a serviceable field gun the Crescent. Have had a few over the years.Look forward to updates.

SxS

Mericet · Mericet's Garage

Subscribed. Can not wait to see the magic David will do on this one.

targa911S · 07:20 AM

The Crescent "quail" model is fairly rare. That fact combined with the sentimental attachment to this little gun makes it worth trying to save, and I will do my best to do just that. Any other Crescent in this bad shape I would just say not worth the time and money. The wood is just wood, if possible we will save the original. If not, new wood will be our best option. The dents bother me though. Seems the old demon rust was living in those two dents for years and has made the barrels thin in what I would consider a high pressure spot in the left barrel. I will have new material put in the "crater" by a friend who does micro welding, then I will file/grind the area flat again. Even at that I do not think it will be safe to shoot with modern ammo. Only low pressure or maybe even black powder loads. I know .410's are little guns but those tiny barrels make a LOT of pressure because of their size. John and I have discussed this and of course I will be the one to shoot it first. If it blows it blows on me not him. It's the old tie it to a tire and use a long string method. The barrels go out on friday for welding and I will continue on the wood while they are gone. Mericet/Neil,your input would help here on the welding aspect. It would be interesting to hear what your instructors say about this project. You may even be able to join in on the fun here. I may hold the barrels until you get a chance to consult with them.

id10t · 09-28-2011, 07:38 AM

Check this 410 sxs project out ...

GunBroker.com Message Forums - .410 S X S Shotgun Project......Photos

vash · vash's Garage

damn. i cant wait until that is done to see the transformation.

i hate broken gun stocks

RPKESQ · 09-28-2011, 08:56 AM

I do not recommend welding. You will never match the temper and crystalline structure of the surrounding metal. And barrels on shotguns are typically made of much more ductile steel than rifles or handguns (some manufactures have experimented with higher strength steel for shotguns and have had serious problems). The evenness of flexibility and ductility is important as you do not want to set up any stress points. Stress points will lead to failure.

Shotgun barrels with this type of damage can only pass proof by utilizing the following methods:

Sleeving (1) - by replacing the barrels and inserting them into the breech section.

Sleeving (2) - By replacing the breech section and inserting the original barrels.

New Barrels - Complete new barrels.

In this case I would consider the welding as a cosmetic repair only and permanently plug the barrels.

If someone was willing to undergo the cost of a working repair, I would go looking for a good used set of barrels first and consider sleeving (1 or 2 depending where the damage is located) as the second choice.

targa911S · 09-28-2011, 09:27 AM

I was waiting for you to weigh in Frenchy. Those were my thoughts as well. I'll start looking for a set of BBls.

daepp · daepp's Garage

That is so cool!

Mericet · Mericet's Garage

Well, I was going to speak to my instructors tomorrow, but I do agree with RPKESQ on this one.

azasadny · azasadny's Garage

John,
You sent the gun to the right guy! David does fantastic work and he's a true craftsman, but you already knew that! I can't wait to see the finished gun.

targa911S · 09-28-2011, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mericet

Well, I was going to speak to my instructors tomorrow, but I do agree with RPKESQ on this one.

I knew in the back of my head that we all are right on this. I was hoping for a better solution. The last thing I want is somebody to get hurt here. So we are putting out a call for a set of Crescent .410 barrels. If we all dig we may find some.

targa911S · 09-28-2011, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mericet

Well, I was going to speak to my instructors tomorrow, but I do agree with RPKESQ on this one.

Maybe they would want the barrels to teach you all how to sleeve an set of barrels. The last set i had sleeved were a set of Parker nitro 20ga. barrels. I sent them to Briley and they were perfectly done. However, it cost $1,900 for a new set of tubes. This is a Crescent, a half dozen of those aren't worth that much. Sleeving is a BIG job requiring relaying the ribs and much machining. Worth a shot, no pun intended. Show them this thread. That would be cool. No time constraints on this project.

Mericet · Mericet's Garage

You have piqued my interest. I will discuss it tomorrow but I can only start working on that next year at the earliest. I have a lot of tools to finish before then!

targa911S · 09-28-2011, 08:49 PM

I'm sure John would be good with that. It could be the "all pelican Project". I'll do the wood. You do the barrels. I'll blue them if you want (lol) You in north carolina? I have a good friend who was the head engraver for Colt for 38 years that lives in your fine state. He takes commissions and an occasional apprentice. When yer done with school......

Mericet · Mericet's Garage

Sadly, it is a no go with the instructors. I would have loved to do it but the time constraints of the syllabus is tight and they feel the time spent on a project like this could be better spent teaching quite a few other things.

Engraving is also not part of our program. Looks like I would have to take one of the summer NRA courses at the college to start that out. I have to say, it is also about the only craft in gunmaking that intimidates me.

Mike C · 09-30-2011, 02:08 AM

While anything is possible, I believe that would be a "wall hanger" with great memories.

Mericet · Mericet's Garage

Oh, almost forgot. My instructors agree that welding the barrels would be a bad idea for a shotgun that will still be used.

targa911S · 09-30-2011, 05:10 AM

we all agree on that. i have put the word out in the double gun community that i'm looking for a set of barrels. thanks for asking though. I didn't mean to draw ya'll off track on your studies.

Mericet · Mericet's Garage

No harm in asking! They did mention that is not often you see a dent in a .410 barrel and that re-sleeving barrels is an art.

BTW, now that I have gone through my blueprints thoroughly I realized that we are making some shotgun barrel dent removers just like yours! Busy doing mine at the moment.