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-   -   the Shopping Mall. (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/showthread.php?t=989313)

BeyGon 03-02-2018 06:42 PM

South Coast Plaza in Costa Mesa still does $1.5 Billion a year.

jyl 03-02-2018 06:48 PM

We have four large malls in Portland and environs.

The highest end mall, Washington Square in Tigard, is doing great or at least very good. It is a destination for socializing, dining, movies, shopping. It helps that Tigard is a very suburban place. For an active, lively place with lots of people and lots of things to do, the mall is where is at.

The other high end mall, Pioneer Square Mall in downtown Portland, is doing okay. It is also a destination, with plenty of parking, movies, dining, and shopping in a downtown that is a pretty popular place to be after work hours but where streetfront stores are increasingly afflicted by homeless people hanging out front - but no homeless in the mall.

Those are both "A" malls.

The "B" mall near my house, in close in Northeast Portland, is the Lloyd Mall. It is not doing well. Two of its three anchors are gone, with Nordstrom and Sears closing. Many of its teen apparel retailers are struggling. The 10 screen movie theatre in the mall was closed and converted to "creative office space". The park right across the street has a not-unfounded reputation as a place to buy drugs and get stabbed. This is sad because the Lloyd Mall was [edit: NOT] the very first enclosed shopping mall in the US. However, it was bought by some very deep pocketed investors who are putting money into reviving the mall. It has been remodeled, modernized, the ice skating rink moved to a more central location, and the main entrance rebuilt to have a more appealing appearance from the street. The Nordstrom location is going to be revised into a place for small local businesses. The Sears location will be rebuilt into a movie theatre and more creative office space. The immediate surrounding area is undergoing a transformation with about 3,000 to 4,000 new apartments and condos built within the last two years or coming within the next year or two. It is served by light rail, streetcar, bus, a freeway offramp, and a major bicycle/pedestrian bridge over the freeway and multiple new bike routes will be added soon. New office development is starting and property values are shooting up. All these new residents and workers will be looking for what a mall can offer. The thing is that they won't be driving cars into the parking garage, they will be walking over from their home or office. And while there is a nice commercial street with shops and dining, it is full up with no room to add many more businesses. The original mall was designed solely for shoppers in cars, with a bunker like appearance. The challenge the owners have is to somehow connect the indoor mall to the neighborhood outside, and fill it with craft beer and entertainment instead of lookalike chain stores, which is not easy. I'm hopeful. I like that mall, took the kids there all the time.

There is another mall, Clackamas Town Center, that I don't know anything about. Been there maybe once in ten years. It's a fair drive away.

My feeling is that the very highest end "A" malls are holding their own, not growing but not really in decline. They have an easier time in suburban areas where there isn't much competition. Malls is urban locations are having a harder time and "B" malls are really suffering. "C" malls are dying off.

America is really over stored. During the period 1998-2008, everyone thought any half decent retail concept could support 5,000 stores and they were being built right and left. Unit growth of 15% plus same store sales growth of 5% made for 20% sales growth that would supposedly continue for decades, and supported high stock valuations. Now there are too many retail concepts overlapping and the easiest way to buy anything is with a mouse click, the right number of stores nationwide is half of what was believed before, low inflation and stagnant wages means low or no same store sales growth, and the people who are making all the money are not interested in teenybopper jeans or mass market women's casualwear. So -10% unit growth plus -3% same store sales means -13% sales growth and it doesn't take many years of that for a retail chain to go bankrupt. Shuttered stores, empty malls.

The fastest growing population centers are very urban, the disposable income is being spent on eating out, microbrews, rent and mortgage payments, travel, digital gadgets. What almost every traditional mall wishes it was, is a carefully designed "village" of shops and restaurants amid winding paths. A "Town Center" of shops instead of a mall.

Danimal16 03-02-2018 07:51 PM

The very first enclosed mall in the USA was Southdale in Minnesota which opened in 1956. Lloyd Center in Portland opened in 1960 and is not the first enclosed US Mall.

jhynesrockmtn 03-03-2018 07:30 AM

It has been well documented that the traditional enclosed malls anchored by Macy's/JC Penney/Sears etc. have been in decline for quite some time. The Department store is a dying breed and taking the malls down the drain with em.

mattdavis11 03-03-2018 08:57 AM

Outlet malls are thriving in Texas. Indoor malls are either gone, or are hanging by a thread. With that said, a local one that is still rather active, Barton Creek Square mall, is a hit to the younger generations. Our 17 year old frequently cruised the mall last summer.

Best I can remember, there was a dead guy, bled out, cash strewn about, in a rain soaked parking lot the last time I went to an indoor mall.

RKDinOKC 03-03-2018 09:12 AM

Not just malls here. Grocery stores are folding up with everyone going to the big box type groceries. More people are going out to eat instead of cooking.

Seahawk 03-03-2018 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jyl (Post 9947697)
The fastest growing population centers are very urban, the disposable income is being spent on eating out, microbrews, rent and mortgage payments, travel, digital gadgets. What almost every traditional mall wishes it was, is a carefully designed "village" of shops and restaurants amid winding paths. A "Town Center" of shops instead of a mall.

That is where things are headed in Maryland and Virginia.

Loudoun Country is the 2nd wealthiest County in US. They are interested in bringing small tech businesses into the country. We always meet the Loudoun County guys at 'One Loudoun', a small town center they made from scratch.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1520097940.jpg

Reston Town Center is the same.

Crowbob 03-03-2018 11:29 AM

Last time I went to the mall it felt like I was in a Fellini movie.

Weirded me out at the time.

Seahawk 03-03-2018 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crowbob (Post 9948258)
Last time I went to the mall it felt like I was in a Fellini movie.

Weirded me out at the time.

I have not been to a Mall in 20 years...I would be Encino Man.

RKDinOKC 03-03-2018 12:27 PM

The only mall I go to has the local Apple Store and I only go to that store and the men's clothing store my tailor works through.

WolfeMacleod 03-03-2018 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danimal16 (Post 9947739)
The very first enclosed mall in the USA was Southdale in Minnesota which opened in 1956. Lloyd Center in Portland opened in 1960 and is not the first enclosed US Mall.

Wrong, sorry.
Northgate here in Seattle has it beat by 6 years.

Opening date April 21, 1950

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northgate_Mall_(Seattle)

scottmandue 03-03-2018 01:16 PM

Mall wars... this could get ugly :D

rwest 03-03-2018 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WolfeMacleod (Post 9948319)
Wrong, sorry.
Northgate here in Seattle has it beat by 6 years.

Opening date April 21, 1950

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northgate_Mall_(Seattle)

Wolff,

Read the Wiki again, it says that the mall started out as open air and was enclosed in the 70’s

I saw a documentary on malls and it was funny to us Minnesotans as the narrator pronounced Edina as E deena not E dine ah.

BeyGon 03-03-2018 02:42 PM

oh well, the biggest and best producing on the west coast is still South Coast Plaza at $1.5 BILLION a year

KFC911 03-03-2018 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottmandue (Post 9948327)
Mall wars... this could get ugly :D

My mall is older than yer mall!

Don't make me bring my grandmall or great-grandmall into this debate ;)

Danimal16 03-03-2018 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WolfeMacleod (Post 9948319)
Wrong, sorry.
Northgate here in Seattle has it beat by 6 years.

Opening date April 21, 1950

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northgate_Mall_(Seattle)

Re-read the post. Jyl claimed that:

"This is sad because the Lloyd Mall was the very first enclosed shopping mall in the US."


The Lloyd Mall was not the first ENCLOSED mall as you claim.

Danimal16 03-03-2018 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottmandue (Post 9948327)
Mall wars... this could get ugly :D

Hey, I don't do a lot of things well, but meaningless trivia is the one thing that I excel at, and I usually don't even get that right!:)

Danimal16 03-03-2018 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC911 (Post 9948404)
My mall is older than yer mall!

Don't make me bring my grandmall or great-grandmall into this debate ;)

Yeah, big words! I heard your mall strips.

KFC911 03-03-2018 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danimal16 (Post 9948426)
Yeah, big words! I heard your mall strips.

Strip malls.....now we're talkin' :)

Haven't been to one in years...never did like window shopping for stuff I couldn't afford either ;)

widebody911 03-03-2018 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC911 (Post 9948404)
My mall is older than yer mall!

Don't make me bring my grandmall or great-grandmall into this debate ;)

Now don't have a grandmall seizure...


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