'86 3.2 fan adjusment, scraping housing; chirping noise

[thisisgoodnews]

Hello fellow P owners. Went to take a quick video for my question on adjustment, but then another issue came up. So:
1. my fan housing had scraping marks for the whole time the car is in my hands, and I was not sure, if this was previous or still constant issue. Then I went and painted some lines with a black marker on the scraping marks. Not right away, but they dissapeared, so the issue in ongoing. Also, notice the clearance between the fan rotor and the housing. Fan belt doesn't seem to overtightened and has it's 10-15mm of travel when pressed with a thumb.
2. note the chirping noise, coming from the front of the engine. Fan scraping housing? Failing (AC compressor) bearing?

Appreciate your comments.

[proporsche]

belt too tight..after you do not have enough shims behind the cap and nut..has to be 6 of them Very possible your alt bearings are a little worn out but 1st adjust the belt

Ivan

[Dan J]

I've seen that when the nuts that hold the alternator to the housing are loose

[john walker's workshop]

The housing is badly cracked and the belt pulls the alternator down. Standard 3.2 issue unfortunately. You loosen the bely to compensate and it squeels. Ya can't win.

[FA-18C]

Could the alternator bearing be shot?

[thisisgoodnews]

Hello. Appreciate everybody's input. Went down to the car today to check it up and although the main reason causing the issue is still unclear for me, I have made some discoveries:

1. removed the AC belt - noise is still there;
2. removed the fan belt - noise gone, must be it;
3. fan belt shows some cracks and if the green marking may be the timestamp, meaning 21st April 2016, it is well past due the replacement.




4. the nut securing the fan, to my surprise was not 24 but 22;
5. I found 1 shim between the nut/washer and the pulley and 4 shims between the pulley and the fan - must be 6 in total, 1 is missing; also, 4 shims between the rotor and the pulley means tension was set up on the looser side;
6. with the pulley undone, spinned the alternator, and it is clearly scraping the housing:



6. alternator shaft has some very slight play in two axis - up/down and forward/backward. If I lift the shaft up and then spin it, the noise is gone, BUT the fan blades are still much closer to the bottom of the housing, leaving a bigger back a the top of the housing;



7. Did not manage to take the housing out, but no signs of cracks were visible;
8. From an Eagle (?) logo and huge lettering MADE IN AMERICA under the housing lash, I assume housing and rotor are already not OEM, but from EPS, being likely it is
aluminium instead of magnesium, so ?less prone to cracking?.



9. As mentioned, I did not take the housing out and did not undo the alternator from it, but it was held very tightly in the housing, no signs of loose nuts holding the alternator;

Car has 400k kilometer on the ODO. Alternator was "serviced" (not sure, if it was just checked for charging, or if any components were replaced) ~30k km ago, already in my ownership.

Is it normal for the alternator shaft to have this slight play? If it is that the bearings are shot and the play is eliminated, the fan blades are still closer to the bottom of the housing, with a bigger (maybe 1-1,5 mm) gap at the top. Can this be adjusted?

Is EPS a reputable parts manufacturer or maybe misalignment may come from inferior parts quality?

Again, thank you for your input in advance.

[FA-18C]

I had a chirping fan/alternator that varied at speed, and the noise went away with the fan belt off. It has some play, which was likely worn bearings. There was not scraping on the housing, but with the new alternator, resolved all issues. No idea on EPS. I think it is worth pulling the alternator and perhaps having an auto electric shop check it and service the bearings. Might get off easy expect for the enjoyment of removal and installation.

[Psychepilgrim]

Hi, it could be worth trying to untight the fan housing strap. It happened to me when I rebuit the all assembly, I had tightened too much the strap and as a result the fan was scrapping the bottom of the housing when it wasn't before disassembly. I untightened it and the probleme was solved.

[wazzz]

Yes, as mentioned above (Salut Cyril !), the strap bolt needs to be tighten to only 12 Nm, which is really not much. Most people tend to overtighten it, but the specified torque is indeed 12 Nm.

And your video clearly shows that alternator bearings need to be changed. Cheap and easy to do, but you'll need a puller.
This plus a new belt and the proper number of shims might be sufficient to eliminate the rubbing.

[Psychepilgrim]

Originally Posted by wazzz

Yes, as mentioned above (Salut Cyril !), the strap bolt needs to be tighten to only 12 Nm, which is really not much. Most people tend to overtighten it, but the specified torque is indeed 12 Nm.

And your video clearly shows that alternator bearings need to be changed. Cheap and easy to do, but you'll need a puller.
This plus a new belt and the proper number of shims might be sufficient to eliminate the rubbing.

Salut Gilles! Funny to see you here!

[thisisgoodnews]

Thank you everybody. Anywhere I could find the rest of the torque values for the involved nuts, especially the fan nut?

[FA-18C]

Bentley Manual usually has all of the torque values

[wazzz]

Originally Posted by thisisgoodnews

Thank you everybody. Anywhere I could find the rest of the torque values for the involved nuts, especially the fan nut?

Fan nut is 40 Nm.

Here is a good source for Carrera 3.2 torques.

[thisisgoodnews]

So I took out the alternator, and took it to a shop for servicing. Idea was that new bearings would probably solve the shaft play issue. Apparently, even the new bearing, when pressed in, has same slight play, so the slot where the bearing sits must be slightly worn out.. Is this a common issue?

Starting to look at the options for brand new alternator..

[proporsche]

back in the 1990`s if we had a problem like this..alternator bearings good,correct shims in place, we took the alt housing out and hit it -gently with copper hammer to change the ovality of it..Problem solved.This usually happens when people make the belt too tight and have not enough shims..after a while the housing will tilt-get out of round by that.....

Ivan

[gtc]

I'd search some old threads about the EPS fans and shrouds. They didn't seem to be the best quality.