Targa to coupe conversion

[gorskined]

Hello all
kind of new to the 911 Technical forum, but long time participant on the turbo supercharging section of the forum.

I have a rust free 80sc Targa it was converted to a steel wide body many years ago. The wide body conversion looks better than most factory turbo cars other than the 3.8L wing . The car has a newly rebuilt 76 3.0l short stroke row turbo. basically everything in the car has been rebuilt or gone through .not a show car , she is my fair weather driver.
im not concerned about value because nothing in the car is original. i bought the car sight un seen because of the motor . and was pleasantly surprised with the entire car .

I cant get past the wind noise. and the rattles. and i miss the door clunk when you close the door on a coupe and to be honest i just like the look of a coupe . i am considering possibly converting my Targa to a coupe . i read a few threads from past conversions but most of them were threads that modified the cars also. Newer car older roof , roll bars and so on.
im looking to put a G body coupe roof on a G body Targa no frill or mods unless needed . . i am quite proficient with a tig welder so im not to concerned with welding and fabricating, im pretty sure i can do it as long as i know what needs to get done. not to mention "winter is coming" i need a project.

i have lots of Questions and concerns.
.... Do all G body roofs have the same footprint .
... Do i need to replace the doors or can i just add the coupe window frames ?
.. Can i reuse my existing windshield?
... Is there anything structural that will need altering?
.... Why do all the conversion i read about all mention roll bars?
.. I would love to see a link of a step by step conversion if one exists.
.. I would also love to hear from someone who has done this with some words of wisdom the dos and don'ts.

Thanks in advance

Regards Ned

[Kevin Stewart]

Subbed.

[Matt Monson]

The juice has never been worth the squeeze on them, unless you start with a salvage titled wreck. Soooo much easier to sell the car and buy another.

[OsoMoore]

I recommend also you sell and buy a coupe. The amount of money needed to effect the change would exceed any difference in cost for an otherwise-equivalent car. You might even be able to find someone to do a trade.

[Winter911]

I’m in the middle of a conversion with no welding/fab/bodywork experience and it hasn’t been bad.
If it's what you want for the car and you're not worried about value then go for it

My car wasn’t even close to original and got it for almost nothing so I didn’t care. Look back at my threads. About 90% of the people told me to sell the car and buy a coupe.
I went from a cab->targa->coupe

I’ll write up a build thread eventually.

.... Do all G body roofs have the same footprint . yes, although some rain gutters line up differently to the corner of the deck lid. Not sure what years do this but I ran into that issue with mine. Im doing a raingutter delete anyways so i didnt care
... Do i need to replace the doors or can i just add the coupe window frames ? just add coupe window frames
.. Can i reuse my existing windshield? yes
... Is there anything structural that will need altering? I would recommend a full cage or at least a half cage. The A pillars will lose some strength and are thinner than targa pillars. this is why I made my cut high on the targa pillars to retain some strength
.... Why do all the conversion i read about all mention roll bars? see above^

.. I would also love to hear from someone who has done this with some words of wisdom the dos and don'ts. Find a generous cut that include the B pillars, C pillars, and entire suround of the quarter window. It will save you a lot of time

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by Winter911

Meh… don’t listen to them. I’m in the middle of a conversion with no welding/fab/bodywork experience and it hasn’t been bad.
If it's what you want for the car and you're not worried about value then who cares? So many people in here only see things for profit. (These are the same people that don't drive their cars because the car will lose value)

Welcome to the forum, noob. You sure talk a lot of shyte, with no idea who you are actually talking about here. How about we stick to the topic and leave the personal mudslinging out of it? I never said a thing about profit and you don't have a clue how I drive or use my cars.

Maybe, since you're in the middle of this, enlighten the OP to what it's costing you and answer some of his questions about the finer details. That, not trash talking, is what this forum is for.

[Winter911]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

Welcome to the forum, noob. You sure talk a lot of shyte, with no idea who you are actually talking about here. How about we stick to the topic and leave the personal mudslinging out of it? I never said a thing about profit and you don't have a clue how I drive or use my cars.

Maybe, since you're in the middle of this, enlighten the OP to what it's costing you and answer some of his questions about the finer details. That, not trash talking, is what this forum is for.

yeah you're right.
Removed that part from my post since it was unecessary. I'll keep my opinions to myself next time. No need to get nasty.

Have a good one

[Kevin Stewart]

Gorskined its your car do what you want. If you love the car build it how you want it. It is no ones business but yours.

My car was a 1982 black Targa, its now a cab 3.6 widebody. Getting ready to add a hard top or do what your doing.

[MConn]

I've converted an 87 Targa to a coupe using an early roof (maybe 1969).

I added reinforcing splines in the A pillars for strength but this didn't leave room for the roof lighting wiring so it had the be routed outside the A pillar metal under the upholstery.
I made templates for the windshield, rear glass, and rear quarter glass first so the spacing of the openings would be right.
The rear glass to trunk transition was a real pain to try to get it looking OK.
I used the Targa doors and coupe door trim.
The rear quarter glass interior trim is different, Targa is thicker so i ended up making the trim pieces.
The driver and passenger floorboards are reinforced on the Targa - I deleted the reinforcements for more foot room.
The B pillar was an issue because you don't have one on the Targa, the templates helped me with this.

Overall, I'm happy with the result, but it was more work than I thought it would be.

[gorskined]

Originally Posted by MConn

I've converted an 87 Targa to a coupe using an early roof (maybe 1969).

I added reinforcing splines in the A pillars for strength but this didn't leave room for the roof lighting wiring so it had the be routed outside the A pillar metal under the upholstery.
I made templates for the windshield, rear glass, and rear quarter glass first so the spacing of the openings would be right.
The rear glass to trunk transition was a real pain to try to get it looking OK.
I used the Targa doors and coupe door trim.
The rear quarter glass interior trim is different, Targa is thicker so i ended up making the trim pieces.
The driver and passenger floorboards are reinforced on the Targa - I deleted the reinforcements for more foot room.
The B pillar was an issue because you don't have one on the Targa, the templates helped me with this.


Overall, I'm happy with the result, but it was more work than I thought it would be.

i haven't owned a coupe since high school 30 years ago loved my 74 911s put over 200k miles on it in 4 years . and since then i have always had a 356s .. im a size 15 shoe . when i got my Targa a few years back . i was like was like wtf how did i ever have sex in this car . i don't recall the pedal and the passenger foot section being so tight ( i didn't realize the Targa's had extra support there ) . im going to research and look into removing the extra supports also, great tip thanks, any pictures?
.. im on the hunt for a roof clip cut low enough to use the rear 1/4 windows . i would prefer a rotted out roller with a good top half. so i can stare at it for a few days to mark it up before i make the actual cut.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

There are so many things to consider.

Is your car a widebody with thick spacers on original trailing arms or were proper Turbo trailing arms used with new mounts on the torsion bar tube?

How much do you love the motor? Would you keep it and sell the roller?

How important is the Turbo bodywork? Can you find a Turbo/M491 for anything less than $80K?

Would you consider buying any G body coupe, keeping as is or adding Turbo bodywork and figuring out what to do with trailing arms? Is that easier than adding a coupe roof to your car?

Is the 356 aquamarine blue metallic?

If you can TIG weld, my sense is converting your car to a coupe is the lowest risk option. Least expensive probably too.

[gorskined]

Originally Posted by Shaun @ Tru6

There are so many things to consider.

Is your car a widebody with thick spacers on original trailing arms or were proper Turbo trailing arms used with new mounts on the torsion bar tube?

How much do you love the motor? Would you keep it and sell the roller?

How important is the Turbo bodywork? Can you find a Turbo/M491 for anything less than $80K?

Would you consider buying any G body coupe, keeping as is or adding Turbo bodywork and figuring out what to do with trailing arms? Is that easier than adding a coupe roof to your car?

Is the 356 aquamarine blue metallic?

If you can TIG weld, my sense is converting your car to a coupe is the lowest risk option. Least expensive probably too.

My car has the sc trailing . no spacers custom deep dish 11.5" custom offsets braid wheels. all new bearings I love the deep dish rim with the turbo look . i did add a 2.5mm spacer since that picture shown, to the rear wheels to fill out the wheel wells a little better. it has 5" spacers on the car when i got it.

i love the motor and its basically new built close to stock but with a k27 raptor turbo and an I/c with sc cams i built it for reliability not crazy hp. really fun to drive .just had the trans rebuilt ( the only thing i didn't do myself) and beefed up to support the turbo motor added hp

The car is rust free no electrical issues nice interior pretty much everything rebuilt. agreed adding a roof would be the easiest option. The only issue currently is the rattling doors and the wind noise and the targa look is ok but i like the coupe look and added quietness. and im still running a little rich under full boost 10.5 afr but that's a work in progress.

The pre a is my 55 continental cab (AKA Blue) Adria Blue metallic .I found her in a Tabaco shed when i was 17 senior skip day in high school. took me 15 years before i drove it for the fist time.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Given everything, I think a coupe conversion is the way to go. I had an 84 Targa for years, the doors never rattled even with 22/29s and ER bearings. Are the doors rattling or something inside the door? If door, probably just needs new plastic striker pieces. Otherwise worn hinges or the front arm has pulled through the sheet metal. My current 84, a rod has come away from a keeper and the buzzing is killing me. On the list with fixing the brights spring.

Adria Blue is also gorgeous and quite a transformation! Post some pics if handy. And if you played a major role in before to after for the car, a coupe roof is definitely the right option IMHO.

[faverymi]

Wouldn't a factory hard top top be sufficient???

Or the french version of it

Just giving another option

[gorskined]

Originally Posted by Shaun @ Tru6

Given everything, I think a coupe conversion is the way to go. I had an 84 Targa for years, the doors never rattled even with 22/29s and ER bearings. Are the doors rattling or something inside the door? If door, probably just needs new plastic striker pieces. Otherwise worn hinges or the front arm has pulled through the sheet metal. My current 84, a rod has come away from a keeper and the buzzing is killing me. On the list with fixing the brights spring.

Adria Blue is also gorgeous and quite a transformation! Post some pics if handy. And if you played a major role in before to after for the car, a coupe roof is definitely the right option IMHO.

Blue was a father son project learned a lot about welding and fabricating. My father passed prior to finish body work .I eventually farmed out the finish body work and paint back 1994. but the car was not together until 2007. It took a side burner to getting married and starting a family . The car still looks like it was just painted... painting is not my strong suite but im pretty good with welding and leading. restored and sold plenty of 356 over the years but always kept blue. 911 are new to me hence all my questions. here is the door bottom my father and i made before you could buy pre a parts . the car on the rotissery is a 56 i restored and added a sunroof clip

[gorskined]

Originally Posted by faverymi

Wouldn't a factory hard top top be sufficient???

Or the french version of it

Just giving another option

all the hard top is see use the Targa frame you still have the gasket issue. i replaced the material on my Targa top and did the gasket but its still noisy. i was actually considering siliconing it closed.

[snbush67]

Originally Posted by gorskined

i don't recall the pedal and the passenger foot section being so tight ( i didn't realize the Targa's had extra support there ) . im going to research and look into removing the extra supports also, great tip thanks, any pictures?

I modified my 1978 Targa pedal box. The modification allows for more room in the foot on the clutch pedal to move unencumbered.

I was a bit nervous at first because I thought that the foot rest area was structural. But after removing it we realized that it was soft metal that was just taking up space for reasons unknown.

In this picture you can see the worn paint where decades of rubbing have been happening:


Another angle:


Initial exploration and discovery cuts:


Continuing cutting and cleaning up the edges:


Surgery complete:


Skin refreshed with some black primer:


Better than new:


Foot placement is much better and no more rubbing, and the car idles much smoother (that’s an inside joke).[/QUOTE]

[MConn]

Here's the picture of after the targa reinforcement is removed.



If you shop for floor mats you can see the difference.

Here's the templates I made -

[Matt Monson]

You clearly have both the skills and the patience to get this done. Thanks for sharing the stories of yourself and your 356. Please make this your build thread and let us follow along, as long as it takes.

I’ll admit that part of my hesitancy is that I am a targa guy, and your car is one of my more favorite 911 colors. Your car is pretty perfect, in my eyes, just as it sits right now. But it’s not my car. Have fun making it what you want it to be.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally Posted by gorskined

Blue was a father son project learned a lot about welding and fabricating. My father passed prior to finish body work .I eventually farmed out the finish body work and paint back 1994. but the car was not together until 2007. It took a side burner to getting married and starting a family . The car still looks like it was just painted... painting is not my strong suite but im pretty good with welding and leading. restored and sold plenty of 356 over the years but always kept blue. 911 are new to me hence all my questions. here is the door bottom my father and i made before you could buy pre a parts . the car on the rotissery is a 56 i restored and added a sunroof clip

Good stuff, right person for the job, I'm looking forward to your progress.

While I like Targas, had an 84 for years that I loved, and appreciate the blocky look, I'm not a fan of widebody variants, they look a little too much high school detention doodle cars, whoever put that tail on your car spent some time in detention, clearly. Coupes are opposite end of the spectrum IMHO.