European Vacation with 911

[proporsche]

911rs..great story and that guy had a nice adventures..He must be single....When i bought my latest 911 i was looking for Euro model,because i knew that one day i will be returning to Europe.It took me 4 years to find the beast...
I have lived 26 years in LA and now i live my dream driving my 911 in Europe.
It was much cheaper for me.I did not have to pay any VAT-taxes or anything else since i owned my car for many years.But the insurance is a PITA if you bring your 911 here....
The first year i had to pay 800 euros,now i just pay 150 euro a year that is all.
One time the Insurance co.( about 2 years ago) sent me money back due to my car being so old;-)

So i encourage anyone to do the trip here, just check into the insurance..they are coco here...and latest is, a lot of 911 are being stolen nowadays....

Ivan

[Discseven]

Put license plates in car or someone may take a liking to them. Once gone is PITA to deal with. I faced this in Germany with P-car I shipped over. Spent a few hours in jail while cops sorted reality out. Forgot what shipping cost was---Miami to Bremen. Customs in Bremen was very interested in car. Had drug sniffing pig brought up from Frankfurt. Took pig two weeks to arrive. Was asked if I wanted to be there when search went on. Decided that would be a bad idea (should customs decide to make a planted bust.)

[RSTarga]

Originally Posted by H-viken

I would think this is safer as well

As long as it is well tied down inside the container.

[anglophone1]

Originally Posted by anglophone1

Ask Auto Shipping Specialist | Kingstown Shipping for a quote- they do this all the time!

I have used them US>UK - closed container with two other cars- they really know their business - my brother is shipping an E type to Florida with them- so both ways.
They have lots of good (free) advice- call them?
C

[spuggy]

Originally Posted by Quicksilver

It is easy to get the car shipped (especially from the East Coast) but the real trick is getting it done with no issues. Rotterdam is an obvious choice (probably from Charleston) but the real issue is protecting the car. With a "roll on, roll off" you have to have complete trust in who is receiving the car. You aren't going to be there to receive the vehicle yourself and it has to go through customs.

With RORO, your car will be on the boat for weeks with some bored people with much time on their hands. When I last shipped RORO, I noticed that someone had half-removed the engine air filter and my stereo was missing; about a dozen cars came off that ship missing stereos apparently...

I have been exploring the idea of taking a small group of people and their cars over for a European road trip (Targa Europa?) and one of the big details I've had trouble answering is about what it takes to get the car back into the country. I generally run a B&B exhaust and would there be an issue at customs with re-entry of a modified car? I never got a call back from the specialist at LA customs that would know exactly what is involved and I haven't tried again since then.

Remember that when re-introducing the car to the US you're potentially subject to scrutiny by multiple agencies too - EPA, DOT - in addition to your state.

However, it all gets a lot simpler as EPA/DOT lose interest entirely once the car is over 25 years old - and producing a US title makes it smoother too.

And so long as your customs agent declares it as "returning US vehicle", you probably won't get inspected by your state patrol either.

The temporary import legislation explicitly states that you MUST keep your foreign registration documents - including state tabs - current & up-to-date whilst driving it over there.

You also will need a vignette to drive a foreign-registered car in a country that doesn't have a reciprocal agreement - one of these https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_vehicle_registration_code

Most EU countries have agreements in place, and US/Canada/Mexico do too. Bu the EU and the US do not have reciprocity; it's also surprisingly difficult to find "real" (e.g. non-novelty ones) for sale in the US on short notice... Sadly, in today's world, there may be some security implications to having that decal, too

For some European countries, a US drivers license isn't enough; they also want an International Driving Permit, according to https://www.autoeurope.com/travel-blog/international-driving-regulations/ - but that's trivial via AAA (don't even need to be a member).

Also you will want insurance and seeing that the car isn't registered over there it will help to have your same US insurance company cover you. As far as I know the only US company that can cover like that is Geico. Their name stands for Government Employees Insurance Company so they cover government employees overseas. I haven't confirmed this personally

I insured my car on US plates in the UK with GEICO in 2006. Pretty darned painless.

I tried to do it again in 2013, and they refused, saying their underwriters would no longer insure a non-UK registered vehicle - that it would have to be re-registered in the UK.

Which takes you outside the provisions of "temporary import for personal use" and into the category of "personal import" - an entirely different thing that requires you to surrender US title....

It's entirely possible that their other offices- e.g. ones based in the EU - might still write this cover, however.

and I haven't discussed this with my buddy who is a Hagerty agent to see what can be done.

Be interesting to see what he can find out; although if they don't have offices/business in those countries, they almost certainly can't write cover for use there. But they may have some partnerships with local companies that could be leveraged...

European countries will want a serious assurance that once the car is in Europe the car won't be sold there. Otherwise they will want you to pay VAT. I believe there is a time limit you can stay and avoid VAT too.

It's just a form, declaring the reasons you're bringing the car in. If you're importing a car less than 6 months old, you pay import duty on the value of the car and the shipping cost. And THEN you pay VAT on that...

But you're not liable for that if it's a temporary import - which basically consists of informing the local registration authority that you've imported the vehicle temporarily for your personal use. There's a simple little form. And then requesting they extend it, if circumstances change - e.g. telling them if you're going to be there longer than they acknowledged/authorized you for.

You're also not liable for tax/duty even for personal (permanent) import, so long as you don't sell the vehicle within 3 years.

Everyone you'll deal with in officaldom will try to make it sound like the time limit for a "temporary import" is six months. But that's simply not true; if you read the legislation, it all hinges on the definitions of "temporary" and "permanent" - which comes down to intent. There is, in actual fact, NO defined time limit.

In fact, IIRC, a specific example provided in the legislation/guidance notes was that of a student coming over to take a college course and bringing their own vehicle; so right there is an example of a 4 year temporary stay...

But do make sure you are very clear when briefing the folks doing the paperwork for you - in both directions. Or things could get awkward...

The last thing I can think of is making sure it costs the same quantity to ship it back as it did to ship it over. I'd guess that we don't ship as much to Europe as they ship to us so it could be cheaper shipping to Europe.

Last time I shipped the car back, there was a 40% fuel surcharge, which kind of messed up direct comparisons somewhat... But it was pretty comparable, apart from that.

Shipping to a major port makes the biggest difference - both in # of ships available to take the container (so less time hanging around on the dock going nowhere), and pricing being more competitive.

Also, shipping from the East Coast to Europe is a lot cheaper than shipping from the West Coast...

And if you have success I want to know about it!

Yeh, this

[tratza]

I've been thinking about doing this since our last trip to Europe. The rental cost for 3 weeks in Portugal and Spain (for the smallest car I could get through the streets of Toledo Spain) was ridiculous. Same a couple years ago in France for just 2 weeks. We live about 5 hours from the Port of Houston so that part is easy. I'm going to follow this. Please don't tell the wife. She'll start asking her usual 1,000 questions.

[bdisco]

https://jalopnik.com/how-one-suv-fire-destroyed-45-million-in-cars-damaged-1826086012

Definitely get insurance.

[Canada Kev]

And there's this TV news story from a couple days ago about a container ship near Sydney Australia...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8r8a8_GtG0&list=PLn2RjxYNpcaw9Ydx9M0WMhFsOcS6FmO-c

[Bill Douglas]

It sounds like fun having your own car in Europe. Legally 6,000rpm in topgear.

However, if you have been put off, maybe consider buying a car over there. Not a 911 - too expensive, but a used Golf or something (Corolla perhaps). And sell it when you leave. Almost free "rental."

Renting six months from a company will bankrupt you.

[Flojo]

Originally Posted by Bill Douglas

.., but a used Golf or something (Corolla perhaps).

did you ever dream of touring Europe in a Golf or Corolla ?????!!!!

reminds me of...

[QueWhy]

Bremen to the W. Coast was 5 weeks and about $1300. Probably a bit quicker to ATL but you are still looking at ~$3k and well over a month without you car just to get it there and back, I'm not sure where you are planning on registering it but through BMW insurance and a tourist license plate is quite expensive(European delivery, not sure how much they mark it up) .

Other options include renting cars. While you won't be driving an air cooled 911 you can rent some pretty nice cars. I had a 5-series, Z4(x2 one in Germany and one in Spain) C-class, E-Class. I had some econo **** boxes too but mainly for driving around cities. I wouldn't want to drive and park my 911 in Paris or Prague.

How about buying a car there? You could probably buy a car drive it then sell it at a loss for similar expense. Better yet buy something 25yr old and ship it back when you are done. Lots of cool cars that were never available here in the US

[dobryan]

Be careful about buying a car over there and using it (different than immediately exporting it). It is going to be difficult if not impossible to register it there and get tags unless you have dual citizenship in a country in Europe.

[3Ddesigns911]

I bought a car in Germany and we drove it around Europe for a month in 2001. I had friends there who helped me set things up, and it was a bit of a runaround, but we managed. I had to have two sets of temporary license plates because they only lasted 2 weeks each. These had the yellow tags on the right showing the expiration, and for the export I had the red tag license plates. I signed up for the German Auto Club the ADAC and I think the insurance was handled through them, and we used my friends local address.

It was a lot of fun. We camped as much as we could including right in a vineyard in Bordeaux France. Met some friends in Spain, and drove fast on the Autobahn.

Anyway this was a while back so things might have changed since...

Originally Posted by dobryan

Be careful about buying a car over there and using it (different than immediately exporting it). It is going to be difficult if not impossible to register it there and get tags unless you have dual citizenship in a country in Europe.

[flashboarder]

https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/vehicles/cars/buying-a-car-abroad/germany/index_en.htm

[Bill Douglas]

Originally Posted by Flojo

did you ever dream of touring Europe in a Golf or Corolla ?????!!!!

Good point!

However... When I was younger I had the time of my life touring Europe with my beautiful girlfriend Ulrika Loos and driving her mom's GTI Golf.

[proporsche]

Bill, does Ulrika drive nowadays 911 in the US of A?

Ivan

[Bill Douglas]

I haven't seen her for a very long time. She particuarly liked France so I suspect she is there. I thought it would be nice if she googled her name and saw me, but she's the sorta girl that moves on fast LOL

[Pinoy911SC]

I'm in the Military stationed in Germany. I just received my 79SC 3 days ago. I went with Trans Global Logistics door to door from pick up in Sacramento, Cali to drop off at the customs place in Kaiserslautern, Germany. I paid $2500 for all that shipped in a container. No issues with the car but it took TGL over two months to get the car to me.

[Quicksilver]

Found my notes and the the Customs 'specialty' that can give you information on returning the car to the US is called "Exodus". (No clue why.)
If you can talk to the person in charge of Exodus for the port you are going to return to you should be able to get any questions answered.

[DilanYah]

Oh, we seem to be on the same boat as you. My family will be coming to Disney next month. We are driving which will take us about 9 hrs. My car is only a year old so I know it is dependable but my spouse think we need to rent a car. I understand not putting all those miles on our personal vehicle but It will cost a lot to rent a full size car and a lot more if we get rental car insurance. I feel we can just take that money to make sure my vehicle is serviced and drive mine.