JohnJ's 87 924S Rehabilitation

[SilverLined]

Originally Posted by jjeffries

...

... and applied a coat of epoxy primer using a sponge brush applicator
...

Narsty job out of the way!! Well done, too. Seems to be required maintenance on most of these cars.

[jjeffries]

Hello All,

After reading this sobering update from Byron a few weeks back, I was thinking, "She-it ... like the EMT's said, he's only still with us, at least in unmutilated form, because his 968 had this extra brace installed".

Yes, I'm doing this car on a budget, but as the shampoo commercial says, "I'm worth it".



So, I was wondering how much they cost, did some looking and stumbled across one on eBay (not Byron's!). Long story short, I was low on project money, chewed my fingernails for a few days, then hit a quarterly bonus and was able to buy it before someone else did.

Looking at any 924/44/68, you can intuit that it's not exactly Volvo-like, strength wise, what with the C-pillar's not being connected by either a package shelf or rear cowl, and that bloody big bit of glass where other cars have more structure.

It's my first Brey-Krause purchase - I've seen their stuff on other cars - but it's beautifully TiG'd together. The seller packaged it carefully and included all the hardware in a baggie, just as I'd have done.

Ironically, I don't intend on installing harnesses in this car, so the bar won't be used as intended. Rather, it'll just be there to save my a$$ - or at least, mitigate the damage - should I happen to befall a similar fate as poor old Byron ... an increasingly likely eventuality given today's distracted, aggressive and generally cretinous drivers.

John

[jjeffries]

As far as I know - touch wood - replacing the inserts in the front struts, installing my NOS rear shocks and trying to line up and corner balance the car will be my last big (not-so-big, really) mechanical job on the car. Sure, something bad could happen elsewhere, but if so it will be re-work for tasks I've already tackled.

So just now I pulled the front struts, with calipers left resting on the lift but the hubs, rotors, etc coming off with each strut as assemblies. I then separated the hubs from the struts on the bench and will take them to a friend with the right tooling to detension and remove the springs; I'll disassemble them, bring home for clean and repaint, then there'll be a repeat visit for reassembly.

I'm about to ask a question for the more learned among you, so please hang in there with me to the end of this post.

The struts have VW/Audi logos and 944 part numbers stamped; I don't see anything saying BOGE. No worries, just reporting what I found.

This is the secondary P/N, and this one was only present on one of the two strut housings:

Statement of the Obvious: I have the Blue Stripe springs:

Before writing this update I ordered a pair of Boge struts inserts, top strut bushings/bearings (using an inexpensive P/N applicable to an 88 VW Fox, as per research), bump stops and dust covers.

Here's the question:

To affect some lowering of the front ride height, while maintaining the original springs, is it kosher to lower the seats on the strut tubes? I'd need to measure, delicately grind away the factory weld (red arrows in this photo) and re-weld in the new, desired location. Is that something that's done without being frowned upon? Would the net effect be a 1:1 ratio (lower spring seat 0.75" lowers car the same amount)?

I'm not THAT obsessed about lowering this car, but I'd like to, without buying new front springs. I know I've already asked about this once before, and no one likes that guy who keeps asking the same question until he receives the desired answer, so I commit to not presenting this query again!

Thanks for stopping by.
John

[djnolan]

As long as the horizontal centerline is level with the road, otherwise the car will dive or rise when braking. So you would need to drop the rear equally. Here is the rear control arm adjustments:

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by jjeffries

Hello All,

After reading this sobering update from Byron a few weeks back, I was thinking, "She-it ... like the EMT's said, he's only still with us, at least in unmutilated form, because his 968 had this extra brace installed".

Yes, I'm doing this car on a budget, but as the shampoo commercial says, "I'm worth it".



So, I was wondering how much they cost, did some looking and stumbled across one on eBay (not Byron's!). Long story short, I was low on project money, chewed my fingernails for a few days, then hit a quarterly bonus and was able to buy it before someone else did.

Looking at any 924/44/68, you can intuit that it's not exactly Volvo-like, strength wise, what with the C-pillar's not being connected by either a package shelf or rear cowl, and that bloody big bit of glass where other cars have more structure.

It's my first Brey-Krause purchase - I've seen their stuff on other cars - but it's beautifully TiG'd together. The seller packaged it carefully and included all the hardware in a baggie, just as I'd have done.

Ironically, I don't intend on installing harnesses in this car, so the bar won't be used as intended. Rather, it'll just be there to save my a$$ - or at least, mitigate the damage - should I happen to befall a similar fate as poor old Byron ... an increasingly likely eventuality given today's distracted, aggressive and generally cretinous drivers.

John

Good purchase, there are a few pieces from the 968 that will make there way into the 924S.
When my personal economy is back up, and I healed up, could be time to bump her up the que.

[16again2009]

John, can you provide more info about the vw upper strut mounts.

[jjeffries]

16 .... that was something I’ve found in a couple of threads where frequent poster and 944 guru V2 had done the research on this years ago and found that the fitment for an 88 VW Fox is the same as stock Porsche part. They are way cheaper; I’d like to have ordered the Sachs version but they’re on B/O with no release date, so I bought something a tad more generic. I’ll let you know how it works out. Remember that the original 924/early 944 suspension included many VW parts (the 924 was to be sold as a VW), that’s why the front lower control arms, calipers, ignition switch and other parts have VW roots. There are cross-fitment lists out there, 924.org has one, albeit (by now) a tad dated in some instances. I fully geek-out researching such things.

John

[jjeffries]

Byron (do you go by Ron?), I will be looking forward to reading about your 924S, and yes I was psyched to grab that B-K bar.

Here’s to your continued recovery,
John

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by jjeffries

As far as I know - touch wood - replacing the inserts in the front struts, installing my NOS rear shocks and trying to line up and corner balance the car will be my last big (not-so-big, really) mechanical job on the car. Sure, something bad could happen elsewhere, but if so it will be re-work for tasks I've already tackled.

So just now I pulled the front struts, with calipers left resting on the lift but the hubs, rotors, etc coming off with each strut as assemblies. I then separated the hubs from the struts on the bench and will take them to a friend with the right tooling to detension and remove the springs; I'll disassemble them, bring home for clean and repaint, then there'll be a repeat visit for reassembly.

I'm about to ask a question for the more learned among you, so please hang in there with me to the end of this post.

The struts have VW/Audi logos and 944 part numbers stamped; I don't see anything saying BOGE. No worries, just reporting what I found.

This is the secondary P/N, and this one was only present on one of the two strut housings:

Statement of the Obvious: I have the Blue Stripe springs:

Before writing this update I ordered a pair of Boge struts inserts, top strut bushings/bearings (using an inexpensive P/N applicable to an 88 VW Fox, as per research), bump stops and dust covers.

Here's the question:

To affect some lowering of the front ride height, while maintaining the original springs, is it kosher to lower the seats on the strut tubes? I'd need to measure, delicately grind away the factory weld (red arrows in this photo) and re-weld in the new, desired location. Is that something that's done without being frowned upon? Would the net effect be a 1:1 ratio (lower spring seat 0.75" lowers car the same amount)?

I'm not THAT obsessed about lowering this car, but I'd like to, without buying new front springs. I know I've already asked about this once before, and no one likes that guy who keeps asking the same question until he receives the desired answer, so I commit to not presenting this query again!

Thanks for stopping by.
John

Going back to the original 924, the strut where from the VW Super Beetle, engine, Transmission (if you look at early a 924 gear box , you will see a hole for a starter) and brakes are Audi bits.

Byron (do you go by Ron?), I will be looking forward to reading about your 924S, and yes I was psyched to grab that B-K bar.

Here’s to your continued recovery,
John

Thanks, I go by Byron, the 924S has 951S suspension and brakes going on to replace the 951 brakes already on her, but I also already have complete 968 running gear waiting to go in..

[16again2009]

Thanks John. Let us know how they work out.

[jjeffries]

Byron, safe to assume you’ve seen RastaMonsta’s thread about his white 924S with the guts of a 951?

I like the Euro bumpers on yours.

His old two-tone blue 931 was/is gorgeous, too.

John

[jjeffries]

Yesterday I visited pro-master mechanic friend Steve and safely removed the springs from the 924S's MacPherson struts, and looked at the Volvo V70R 6-speed he was servicing and the Alfa Spider he'd purchased a week before - and I got to consult on. One has some experience with the marque.

This morning I wrapped-up in layers (27F here!) and ventured into the garage to take the struts all the way apart. I also got most of the dirty work done, cleaning up the constituent parts for paint.

I was able to remove the gland nuts without any marring. One came easy, the other needed some heat.

And ... lo and behold, someone had been in here before and installed these; they are spent, but recall that this car sat for 11-12 years:

Withe everything apart, tagged and bagged, I set to with mini-grinder and 3/8" belt sander, using my beloved Norton Abrasives mini-flap discs and belts. Oh how much easier this stuff is now compared to when I was young and didn't have air tools or the compressor to push them. Age has some benefits.

BTW, I’ve banished any foolish thoughts of modifying these strut housings. They’re in beautiful shape and I’d be a chowderhead to mess with them.

There's 50+ degree weather forecast for Southern New England mid week, so I will be painting these parts ... and maybe doing some carpet redying, too, at least, enough so I can then put the center console back in.

Ciao,
John

[pfarah]

You're making great progress John. I'm looking forward to another run in the coming weeks (months?)...

[Racerbvd]

I have a pair of powder coated housings available.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-924-944-968-used-parts-sale-wanted/866002-na-powder-coated-strut-housings.html

This is most likely going to end up in my 924S

[mistertate]

The problem with lowering the spring seats is you have to check how far away they are from the tire for clearance first

[jjeffries]

Thanks Mr. Tate. I should have a set of sport springs on the way soon. Yesterday I primed and painted the strut housings using good materials. No modifications.

I appreciate this kind of feedback and knowledge.

John

[jjeffries]

Those of you who were following the weather this week will know that Thursday 3/11 and Friday 3/12 were both beautiful and uncharacteristically sunny, warm days in New England, and I'd happened to have reserved them for vacation time, so Wednesday night I started staging my garage space in order to to capitalize on the anticipated favorable conditions.

(A note here: this benevolent weather ... others wouold have been planning some golf, or a walk in the woods. Maybe a trip down to the coast. Me? My pulse was racing to take advantabe of relative warmth, low humidity and direct sunlight to get some paint/coatings applied.)


First off, I shot the struts housings and the SC's Fuchs center caps* in epoxy primer. For this and the top coat I used my small HF touch-up gun; what a useful little fellow it is for such work.

I'd actually stopped by HF the day before to pick up some paint strainers. I have to say, these stores really are a useful resource; yes, some of the stuff is nasty but a good percentage of it offers real value if you are clear-eyed with your expectations. One product line I hadn't seen before is "good/better/best" in their automotive paint guns. The ones I have are those which are silly cheap, like $25-35, fine for the component refinishing work I do, where the stakes are relatively low. While they still sell those like mine, their new guns are priced at something like $150 for "better" and $300 "best", and of course, you could get those for 20% less with "the coupon". Chances are, they're pretty good, although I'd look for reviews somewhere like garagejournal.com. Good paint is so expensive that if I were about to do a big job I'd not want to take any risks so would likely just go buy a SATA gun. But I will not be painting whole cars and I should aim to do less painting, not more, just from a personal health perspective.

Later Thursday morning I mixed up a cupfull of NASON (formerly DuPont) single stage urethane (8 parts color, 2 parts activator, 1 part hardener) and sprayed the struts housing and those four center caps.

*"Gloss black center caps?", those gathered gasped. Yes. My four caps were three different shades of faded orginal anodizing. So I should have painted them satin black, no? Well, my SC's Fuchs were completely painted when the original owner had some remedial paint and body done in 2010. So the rims are painted silver, the centers black and the whole things gloss-cleared.

They would likely create some curled upper lips from the concours crowd, and some day, I'll strip them and have a professional restore the wheels properly. But in the meantime, only the cognoscenti would know they're "incorrect" and they look fine. And now the center caps match.

best, John

[jjeffries]

The other reason to get moving and take advantage of the unseasonally fine weather was to get at least some of my carpets recolored; this needed to happen so I could get them in the car before I could reinstall the center console, itself removed about a year ago when I pulled the dash.

This car has the "Linen" interior and the carpets were an eyesore when it first came into my possession. This is how they looked then:

I'd worked them over pretty hard (summer 2019) with heavy-duty cleaners, the garden hose and vigorous scubbing, showing little mercy (as I'd learned from a lovely guy by the name of Thinh Van Le, in the reconditioning department at a dealer group I once worked for. Thinh had been a helicopter mechanic in South Vietnam and came to the U.S. as the conflict came to an end; a hard-working and completely honorable man who raised a family here by working his tail off at the same dealership for 35+ years, prepping used cars).

That got them nominally much cleaner, but still badly stained:

Long story short:
I used the same SEM Color Coat product as I'd used on the dash, albeit in a complimentary hue I chose from their stock palette. I bought a natural bristle scrub brush at my local hardware store and, with it and my shop vac, got the carpet pieces ready.

The fear of doing this is that the carpets will lose all their softness and feel like super-glued astroturf, but that is not the case. Yes, this is a coating, not a dye. The process will make the word "opacity" come to mind, because you're more "re-tinting" than changing the color - it would have been different if I were changing the color to black.

When you have a dark stained area, you cannot just lay a whole lot of paint in that one area; doing so will yield the glued-astroturf result. Rather, you just keep misting on light coats; I waited ten minutes between coats and both brushed and vacuumed before adding more. I shot the Color Coat from my big/production-size HF gravity feed HVLP gun; the product does not require thinning; it goes on easily and dries quickly.

The vinyl binding on the carpets and the driver's pedal pad is the color you see in the can ... the color I chose. But - think opacity - that's not the final color of the carpets; it's sinking in and re-tinting the original color of the fibers.

I think this stuff is incredible. A friend of mine who does high-end 911 work used it recently on a couple of vinyl pieces he need to change and was blown away by the results. The specialists who visit car dealerships to touch-up used cars prior to any customers seeing them use it and have the skill to tint tiny batches to match anything they're working on. My goal was never perfection; rather, I was hoping that I could get these stained and abused carpets to look respectable, mabe like those from a well-cared for five year old car.

Yes, we'll see how they wear but at this point I'd say I was successful.

Thanks for checking out this blog.
John

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by jjeffries

Those of you who were following the weather this week will know that Thursday 3/11 and Friday 3/12 were both beautiful and uncharacteristically sunny, warm days in New England, and I'd happened to have reserved them for vacation time, so Wednesday night I started staging my garage space in order to to capitalize on the anticipated favorable conditions.

(A note here: this benevolent weather ... others wouold have been planning some golf, or a walk in the woods. Maybe a trip down to the coast. Me? My pulse was racing to take advantabe of relative warmth, low humidity and direct sunlight to get some paint/coatings applied.)


First off, I shot the struts housings and the SC's Fuchs center caps* in epoxy primer. For this and the top coat I used my small HF touch-up gun; what a useful little fellow it is for such work.

I'd actually stopped by HF the day before to pick up some paint strainers. I have to say, these stores really are a useful resource; yes, some of the stuff is nasty but a good percentage of it offers real value if you are clear-eyed with your expectations. One product line I hadn't seen before is "good/better/best" in their automotive paint guns. The ones I have are those which are silly cheap, like $25-35, fine for the component refinishing work I do, where the stakes are relatively low. While they still sell those like mine, their new guns are priced at something like $150 for "better" and $300 "best", and of course, you could get those for 20% less with "the coupon". Chances are, they're pretty good, although I'd look for reviews somewhere like garagejournal.com. Good paint is so expensive that if I were about to do a big job I'd not want to take any risks so would likely just go buy a SATA gun. But I will not be painting whole cars and I should aim to do less painting, not more, just from a personal health perspective.

Later Thursday morning I mixed up a cupfull of NASON (formerly DuPont) single stage urethane (8 parts color, 2 parts activator, 1 part hardener) and sprayed the struts housing and those four center caps.

*"Gloss black center caps?", those gathered gasped. Yes. My four caps were three different shades of faded orginal anodizing. So I should have painted them satin black, no? Well, my SC's Fuchs were completely painted when the original owner had some remedial paint and body done in 2010. So the rims are painted silver, the centers black and the whole things gloss-cleared.

They would likely create some curled upper lips from the concours crowd, and some day, I'll strip them and have a professional restore the wheels properly. But in the meantime, only the cognoscenti would know they're "incorrect" and they look fine. And now the center caps match.

best, John

Looking good, I actually prefer gloss black Fuchs.

[jjeffries]

One of the 3M StickIt notes on the left rear quarter panel of the red 924S reminded me to repair the captive nuts for the passenger side rear seat track mounts; they came that way with the car, visibly and functionally pre-boogered by the last guy in there. The required 6mm bolts/screws would bind-up, and a thread chaser or even cutting tap would cause the captive nut to spin. This needed to be resolved before I installed the front carpets, itself a task required before I could install the center console. A satisfactory fix was in order.

[Paranthetically, I sure wish Porsche had specified 8mm hardware for the seat mounts instead of the 6mm they chose. I know, never use a bigger fastener than necessary, but all the Alfa's I've been intimate with use an 8 x 1.25mm Allen/cap screw; more durable and confidence inspiring.]

With both inner and outer captive nuts shot, I first cut out the outer one.

I considered drilling-out all the spot welds and taking the entire bracket out but there are 9 or 10 of them (double that for doing the inner bracket, too) and I figured I could do more damage to the floor that way, so using a Dremel wheel on my DuMore grinder, I took out the least amount of metal to reveal the damaged nut.

Here you can see what Porsche (Audi) used, a "nut-sert" in a captive cage, with flats on the base to prevent it from spinning within the cage. You can see how the cage has distorted, likely from someone cross-threading the bolt/screw and leaning on it too hard, with the net result of the captive nut being able to spin.

I then set about creating repair pieces and got as far as the photo below, before admitting that while my plan was sound, my ability to render the required pieces was not. If the required hardware was a few sizes bigger, I could probably have bent the required pieces of steel, but at this level of diminution, I couldn't fabricate the necessary detail.

After a self-enforced piss and lunch break, I queried Uncle Google and found exactly what I need to creat a tidy and approporiate repair available from McMaster. The order has been placed.

I'll follow-up once the new hardware arrives.

As Ringo Starr always reminds us, Peace & Love.

John