968 Front end engine seals

[den91cr]

Hello all. Need suggestions! Just replaced front end engine seals, reassembled and won't start. Got spark, fuel and rev counter bounce. Run out of ideas! Any help much appreciated.

[Jfrahm]

Timing 180 degrees off? Mis-wired?
Plugs wet or dry?
Does it almost start or just crank or ?

[Bulldog9]

Originally Posted by Jfrahm

Timing 180 degrees off? Mis-wired?
Plugs wet or dry?
Does it almost start or just crank or ?

This is where I would start. Double check the ignition wire order and location. If I remember, at TDC, the rotor head will be at about 11oclock, and the lug for CYL 1 at about 1 oclock. Firing order is 1-3-4-2.

[den91cr]

Originally Posted by Bulldog9

This is where I would start. Double check the ignition wire order and location. If I remember, at TDC, the rotor head will be at about 11oclock, and the lug for CYL 1 at about 1 oclock. Firing order is 1-4-3-2.

I've done that! They're all different lengths so can only go to the correct plug. Thought it might be bad fuel...? Car has been sat for about 3 months. Going to try changing it.

[Bulldog9]

Originally Posted by den91cr

I've done that! They're all different lengths so can only go to the correct plug. Thought it might be bad fuel...? Car has been sat for about 3 months. Going to try changing it.

Bad gas could effect running, but unlikely prevent it starting. I add Seafoam when the car is going to sit. It is a great cleaner/lube for the fuel system, but also stabilizes for up to a year. I 'dissapear' for my job for months at a time, sometimes over a year and have never had a problem.

Back on the spark plugs, I know the plug wires are different lengths, but where they connect on the cap can easily be mucked up. Are you sure the plugs are in the right spot on the Distributor cap? I have an S2, so the cap is different, but always good to double check. Does the car catch at all? Or just crank with no sign of ignition?

I bought several 'non running' Saabs back in the day that would not start after work or a tuneup. The car had a counter clockwise firing order. One time I saw a beautiful 85 Turbo sitting in a neighborhood for 6 months. One day I stopped and asked about it, heard the story and bought it for $100. Would be a great car for my son. When I came back with Cash and no trailer (I did have a tow strap in my Jeep) they wondered how I would get it to my house 4 blocks away. I had a hunch, popped the hood, confirmed what I thought, fixed the order of the wires at the cap, started it and drove it home. I was worried I'd get a bullet to the back of the head for a few seconds, the people were pissed. ;-)

I'm sure you'll find it and it will be something simple.

[944 Ecology]

If you replaced the seals, you removed the ignition rotor. It may be reinstalled in the wrong position. Turn the engine to TDC and make sure that the rotor is pointed to #1 spark plug wire.

[Bulldog9]

Originally Posted by 944 Ecology

If you replaced the seals, you removed the ignition rotor. It may be reinstalled in the wrong position. Turn the engine to TDC and make sure that the rotor is pointed to #1 spark plug wire.

I put a mark where the rotor should be before I took it all apart because I was afraid of doing that very thing. Being completely new to the car I don't have the muscle memory of where things should be and what they should look like. I've put in my notes that win the motor is at top dead center the rotor head should be pointing at around the 11:00 and the number one cylinder lug on the distributor is around 1:00.

He very well could have installed the rotor in the wrong position. Hopefully he reports back.

[wwdwgs]

OP,
look for other 968's engines bays' pictures over the WWW and compare ignition wires' locations with yours.

[Monkey Wrench]

if you pull the plugs, put your thumb over plug hole 1 , turn engine until it exhausts out plug hole and continue to turn it until the crank is at top dead center .

if you are confused and cant; see the mark, you can "feel for it" use a drinking straw not a pen or screwdriver something that's going to fall in ot get stuck in there.
also don't drop anything inside there.

you can then feel the piston coming up to TDC and reaachign it's peak , this is TDC

now look at the rotor on your distributor. it needs to be pointing to the lead for cylinder one.

the rest follow 1342 I think when the engine runs the distributor turns CCW but you can verify in case I'm wrong.

TDC itself is not enough info because the engine fires on every second go round of the crank 9 for each cylinder) so there is also TDC after it fires and then begins it's intake stroke so the plug doesnt; fire at "that TDC"but "the other TDC"

Remember intake, compression , power , exhaust. It fires after compression, before power. each is separated by 1/2 turn of the crankshaft, after 2 turns the cycle repeats. and so on.

if the rotor or wires are in the wrong place you'll see it then. If it's correct then move forward.

does it have a spark? if you are sure it does then good. If you question that I;d put a small test lamp across the ( small ) coil wires and crank it look for your lamp blinking, if it blinks or flickers when you are trying to start it proves your coil is getting pulses and that also means engine sensors are reporting to the computer and it's sending the coil pulses. If it fails to be blinking we can delve deeper into why.

If you suspect a fuel delivery issue , try spraying some quick start into your intake , If it has a spark and it has compression it should fire up a little at least until your fuel - the quickstart vanishes.

you can check fuel flow if it wont start. I agree 6 month old fuel is not going to cause a no start.

my van was running crappy recently especially cold , i put a bottle of sea foam in the fuel it ran better with it in there , when I tanked up again it seemed less well but I think it need's a real tuneup..
what Ive been doing is buying fuel stabilizer, I fill a Gerry can, add the fuel stabilizer, shake it up, put a gallon or so in each of my cars. I have 5 junkers so I can;t drive them all.. at leas that way they each get a little and it's mixed with fuel when I pour it in. if a car sits a couple of years orif it's sat 6 months and you are concerned, just siphon the fuel into a gerry can and burn it in whatever you are driving then you can replenish.

I always buy high grade chevron or higher grade esso, the chevron 94 fuel is the only one without alcohol all the rest has alcohol in it or some additive.

I have heard the better fuel stores better and I have a habit of suddenly pulling one car off the road and putting another in use as things cause havoc so I never know when that will be.

I think its best to actually pull the injectors and flush them but that's more work than adding a bottle of stuff and hoping. I don't know if adding it to the fuel actually cleans them well, its hard to tell. the intent is that it works.

if the car wont start. it's lacking compression, fuel or spark, once we know which problem it is we can go forward.

if the ignition coil has a pulse then it likely has a spark but you can verify that by holding a plug to ground and observing the spark. I just find that taking a test lamp and putting that across the coil is easier as you can see if your lamp flashes, turning the key while holding a spark plug to ground all by yourself is hard, unless you have a helper. another way if you ahve a stoboscopic timing light is to tape down the trigger button then you can see it flash from the drivers seat.

if no coil pulse or no spark it can be engine sensors bad grounds or other things. I think jumping straight to checking if the coil has a pulse verifies they are working , if not then you can delve into the specifics of why you have no spark.

you can jump the fuel pump to force it to run and measure fuel delivery rate if you suspect you are not getting fuel. careful it pumps lots of fuel fast so dont overfill your container thinking it is a trickle.

you can optionally remove the fuel rail and put the injectors on clean rags and give it a crank, you may have to reconnect some ground wires or similar.. If you want to pull the fuel rail get some new O rings first and you might want the injector end caps, The" pintles" and other little washers , they are cheap.

You should see about even fuel from each injector that will wet your rags but be very careful this is also an easy way to start a great big and hard to extinguish fire, have a gasoline fire rated extinguisher ready and don't go making sparks near open fuel, ever!

after you try to start just for a quick moment run around and you should be able to see they all stopped spurting fuel. if an injector gets stuck it wont shut off and in this case it can spurt a bunch of fuel after each shutdown and produce a bunch of white smoke upon startup. If an injector fails stuck closed then it wont make a wet spot on your rag and that means its been trying to run on 3 cylinders.

a lot of this isn't recommended procedure, no one wants to recommend you go spraying raw gas around because you know it could cause a really bad fire so you will likely not see it in any written shop procedure.

The above is what I'd do personally. if you like and want to look in the clark's garage notes he has written some fairly specific and very valid procedures for checks in a no start condition.

Clark's might be good to reference before you start . you can follow that if your prefer.

also look for any open hose causing an air leak like the previous poster found, a broken hose might cause a no start by upsetting the air fuel mix to such a degree that it won't even start.

careful about the timing belt, if it is old replace, you dont want it to break and cause the valves and pistons to collide. if you have plug wires and things like that confused you could get a backfire, if the engine backfires that may add a bunch of unusual stress , to the timing belt. If you do crash the engine it's expensive to fix so be careful.

if you put new plug wires and they arent; OEM suspect them, sometimes they dont work.. maybe they short to ground or have some fault ot maybe not the right resistance, osmetimes the connectors pull offf and you cant' see that they are detached inside the boot that shrouds the connector, or similar things. I recently looke ddown inside one and found the little cap thing that normally screws onto a plug but the plug had them permanently attached.. so it could nto push on properly until I dug that thing out of the end of the cable. look inside the distributor cap, sometimes I see that water got inthere somehow, the wire was replaced but it wasn't noticed that it was all green inside the cap where the connector pushes in there. if you swap plug wires , and it wont start put the old ones back and try.

I found my volvo 240 failed to start, it was the little nuts the could wires connect to , the little studs got all rusty just needed to be cleaned, It took a while for me to figure out that's why it had no spark. my test lamp showed the coil was getting it's pulse, but the power wasn't getting into the coil itself because of rusted connectors. it was a Bosche coil , the little studs are iron not brass or copper. I put a dab of electrical dielectric grease on them to prevent a recurrence.

at one point I figured thet copper antisieze compound was condutve. I stuck my meter int little puddle of it and found that' snot so its not conductive, like normal grease. the dielectric grease is not in itself conductive , it just prevents the clean contacts from becoming corroded so fast. Ive been using a tiny dab when I clean grounds and things like that.

if those little studs on your coil look dirty and rusty take a wire brush and scrub them up so they shine. if you clean battery posts, wires , grounds etc , it helps not have as many issues to chase to begin with. If you let the wiring become old and dirty you can have more issues.

what I do is unhook my battery, remove it put it on to charge. mix a jar of baking soda and water. wet a clean rag and fold it up , et dry and let the cables sit in my jar of stuff. they will bubble and clean. then I put my dried and impregniated rag under the battery and remount, that saves the battery compartment from becoming rusted due to its presence of acid. if any acid leaves the battery, the baking soda is there to neutralize it. you can brush your teeth with baking soda, its not hazardous. If I neglect to do this, I move a battery and two days later notice my jeans are falling apart because I got some acid on me.