Ahmet, how did you do this weekend?

[redNeckarsulm2]

So?

[1.2gees]

I knew I could do a heck of a lot better once I started sorting the car out!

(This thursday, I'm going to be taking some of the engine apart, changing seals +downgrading stuff to be honest, and in stock class). After that, allowed safety mods are going to be in considiration. Such as roll cage, harnesses, and a better steering wheel. (all these I can bolt onto my next front engined Porsche, so no prob). And following that, I'll consider buying sway bars (that I can also swap), and shocks (that I can't swap), etc.

I had 3rd place last time I checked (after everybody's 3rd run) in C-stock. Out of 7 people. I'm very happy though, cause out of the 7, excluding me 5 of them have been doing this for 6+ years, one of which had won nationals last year, the other got 4th place. I'm behind the top runner by about .7 secs. I was also on street tires, and there's still the subframe I have to replace, as well as bushings. (should start on that this thursday as well). Oh, I didn't walk to course either! Literally got there less than 5 min. before the first car was off!!!

I'll let the pics do the talking! Enjoy:





All three of us were moving, FAST. If you consider that, this is a pretty incredible shot!!!

Close to the cone (at the chicago box), and at full throttle.





Is it touching yet?



--Continued--

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It's all the driver...

[1.2gees]

--Continued--

And now the times:

Boxter


Pontiac Firebird (with the vette engine)


300zx Twin Turbo (lowered in the front)


And mine (84 944 NA, factory sport susp.)


Oh, thanks for asking. I have more pics, but not enough time to sort them. Hope you liked'em too.
Ahmet

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It's all the driver...

[RaF944]

Wow Nice job Ahmet! I wonder what you could pull in a 951

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85.5 Porsche 944

[p0r2chby]

Great run..

question.. why do you run with the top open, don't you get a lot of air from that... even with the deflector up...

[wolfrpi]

Good work Ahmet looks like you ran excellent times - get some springs, shocks and anti-roll bars though man - you don't want to rumple that fine 944 on the tarmac!

BTW you run without a roof autocrossing because you move weight away from the top of the car and lose that weight completely and so your helmit can actually fit on your head! The nice breeze is a side benefit...

Erick

[Porsche 951 Fanatic]

but wouldnt you also create more drag.... on my nissan if i had the t tops off when i was going down the highway it would be way slower.... when they were on it would move.... it had deflectors too....

[p0r2chby]

Ok, if you pull the top to reduce weight, wouldn't it be better to loose the passenger?

[wolfrpi]

oh man....

[Z-man]

Porsche951 fanatic:
Loosing a sunroof does create a little more drag, but the benefits of weight reduction, especially from up high on the car outweigh (no pun inteneded) the aerodynamic loss.
Without a sunroof in place, the center of weight is lowered, which equates to a little better handling. (A little here, a little there makes a world of a difference in autox) Also: ttop removed probably create more turbulance and a sunroof removed.

And for tall people, it does effect helmet clearance.

Amet: nice runs, great pictures! If you stiffen up your suspension a bit, you'll see some great improvements! I am jealous: autox season doesn't really start here (North East: NJ) until April...

[Kaos]

Leaving the sunroof in place would help the torsional rigidity of the chassis. I haven't tried running before and after sunroof, but I will experiment in the upcoming Auto-X season (not for another two months here in Michigan).


Kaos 1985/2

[Obin Robinson]

good job!!!!!

what spring rate springs do you have on your car? and what shocks are you using?

keep up the good work. offhand do you have any 914, 911, or 924 autocross times for that course?

obin

[1.2gees]

I leave the sunroof in the car, it's not something I really worry about. Trust me with the car not having had an alignment since last year, with shot bushings in the front, 10lbs from the roof, etc. don't bother me at all.

Helmet room? Not for me, I sit forward enough (when racing), that the helmet hits the sunvisor, with the visors down, I don't have much of a clearance problem. Heck I was at about 28psi per tire, as I found out after the darn thing, at a gas station.

I'll be better prepared for the next auto-x, and the car'll be totally legal by then. I'm planning to get a high flow cat, and a straight through muffler.

The sunroof being in place will NOT make a differance in chasis stiffness. It's not a load bearing part of the chasis anyway. (Fiberglass man!). But I can see it increasing drag. After I fix my AC, it may stay in place. One benefit to it though could be that you can hear the tires a little better, which's always a +. But then again don't the side windows do that? This is totally personal, I'm not concerned with it, doesn't bother me enough to take it off, but perhaps next time I'll take it out of the car. I had nearly a full tank of gas, spare/tools, cd changer, etc. in the car. I have 3 weeks until the next event, if everything goes well, and the car's really sorted, then I'll do everything to help my times.

Wolfpri, thanks. BTW, I'm not likely to put more money in this car, on anything BUT what I can swap. MAYBE shocks in the rear. I'm running (I believe) bilstein shocks, on factory sport springs in the front, stock rear with sport KYBs. The car also has the sport sway bar in the front, ditto for the rear.

I don't run with a passanger at all runs, since I hadn't walked the course, I needed somebody to point me which way to go on my first run!

I had 350lbs springs on the car, and the car was competitive, however with the 17 inch rims it didn't feel as agile as it does now, but definately sharper. Maybe it was a mistake, but since I decided this car to be a real dual purpose car, I got rid of the rims, springs, etc. I'm running stock class, that's the main goal.

Obin, my front springs are "factory sport" (which should be about 175 lbs/inch)according to parts heaven, and the whole strut assy. looks different than what I pulled out, but it really doesn't feel that way. Shocks are what I believe to be bilsteins, but as you know the early strut housing covers all of the strut's body, so I can't tell. What ever these shocks are, they're not incredibly good! As you might've guessed, I've been restoring/downgrading this car back to near stock for a while now. I believe driver makes the differance +I want to be honest, and see what I can do against these guys. The only non-legal (for the class) item on my car should be the clutch by next week. Then come the alignment, new subframe, etc. etc. etc. This reply is very long already, I'll get into that stuff sometime later.

I was the only 944 there, umm to give you an idea, the fastest time of day was recorded by a ligtweight 73 RS replica, with a 3.6 liter engine in it, in A-mod class. That time was 44.7 secs. Official results will be out soon, but 5 secs off an A-mod car, driven by last years canadian champion is not bad for a 944 with all these problems on street tires, AT ALL.

The club president turned in a best time of 47.5, in a modified vette on slicks.

I'm feeling good about this, but as I mentioned, if everything goes the way it should, I'd expect to do a good bit better at the next event.

Thanks again for all the favorable comments.

If anybody has questions/comments, or suggestions, I welcome them.

PS: Haven't forgotten about mpegs!
Ahmet

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It's all the driver...

[AMCPorsche924Powerhaus!]

Aerodynamics aren't important at lower speeds, and plus, it will help your braking, so you loose and gain.
Autocross your never going in a straight line long enough to need aerodynamics to make a big dif anyhow.

[AMCPorsche924Powerhaus!]

i would also say that removing weight is a lot better than worrying about the aerodynamics, but, Ahmet do your tires spin too much?
maybe the extra weight in the back with your tools etc help, depends how much spin ya get.
If spin isn't a problem then weight i would say is really important since you might be dealing in milliseconds to win, but if you remove too much weight from one side cars obviously not going to handle as great, so even it out and pick the places which you want less weight (front and driver side most likely, since the driver is extra weight lopsiding the car)

[This message has been edited by AMCPorsche924Powerhaus! (edited 03-13-2001).]

[1.2gees]

I hit about 65mph in that auto-x... They may not be SO important, but it still makes a differance, every little bit counts? I think I'll keep taking it off, but I'll LEAVE it outside the car, instead of in the hatch like I normally do at the next event

Want more pics? Let me share somethings while I'm at it.

Here's a nice little oversteering drift, not too violent, still fast, and fun!

A little bit more fun?
(That's the timing equipment, where the green bucket is, normally a throttle oversteering slide would be slow, but it's the FASTER way to go through a very tight turn, when you don't have to accelerate afterwards. You go through the turn in a smaller amount of time, although you won't be going AS FAST at the exit.)

Leaning hard, AGAIN!

Nice shot?

PS: Trying to tell you, I'm not worried about saving 5lbs, or 10lbs. Heck I lost over 25lbs from this time last year, when I started mountain biking again! I had a nearly full tank of gas, about 28psi in each tire when they were HOT , all sorts of other things in the car that I didn't remove. Even the roof was in the hatch (but off the roof)! I auto-x my car exactly with the set-up I drive it on the street.

But now I'm with the big boys that may change, as they even shave before a run, and not eat anything for 20 days!
Ahmet

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It's all the driver...

[AMCPorsche924Powerhaus!]

Ahmet yah it may be easier just to lose wieght yourself instead of screwing with little things.
Im just saying maybe a full tank of gas is good?
maybe you need the traction?

If your not worried about weight then i would move the weight around to different places in the car, like if you take the sunroof out put it somewhere to balance the car better like on the passenger side, although maybe the Porsche factory has already balanced the car in thought of a driver being on the left side i don't know.
But if you lose lots of little bits of weight you could seriously save some big time, do you have the back seat out? thats like 50 pounds or something, and the passenger seat is like 30 or 40 maybe, now that is easier then yourself losing weight with a diet!
Once you (your own body) gets light enough that you can't lose anymore wieght then start takin little things off the car i guess


[This message has been edited by AMCPorsche924Powerhaus! (edited 03-13-2001).]

[Goku]

Hey 1.2, whats that sticker on your window. I can't really make it out.

[drew1]

Liked the pictures, especially the ones comparing your time with others.

drew1

[1.2gees]

It says "Krynock" on the sticker. (ask Carter!)

I may be going to another auto-x at VMP too, just next week!!!
Ahmet



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It's all the driver...