Things to look for when buying a 944?

[soup]

I'm new here and to the Porsche world (VW guy for 10 years).


I'm looking to pick up a 944 soon. Just wondering what some difficult and expensive to fix quirks they have.


Thanks for your help,
- Jim

[Techno Duck]

The biggest quirk is the engine. Go figure. The timing belt and waterpump are a big thing with these cars. Make sure they have been changed recently (40k miles) or you will need to do it soon. Count on $600 for parts, including all the belts, new pump, all the rollers and the front end seals. A blown belt will crush valves.

Another is the clutch. Very expensive and labor intensive to change.

Those are really the big things, other than that its like any other car that is probably around 15 years old if not more.

Other things to be aware about are the changes in the models. '83-85 are considered the early model cars with the really 80's esque interior. 1985.5 on have a more modern looking dash. In 1987 and on cars the offset was changed (mostly to accomdate ABS on cars that had it). This means suspension and wheels are not interchangeable (of course not without spacers) between cars from '83-86 and '87+. Also in '88 the compression was raised and power output was bumped up, this happened again in '89.

There are also a number of models available, you have the regular 944 which has an 8v SOHC n/a engine, puts out about 143hp and the later models with higher comrpession around 160hp. The 944S was available from '87-88 and put out about 188hp still with 2.5L of displacement from a DOHC 16v engine. The S2 was available from '89 through '91 (i think) and was a 3.0L 16v DOHC motor which put out about 210hp.

Then you have the 944 Turbo. 2.5L SOHC 8v motor, put out about 220hp. Available from '86-89. The '86 models were the only ones which were early offset. In '88 the Turbo S was an option, this car put out about 250hp and had a ton of other options like suspension, different brakes and a LSD standard. In '89 the Turbo S became the standard Turbo, however i dont think LSD or the sport suspension, or brakes were standard. It just shared the same amount of power.

[seaboltman]

If you have access to a compression gauge, its probably a good idea to get some numbers, it'll give you a decent idea of what kind of condition the internals of the engine are in and you will know if you want to proceed with it or not. Other than that just take it to a mechanic that does Porsches and or 944s and they will know what too look for and most of the time give you an honest no BS answer on the condition of the car. If your looking to pick up a 944, my best recommendation is wait. Wait around for the car that fits you the best. Asses the situation and understand what your getting into. Parts are expensive and rare so if you rush into it you might get stuck with a car with a hefty bill to get it onto the road. Take your time, request reciepts, demand answers and go after what you want. It will come around eventually.

[Razorback1980]

All "new" parts for these cars seem to cost more...or I'm real cheap....probably a little of both! Good news is that if you can order them from places like Pelican here, you save some cash and parts are getting less expensive than they used to be. Regular maintenance is important especially the timing belts. Most people on this forum usually change them every 30 to 35 thousand miles. They have their characteristics like every other car and parts availability isn't as good as many other cars as these are unique. I don't seem to be able to drop in on my local auto parts store and pick up what I need on a routine basis, so I keep some extra parts in my garage that tend to cause problems. One such example is DME relays...keep one in the glove box or you may find yourself walking one day. If you know that (and the people here will help you figure out what you need)... and prepare properly, this will be an automobile you will have and enjoy for many years to come. These cars are less expensive to maintain if you can do your own mechanic work and if not, make sure you find a garage that knows how to work on Porsches. Many people (including myself until I learned better) think that because they could work on many of the American cars, that fixing these will be a snap. Not so...I turn to many of the kind people here often to learn how to fix mine and I learned from the school of hard knocks that not just any garage can work on them either. Once you learn all the differences, you'll be fine but there are things to learn. ie. Power steering fluid in the power steering on a Porsche? Seems logical, but it's not a good idea....use Dexron transmission fluid only. It's little things like that...but you'll pick them up with a little "light" reading. They sure are fun and addictive cars though. Key is do the routine maintenance. If you don't want to do that, then look for another car. But if you keep the timing belts and water pumps changed, the drive train seems to be real reliable. I have 287,000 miles on my 86 and I still drive it almost every weekend....and life would be sad without it. I would say that keeping interiors looking new is probably been my biggest SINGLE expense. I'm looking to rebuild the interior in my 87 and I'm budgeting 2500 and I don't think that is quite enough. But I like mine looking as close to new as possible. If you don't need that, then the costs will be less. Engineering in this car is second to none. All components are carefully constructed to make maintenance as easy as possible. There are no fuse links embedded in the wiring that blow and you can't seem to find like on American cars. All in all, you can't beat em.

[soup]

Thanks very much guys. I appreciate the help.

I think I have a good mechanic and I'll be able to keep up on the maintenance.

New timing belt every 30-35K, though? Damn, I hope that's not a $800 job. Probably is though, right?

As a comparison, I started my car search looking for a VW Corrado. Believe it or not, its easier finding a good 924/944. In the end, I guess people took better care of their Porsches.

Thanks again,
- Jim

[Techno Duck]

VW Corrado's are pretty rare to see in my experience. I see maybe one or two a month in my area as opposed to maybe 4-5 944's. VR6 Corrado's are pretty sick little cars, a good friend had one which he sold for a WRX. But that thing was very very fast and handled pretty well to boot.

The timing belt job cost will vary. You only need to change the waterpump and rollers every two belt changes (that is if its not making any funny noises or has excess play in the bearing). So figure on $600 in parts for the first one, then maybe $50 on the next one. Time to change the waterpump and belt will probably be 6-8 hours depending how experienced the person doing the work is. Just changing the belt will probably be 3-4 hours. Maybe less. It took me 8 hours to do the waterpump the first time around with my car. I recently changed just the belts for a friend in 3.5 hours, that was my 4th time doing it.

[bryanthompson]

Look for a car that has complete maintainence records, if you can.

[pkt1213]

Records record records. I think mine had almost every recipt since it was bought. The original owners record book was full too. I did have to get the timing blet changed right after and a few other things fixed and that was $1000. Mainly it was the timing belt. Porsche quoted me $1900. I got my car for cheep though and expected to do this and fix my interior.

[cashflyer]

I, too, have been looking at the 944s.

Somebody told me that I should steer clear of pre-1986 944s. Does anyone here have an explaination as to why?

Thanks.

[pkt1213]

I have look at a lot of 944's over the years and I have an early 85 and love it. They did make some changed on the '85/2 a later that people find more desirible. Blade fuses insted of pill fuses. Kinda one of those hand things. Dash change and window switches and stuff but it's almost the exact same car.

[Paul Glasson]

Can't remember, but AF Juvat or Socal posted a useful check list for buying a used 944-They are the 944 GURUs here so do a search.

[Dave L]

Originally posted by cashflyer


Somebody told me that I should steer clear of pre-1986 944s. Does anyone here have an explaination as to why?

The aesthetics of the pre 1985.5 cars are different to the later cars. The dash on the newer cars is different and looks a little more modern. Although the Mazda 3, matrix and a few others I have seen are moving back to individual pods for the gages.

See both, decide which you prefer.

[livewirevoodoo]

Originally posted by cashflyer
Somebody told me that I should steer clear of pre-1986 944s. Does anyone here have an explaination as to why?

As noted, mostly superficial differences.

Electrical wiring is different.
Wheel offset
Nominal HP upgrades by model year
Control arms
Larger fuel tank post 1985
ABS (1987+)
Airbag (1988+)


Early vs. Late models have a bunch of parts that are different, though the prices are relatively consistent and most everything is still available.

No reason to steer clear of pre '86s... Mostly comes down to asthetic preferences.

[pkt1213]

I'm suprised no one has refrenced you to here I ment to in my last post.
http://www.connactivity.com/~kgross/FAQ/944faq05.html

There's tons of stuff there for a first timer. Actualy a lot for more experianced too. Good luck with you 944.

[Razorback1980]

I hadn't seen that but there was some good information in there. Especially on the oil seals for my 87. I'm ordering them now and going to change them as soon as I get them even though they aren't currently leaking. It's the ounce of prevention/pound of cure thing.

[pkt1213]

Esp with the price of parts.

When I got mine I printed out all those pages and they're in a binder w/ my service manuals. There is website w/ all the 944 service manuals in .pdf format. That's all printed out along with most of the stuff from here.
http://members.rennlist.com/944sandmore/
Good info too.

[toolboy62]

My fiancee has a Corrado G60, given the choice between the two cars I would definitely take the 944. The 'rado is probably a little tiny bit faster in a straight line, but you won't save much on maintenance - sure a TB is easier but a 'rado has a way of breaking unique parts and also plan on rebuilding the G-lader every 80K miles or so. Plus I prefer the greater torque off the line of the 944 (although her car does have a Neuspeed cam in it so that doesn't help) the rear wheel drive and the better shifter (the VW cable shifter is a POS. I was just driving the 'rado the other night and I simply cannot find third gear in it on the first try - it keeps trying to go into fifth, which sucks in city traffic.)

Don't get me wrong, the 'rado is a great car, but I don't think you'd save any money by getting one over a 944, and IMHO the 944 is a little bit more pleasant to drive.

nate

[Porsche-O-Phile]

If your impression of the P.O. is that he/she is an idiot, run.