993RS uprights on 964

[Cobalt]

Thanks Pete, I couldn't get through yesterday but ISAIAS hit us pretty hard here and most everyone is out of power.

[bighead]

Originally Posted by spyerx

Yes. ERP and tarret sell full tie rod kits.

The ONLY reason to use the 993 longs is if you want your front end pushed out 10mm per side. It’s possible if you have aggressive wheel fitment this causes issues.

You can see my thread on rennlist (search my user name there and look for 964 thread) with lots of details.

But, to keep it simple i would use the ERP monoball inner and ERP bump steer outer with the bump correction. Order the spec for the setup you have. Ira at tarret sells and will make sure you get the right parts.

The main issue is the stock rods are too long due to the steering linkage placement

So I was looking at your 964 build thread on Rennlist, and I wanted to know if looking back you wish that you had gotten different parts for your suspension or done anything different? I am getting ready to order parts and wanted to learn from your mistakes if any before I pull the trigger. Thanks!

[Peteinjp]

I've been thinking about this and offsets etc. using the 993rs carriers must narrow the track width. That is the only way to explain the inability to get -3* camber when it is totally possible on the stock uprights and stock top mounts. Then the 993 longs give it back- but no one has determined how much the uprights actually narrow the track. It may be almost a +- 0 with the combo of the 2.

That said I'm on the fence- grind or 993 longs. On reason is that I want to go with rennline sealed bearing camber plates that also have a shield the keeps water etc from coming though the adjustment slots. Those probably won't give any more camber even if you grind the sheet metal.

If you cont need 3* then its a no brainer.

Pete

[Cobalt]

I recently swapped out my uprights to the RS on my track car and there appears to be no difference in track width.

[Peteinjp]

Then how do we explain many not being able to get enough camber with them on NB cars?

[Cobalt]

Camber shouldn't be impacted by which settings are used. I have no issue achieving the camber I want with them. The hats on the other hand require some modification of the top mount if you are using the ERP/Tarett or whoever makes it design. I am assuming this must be what you are having issues with.

[bighead]

Originally Posted by Cobalt

Camber shouldn't be impacted by which settings are used. I have no issue achieving the camber I want with them. The hats on the other hand require some modification of the top mount if you are using the ERP/Tarett or whoever makes it design. I am assuming this must be what you are having issues with.

So is one specific camber plate better than the others when you are putting RS uprights on a NB 964?

Elephant Racing, ERP/Tarrett, Rennline, etc.

[Peteinjp]

There are many accounts of only being able to get 1.5* after installation of the 993rs units. The top camber plates Spyerx used (that he linked above ) will give enough adjustment if you grind the body a bit to get the full range if adjustment. It seems that it comes down to either a bit of grinding or 993 longs.

Pete

[Cobalt]

Pete good point. I didn't take into consideration I am using 993 longs on my wide body 964 so this accounts for it being a non issue for me. Sometimes I have to go back and re read a thread I think I am suffering from onset Alzheimer's or just old age.

bighead. The Tarrett units are basically a copy of the factory 993rs units https://msroadrace.com/Porsche-993-Front-Camber-Plates-99334301780-99334301880-99334308180-99334308280 help a little with caster as well as camber. They rotate around a single point with 2 adjustment screws vs sliding in and out on 4 bolts as the other designs do. The downside as noted is if you want a lot of camber you will need to grind the towers or go with the 993 longs as Pete said.

[bighead]

Originally Posted by Cobalt

Pete good point. I didn't take into consideration I am using 993 longs on my wide body 964 so this accounts for it being a non issue for me. Sometimes I have to go back and re read a thread I think I am suffering from onset Alzheimer's or just old age.

bighead. The Tarrett units are basically a copy of the factory 993rs units https://msroadrace.com/Porsche-993-Front-Camber-Plates-99334301780-99334301880-99334308180-99334308280 help a little with caster as well as camber. They rotate around a single point with 2 adjustment screws vs sliding in and out on 4 bolts as the other designs do. The downside as noted is if you want a lot of camber you will need to grind the towers or go with the 993 longs as Pete said.

Thanks for the reply!

[Peteinjp]

Just want to point out- and I'm not sure why but Spyerx's ERP plates have a TON more adjustment than the ones that cobalt linked


stolen from Spyerx's thread (hope that's ok...):



vs Cobalts linked:



and just for contrast a more standard camber plate from rennline(what I'm leaning toward):

[Cobalt]

The ones I linked to are the factory 993 plates. The Tarrett plates offer more adjustment. I was just using those as a comparison to the design which was originally done by Porsche and copied. Although tarrett doesn't make these there is a company overseas that makes these and distributes to multiple suppliers as are many of these products.

[bighead]

Originally Posted by Peteinjp

Just want to point out- and I'm not sure why but Spyerx's ERP plates have a TON more adjustment than the ones that cobalt linked


stolen from Spyerx's thread (hope that's ok...):



vs Cobalts linked:



and just for contrast a more standard camber plate from rennline(what I'm leaning toward):

Peteinjp,
What has you leaning towards the Rennline camber plates vs all the others?

[Peteinjp]

The are sealed and have a plate sandwiched in them that keeps dust and water from coming though the adjustment slots.

[perelet]

i did front end change some years ago, i had thread here, but after pp got sold there were some issues with pics on forums. i was able to use pretty much factory parts. I saved that thread here:

random notes on 964/993 suspension

[nickd]

Just seeing this thread- the Ground Control camber plates avoid all of the issues with the RS copies. More range of camber, added caster range, more strut compression, and no need to grind off structural metal. No affiliation, just a fan of the design-
https://groundcontrolstore.com/collections/964/products/porsche-964-camber-caster-plates-a

[Cobalt]

^^ $500. Look nice but only made for 2.25 or 60mm springs. I am running 2.25 but seems unnecessary at this time.

[Kraftday]

The MODE mounts are billet aluminum reproductions of the original Porsche Motorsport parts because the original cast housings and bearing intergity was lacking. They have been in production unchanged and supplied since the 90s by Bob Homcombe of Motorsport Design here in Scottsdale, Arizona USA. As a former machinist here and working from the same building, EP-West is here to keep the production orders alive.

These productions were also supplied to other companies to later produced elseware. We are still glad to provide certain damper manufacturers with machine production and mounts.

964 and 993 are virtually identical and interchangeable with the 964 front plates offset further inwards.

Commonly asked is how much adjustment do the mounts offer. This is dynamic progressively based on ride height and other configurations. Seldom is ir necessary to modify the turret mounts for more adjustment. Also common is the ask about sealed bearings. The original feature factory bearing rubber boots were omitted, simply because they are not necessary with the F1 qality bearings used today. Servicing the bearings is extreemly uncommon. When they have been sent in for service, usually we get non Mode parts or old parts that have been used on 6 cars with wrong hardware.

The busings and spring hardware is also variable depending on the damper manufacturers.







964 MCS 1 Way with MODE mounts.


993 Below



These are for 993 rear anti-swaybar mounting.

[Cobalt]

I am not familiar with mode products but thanks for posting.

For reference here is a picture of a factory plate. I was working on a factory 993 RSR 3.8 last week and took some pictures. This is original and signed off by the factory one of 2 that was not campaigned in the US.

[Kraftday]

Originally Posted by Cobalt

I am not familiar with mode products but thanks for posting.

For reference here is a picture of a factory plate. I was working on a factory 993 RSR 3.8 last week and took some pictures. This is original and signed off by the factory one of 2 that was not campaigned in the US.

Good one Anthony. It's neat how they use the exhaust barrel nut for the aluminum hood strut prop on that plate stud. Those original PM mounts are cast aluminium prone to fracture at the base. These were life cycle type parts so not uncommon they needed more spares.

The original engineering is tops and there to template from.

Few more 964 993 parts photos frome the bench..
From the 993 factory manual as most looking to go RS vs RSR






For a time the 993 RS wheel carriers were out of stock. We used some BBi reproductions that are super trick. Porsche seemed to take notice as there is new stock..the newer castings are nicer but double the cost!



993 RSR Rear Link.. magnesium with uniball