Super Charge Downside?

[CMeSpeed]

Greetings,
I am considering adding a TPC super charger and intercooler to my 993. This is an expensive proposition for sure at $11,000, so your valued advice is sought. TPC does claim an increase of 150HP as a bolt on mod.

Are there any downsides I should consider? Will gas mileage or smog certification be effected?

I’d appreciate your input.
James

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by CMeSpeed

Greetings,
I am considering adding a TPC super charger and intercooler to my 993. This is an expensive proposition for sure at $11,000, so your valued advice is sought. TPC does claim an increase of 150HP as a bolt on mod.

Are there any downsides I should consider? Will gas mileage or smog certification be effected?

I’d appreciate your input.
James

it's going to put more heat into the motor, so you will want to improve oil cooling capacity, I've seem them pop the s/c intake off during spins on track, apparently the motor is forced to run backward pressurizing the intake, it's not really a big deal as I've seen the same happen to 964s.

more heat means more frequent rebuilds, a friend w/ one on his 993 found that out the hard way last summer.

for street use most of the above don't count for much

[saxen]

nice 94/95 mr2-

[CMeSpeed]

Hello Bill,

Thanks for your sage reply. You are always there to lend a hand.

I don’t intend to track this car anymore, so if I read your message correctly, I won’t need to worry about the heat issues you point out.

All I’m trying to do is get more horsepower for the street without worrying about decreasing the engine’s life or hurting it.

Thanks again,

[BimmerDob]

Have you checked out rennlist?

There are a couple of SC 993's, one in Finland, that have extensive write ups on them. And a TPC set for a 993 just changed hands and is part of another rennlister's project underway.

Great to read / watch from the peanut gallery.

[Nine9six]

Originally Posted by CMeSpeed

Hello Bill,

All I’m trying to do is get more horsepower for the street without worrying about decreasing the engine’s life or hurting it.

Thanks again,

I think you're hearing what you want to hear in this case...

As Bill has pointed out and as physics dictate, you cannot add 150 hp to a motor, and not expect higher heat and stress to the motor and running gear.

While it may not grenade the motor; most certainly, both of these factors dictate increased frequency of maintenence (decreased engine and clutch life).

(Physics 101)

[James Brown]

sounds like you need a nice 993tt there going for cheap now

[porterdog]

I added a 130hp turbo to a Miata once (no, really- from ~100 rwhp to ~230) and while the overall package was amazingly reliable (I put over 100k miles on that setup) it was still a mixed blessing.

First, you have to be willing to deal with a non-factory installation. There's tons of extra stuff to keep track of/keep an eye on. Non factory fittings, hardware, bracketry, etc... No slam at all on TPC, but they're not Porsche AG and you'll be wanting to pay attention to all the new stuff.

Second, you'll be departing significantly from the factory's 'balance'. This is only an issue if you don't really consider it ahead of time and find you're not as pleased as you'd hoped. In my example, the stock Miata was very forgiving- a lovely dance partner. There was always more chassis than motor, and you really could treat the throttle as a binary switch. With the higher power output one needed to be significantly more judicious with the use of the throttle (like, duh...) and the suspension was much more sorely taxed (like, duh!). The car was much faster, and much more exciting, but it also required more driving.

Third, there's the potential blow to your driving record. Mom always said "It's more fun to drive a slow car fast than it is a fast car slow!" and the Miata proved her right. I got waaaaay more tickets in the turbo version (like, duh ).

Finally, the above poster's logic is inexorable. The blower will allow you to burn more gas per stroke. It's impossible to have this without increased consumption, increased heat, and increased load on the motor. Can the motor take it? Arguably yes, but.... your margin for error goes down significantly. Bad gas can go from a minor inconvenience to a major expense.

Although it may seem like it, I'm not trying to talk you out of this at all. Rather- make sure you eyes are all the way open!

Luck!

[aigel]

I do not think you can pass smog with any of the currently available SC kits for a 993. They need the CARB sticker to be legal and usually only very large suppliers go through the approval process. I would not risk failing smog and just hoping for a dumb tech not seeing the non-stock SC / intercooler.

G

[CMeSpeed]

Hi Porterdog,

Thanks for your well written words of wisdom. I appreciate the details about your experience.

I have much respect Miatas. I live in Northern California with great secret roads and recently had a jaunt through our local mountain roads with a Miata on my ass. I couldn’t shake him despite the power difference. Those damn cars are slot cars. There was just no beating them around the twistes for sure. I also had the same experience at my last track day. I think I’m going to buy a Miata for the track. I’m always a bit uneasy driving (beating up) my 911 on the track. Besides the fact at my age at 63 I can’t see as fast as the car will go. I do think the stock 993 needed more power however. Maybe only to be used on freeway on ramps.

As far as tickets go, I hate to throw my hard earned money out the window risking speeding on public roads so that hasn't been an issue. In driving nothing but Porsches for 30 years I actually haven’t had a speeding ticket in 10.

And to Aigel’s reply, OMG brother! You may have just popped my need for speed bubble. Smog concerns, really? Are you saying the smog techs would fail a bolt on mod like this??? What is a CARB sticker? We in Cali have very tough smog regs, and as you probably know already, the 993 have tough times passing them. Do you know of a work around?

I feel lost now, but do appreciate you bringing this to my attention. Can you imagine, spending this kind of money only to not pass smog. Ye Gads

And James, to reply to your message, As far as the Cali prices for a 993TT go they are outrageous these days. I can get a 996 for almost half the price of what a 993TT costs out here. And yes I do know the flack the 996 has received since they came out.

Apologies for this diatribe fellas but I do love talking cars with other gear heads and feel grateful for all the time and sound advice you guys brought me.

Much success to you all.

[Trophy]

You may want to read this over on Rennlist.

Winter projects 2012 – S/C installation, Interior rebuild etc. - Rennlist Discussion Forums

Also do a search over there, a bunch of 993 and 964 guys have been through the process. It is not as plug and play as you may be lead to believe.

[CMeSpeed]

Okay gentlemen,

End of discussion. Aigel was absolutely correct with the CARB issue.

Now that I know what CARB is and have learned there is no CARB for the TPC super charger, so as stated it wouldn’t pass Cali smog.

Aigel you have saved me big bucks and probably my marriage.
I wish I could buy you all a beer.

[aigel]

James,

My pleasure. Maybe you can spend $11k on your transmission and re-gear to an RS type gearing and buy a nice LSD as well?

It isn't easy to ignore the big horsepower new cars make nowadays. But the 993 is going to be a 20 years old model soon. It is a classic, not something to compete with modern cars any more.

G