Talking about price adjustments

https://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cars-sale/1006515-1989-930-turbo-cab.html

Post #2 - I can’t help but wonder what the unreasonable offers were...

Sure signs of a down market

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1988-Porsche-911-Carrera/392507395822?hash=item5b63438eee:g:EfgAAOSwwp9duP7 p

another bargain

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1991-Porsche-911-Carrera-4-964-Coupe/293343681444?hash=item444ca55ba4:g:a24AAOSwPeRdwx4 S

too cheap to even discuss

https://www.ebay.com/b/Porsche-911-Cars/6001/bn_39440220?rt=nc&_dcat=6001&_dmd=1&_pcats=6013%2C 6001%2C6000&_pgn=6&_sop=22

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1993-Porsche-911-RS/113988199863?hash=item1a8a39e5b7:g:lhUAAOSw9NJdgFB C

What is up w/ RSs? I didn't realize they were so strong.... a bunch on eBay all expensive.

Some of those prices are really laughable. Not a chance that RSA sells for that price anytime in the near future.

I love the cassis red coupe but not at that price.

Sold for $49,000 + buyers premium; Good buy....

Good cars bring good money.

Good buy or good bye?

What's so great about paying 50 grand for a 100k mile SC?

A 50% premium for orange? LoL

Good bye

Maybe a $10,000 premium..... but I don't think it was grossly overvalued...

Plenty of 100k mile SC coupes can be bought in the low $30's which makes $50k a roughly 50% premium.

Yup...

With mismatched motor I’m not sure where the added value came from. I think it indicates that the sky isn’t falling on Black Friday at least

Bottom line is what it sold for. A few SC coupes have sold in the same range in the last three months. There is no doubt that the market has a wide range from $20 to $50K.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1981-porsche-911sc-26/

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1979-porsche-911sc-29/

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1978-porsche-911sc-25/

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1982-porsche-911sc-60/

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1982-porsche-911sc-54/

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1980-porsche-911sc-29/

IMO, Conti Orange and condition sold this car.....

this is not supposed to be rational to an enthusiast, It is only rational to professionals.

Opinion on this.....
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/backdated-1981-porsche-911-14/

Damn I was way off with my guess. Vaive's doom & gloom take has been getting into my subconscious I guess :)

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1978-porsche-911sc-27/

The aftermarket turbo flare / wheel combo doesn't look right on that car. Also has been only driven 300 miles since 2009. Highly doubt that is accurate. I'm sure there is paint work on that car other than the turbo flares. I think $45k is pretty good money for that example.

I agree. Let’s be realistic the whole classic car market is not rational. It’s all emotional buys, none of it is practical. I called on an 1990 E30 M3 Sport Evolution out of curiosity. The car has 53k miles. I was told the asking price.....wait for it....$300k. The seller has a reputation for selling top BMW’s and has a great gift of gab. He believes his own hype but why shouldn’t he...the lowest he has sold a Sport Evo was for $250k. My point is it’s not just Porsche’s that are selling well above what opinions think they should sell for. The BAT car was a nice car and all it needed were two buyers who felt they really wanted it. Average cars will continue to sell at average prices. Cars with rare colors, rare color combinations, rare options, low production and excellent conditions will probably always command a premium. Regardless of what the naysayers think.

I agree.

I do not understand how someone feels that if a mediocre car sells for $25,000..... that is the market ......or if a car sells for $50,000 that's the market. Why is so hard to understand that a market and buyers both can discriminate as to characteristics.

Now Howard.... my math depends upon the cars in the sample group....

How is this hacked up SC transformed into a 72 as high as it is. So much illegal crap and displaying it for the world to see.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/backdated-1981-porsche-911-14/

Explain why is this illegal it used to be common practice.

Hell I’m intrigued.....what’s illegal about it?

Transferring a VIN from 1 chassis to another is illegal. It may have been common, but that doesn't make it legal.

Can you cite code?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum= 10751.

VIN switching was very common with motorcycles in California and was a common way to sell stolen motorcycles.

As long as they are not trying to pass it off as a 72 using the vin from the 72 it’s completely legal. The legality is in the fraud..which the seller is not doing. Receipts should show where the front clip came from. In fact it probably would have been illegal to grind off the vin from the front clip, which is not the case. So there is no issue with the car.

I wouldn't go that far, plenty of issues with the car. Like a salvage title car, if someone knows the story and can stomach it, then I guess buy it. But this one has got plenty of baggage, make no mistake.

---Adam

Did you look at the listing? They're selling it as a 72, they have removed the A-pillar 1981 VIN tag and the lower dash numbers. The part about removing the lower dash stampings is what really makes the whole thing stink. There's no reason to do that unless they're trying to hide the original 1981 VIN number. Just because the seller is being partially honest about it doesn't make it legal.

Agree. Dodgy at best. Happening on BaT right now with another car, a 73 2002 tii.
Some people just don't care.

The reason I brought up the salvage title car thing was because if you buy a car like this you have to remember that the killer deal you got is the same killer deal you'll have to give the next guy. I've tried to buy too many cars from guys who buy a car with heavy baggage and then get amnesia when it comes time to sell, telling you what Hagerty says it's worth. Like a B Cab I was going to buy once, had a 13XXX VIN, which is a replacement chassis, my detective work was that it was originally a Notchback, wrecked back, went back to the Factory, who sent it back out a cab. All well and good, but it will never bring regular cab money, too much baggage.

---Adam

There seems to be a dislike of BaT in particular and auction sites in general. Why? As the owner of an old SC, I am quite happy to see that the cars still bring a lot of money. If you're not in the market, why do the auction results create such disparagement?

Basically all the same problems you would expect to see when remotely purchasing a previously owned item. Additionally, there is BaT pressuring sellers to lower their reserves so that more cars sell (generating more fees).

Hey maybe you're right. If seller doesn't supply both titles then it becomes a buyer beware issue. Some States would just title the car with no issues, some States don't even offer a title for older cars while other Sates might give you a hard time. This is a sale that requires the right paperwork. It's nuts that so much work went into a car with questionable history. Hopefully the seller has the title to both cars.

"A chassis plate from a donor 1972 911T has been installed".

Sounds clear enough.

Orange went for $50K.

The 5 mph test drive must be a joke.

From code:
unless the vehicle or component part has attached thereto an identification number assigned or approved by the department in lieu of the manufacturer’s number.

I would think approved by the department is critical here....

Lots of bitter people here. They hate progress and techno. They hate the youth. Same old ****.

BAT represents irrational mania, yet the same people will tell people to go buy a car from Porsche magazines like excellence ... Even worse crack pipe prices there. LOL

They don't understand that internet auctions have more viewers than a local pennysaver ad. And will have higher prices for convenience. Not everyone wants to drive 6 hours inspecting cars. It's called **** you money.

They all also hate Craigslist. I just bought a great car this weekend from a great seller on CL.

Or is it too much cabbage?

The BAT hate reminds me of a friend of mine who always emailed listings of cars for sale at dealerships.
Every time, he would say what a rip-off price the dealer was asking.

The guy doesn't understand what a dealer's business model is.
I told him to stop shopping at dealers because you don't get private party prices at dealers.

People pay a premium for used car at a dealer for the convenience of browsing in a parking lot.
If you want to private party bargain stop going to the f****** dealer.
Pick up the phone and start going on weekend drives out of state for 6 months until you find your precious deal !

Especially the (mostly) original paint, as claimed.

Condition is driver ... "patina" plus other interesting details...

It's amusing to see that on display in OT - whether it be music, cars, lifestyle choices, family living arrangements, the interests of youths, vices, etc., if it's not dinosaur era, it's not worth shiit on a shingle! :)

Another ...

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1992-porsche-carrera-2-13/

The other issue is that in any marketplace there will be good and bad examples. Some people are convinced BAT is a conspiracy that covers up flaws in cars by censoring the comments section. I no longer view BAT auctions and delete the emails, so I can't comment on that.

But, the haters are convinced that all cars on BAT are frauds, all prices paid on BAT are 50% above market price, and that Ebay is crap, CL is crap, and the only way to buy a used car is to troll PCA mags/events or one buy off Pelican forums (Yea, because people have reasonable asking prices at PCA events, LMAO) It is some form of old age paranoia and suspicion that is deep rooted in all aspects of life.

There’s a huge premium on C2, non-sunroof manual transmission cars