14" Fuch and Cup 1 Wheel Values

[jhynesrockmtn]

I started cleaning up and organizing a bit today. I have some wheels that I've been storing for years. The Cup wheels (with spacers) were on a 911SC I bought years back and have since sold. The 14 inch Fuch was a spare for that car at some point. I'm not looking to make big bucks on these. Just curious what a fair price would be. The tires are old and I'll get them removed.

The Cup wheels are 8 inch and 6 inch, SM manufactured, 944.362.116.00 and 944.362.112.00 numbers. They are decent driver condition. There is some good brake dust on 3 of the 4 in the pics. The other one I cleaned up. I'll spend some more time on the others.



The Fuch is 5 1/2 by 14, 1/70 date code

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by jhynesrockmtn

I started cleaning up and organizing a bit today. I have some wheels that I've been storing for years. The Cup wheels (with spacers) were on a 911SC I bought years back and have since sold. The 14 inch Fuch was a spare for that car at some point. I'm not looking to make big bucks on these. Just curious what a fair price would be. The tires are old and I'll get them removed.

The Cup wheels are 8 inch and 6 inch, SM manufactured, 944.362.116.00 and 944.362.112.00 numbers. They are decent driver condition. There is some good brake dust on 3 of the 4 in the pics. The other one I cleaned up. I'll spend some more time on the others.



The Fuch is 5 1/2 by 14, 1/70 date code

The Cup Is are sized for a 964, the 968 had 7&8x16. While you have correctly identified them, there are some clowns here who claim that they aren’t Cup Is, because they are not 17s(which are worth much more than the 16s: Those are also known as “Star Fish” .
The best way to get the value is to 1), do a search here on the 911 classifieds and the 944 classifieds.
2) check out the eBay completed auctions.
Do you only have 1 14” Fuch?

[Cobalt]

Originally Posted by Racerbvd

The Cup Is are sized for a 964, the 968 had 7&8x16. While you have correctly identified them, there are some clowns here who claim that they aren’t Cup Is, because they are not 17s(which are worth much more than the 16s: Those are also known as “Star Fish” .
The best way to get the value is to 1), do a search here on the 911 classifieds and the 944 classifieds.
2) check out the eBay completed auctions.
Do you only have 1 14” Fuch?

The narrow spoke CUP wheels are not the larger 17" CUP I wheels. The narrow spokes repalced the D90's in 92 and are a little bit more desirable than the D90's. I have sold sets of D90's in pristine condition for $600 and that was all the money the narrow spokes are worth maybe $800-900 in excellent condition for someone looking for snow rims or want a cushy ride in their 964. In this condition there isn't much of a market. As said the Cup 1's 17" wheels I used to sell refinished for $4500 a set depending on widths but lately a lot of used wheels are coming in from RoW sources and prices have come down. These can all be purchased new from Porsche still.


The fuchs are more valuable although I would have the tires dismounted if you could it would be far easier and less costly to ship and the tires are old. The center caps on the cups are available new for around $240 a set so the old caps add maybe another $100-125.
In my 20 years of 964 ownership this is the first I heard them called starfish but I guess it works.

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by Cobalt

The narrow spoke CUP wheels are not the larger 17" CUP I wheels. The narrow spokes repalced the D90's in 92 and are a little bit more desirable than the D90's. I have sold sets of D90's in pristine condition for $600 and that was all the money the narrow spokes are worth maybe $800-900 in excellent condition for someone looking for snow rims or want a cushy ride in their 964. In this condition there isn't much of a market. As said the Cup 1's 17" wheels I used to sell refinished for $4500 a set depending on widths but lately a lot of used wheels are coming in from RoW sources and prices have come down. These can all be purchased new from Porsche still.


The fuchs are more valuable although I would have the tires dismounted if you could it would be far easier and less costly to ship and the tires are old. The center caps on the cups are available new for around $240 a set so the old caps add maybe another $100-125.
In my 20 years of 964 ownership this is the first I heard them called starfish but I guess it works.

You have 20 years, I remember when the 964 1st came out, the introduction at Brumos.



One of the 1st in the country. Excellence magazine a Porsche magazine, if memory serves me correctly, was one of the first to refer to them as Starfish, as did Pano, I probably have the magazines, but location would be a challenge for me.
It looked like the “Starfish” would be the next very popular Porsche wheel, but when the 993TT “twist” wheels came out, everyone literally overlooked them rest of the wheels.
Yes, 17” Cup Ones are now very valuable, b.ut that wasn’t always the case. Just like the 968 Cup 1s and Cup 2s (7.5 & 9x17) for a long time were cheap, same with the 14” Fuchs, literally remember buying sets for $150, mind you, those case are long gone, but old guys still have that I their heads.
As for center caps, the caps for Phone dials (and fit basically all the wheels after 89 (Phone dials, sewer lids, Cup everything, twist etc) fit, I prefer the phone dial version and sewer lids as they are aluminum vs plastic.
Again, both styles of wheels he asked about have been on a rollercoaster ride, one set starting very strong, the other, for a long time cheap. Which is why I suggested that he’ do a search for the current market prices.

[jhynesrockmtn]

Originally Posted by Racerbvd

The Cup Is are sized for a 964, the 968 had 7&8x16. While you have correctly identified them, there are some clowns here who claim that they aren’t Cup Is, because they are not 17s(which are worth much more than the 16s: Those are also known as “Star Fish” .
The best way to get the value is to 1), do a search here on the 911 classifieds and the 944 classifieds.
2) check out the eBay completed auctions.
Do you only have 1 14” Fuch?

Thanks for the info. I will do a deeper dive on ebay and Pelican. I do only have the 1 one 14" Fuch.

[Cobalt]

Originally Posted by Racerbvd

You have 20 years, I remember when the 964 1st came out, the introduction at Brumos.

One of the 1st in the country. Excellence magazine a Porsche magazine, if memory serves me correctly, was one of the first to refer to them as Starfish, as did Pano, I probably have the magazines, but location would be a challenge for me.
It looked like the “Starfish” would be the next very popular Porsche wheel, but when the 993TT “twist” wheels came out, everyone literally overlooked them rest of the wheels.
Yes, 17” Cup Ones are now very valuable, b.ut that wasn’t always the case. Just like the 968 Cup 1s and Cup 2s (7.5 & 9x17) for a long time were cheap, same with the 14” Fuchs, literally remember buying sets for $150, mind you, those case are long gone, but old guys still have that I their heads.
As for center caps, the caps for Phone dials (and fit basically all the wheels after 89 (Phone dials, sewer lids, Cup everything, twist etc) fit, I prefer the phone dial version and sewer lids as they are aluminum vs plastic.
Again, both styles of wheels he asked about have been on a rollercoaster ride, one set starting very strong, the other, for a long time cheap. Which is why I suggested that he’ do a search for the current market prices.

20 years owning restoring customizing and researching everything 964. My friend Stefania had one of the first and was part of the 200 they invited to test drive them. She always called them D90's and has been around far longer than I. I have owned multiple 911's for over 45 years and a PCA affiliate since 77 when I restored my first 911 a 71E. I gave up on Excellence a long time ago. Their evaluations which were always so far off base got boring and after it took them over 9 months to publish the article they shot about my 944 I gave up. I sold the car before it ever got published. So I guess I missed that I have every Pano going back to the early 70's I don't ever recall them calling them that. I will take your word but they don't look like starfish to me. I use D90's for hose reels. I can't find a buyer for the spares I have. Scrapped out a few sets as well.

All these wheels had their ups and downs. Some just downs. I bought and sold nearly 30 sets of Cup I's over the past 20 years. I have a set of 7&8' SM's I 'm considering letting go. Starting buy buying them with good tires for $500 a set back 20 years ago. Nobody wanted them. I would sell them for $800-1000 depending on condition. About 10 years ago they became popular again. I recall looking for a single SM 7" at Hershey years ago and as I was leaving one rolled in front of my truck by mistake. The seller wanted only $100 for a pair back then. Needing refinishing of course. The fuchs are still one of the best wheel made. I had a set of 9 & 11 x 15's I foolishly sold for nothing years ago and nobody wanted the smaller sizes but I know people who pay big money if it is the right size for their car. I help with a lot of restorations and builds so everyone wants something different. Heck Al those solex carbs that were tossed for webers are now worth a fortune. Go figure.

I collect the cupI's and have multiple sets of each size and maker. I also collect Speedline three piece wheels. I have every set but only the RSR fronts which are 9 1/2 wide ET 57 not the 9" wide ET 47's. Not to be confused with the 9.5 Cup rears.

This is a decent resource for wheel info. They pulled pics I posted off the internet for some of their photos.https://www.944racing.de/wheelweights.php Although I try to correct them about some incorrect info but they have never updated it.

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by Cobalt

20 years owning restoring customizing and researching everything 964. My friend Stefania had one of the first and was part of the 200 they invited to test drive them. She always called them D90's and has been around far longer than I. I have owned multiple 911's for over 45 years and a PCA affiliate since 77 when I restored my first 911 a 71E. I gave up on Excellence a long time ago. Their evaluations which were always so far off base got boring and after it took them over 9 months to publish the article they shot about my 944 I gave up. I sold the car before it ever got published. So I guess I missed that I have every Pano going back to the early 70's I don't ever recall them calling them that. I will take your word but they don't look like starfish to me. I use D90's for hose reels. I can't find a buyer for the spares I have. Scrapped out a few sets as well.

All these wheels had their ups and downs. Some just downs. I bought and sold nearly 30 sets of Cup I's over the past 20 years. I have a set of 7&8' SM's I 'm considering letting go. Starting buy buying them with good tires for $500 a set back 20 years ago. Nobody wanted them. I would sell them for $800-1000 depending on condition. About 10 years ago they became popular again. I recall looking for a single SM 7" at Hershey years ago and as I was leaving one rolled in front of my truck by mistake. The seller wanted only $100 for a pair back then. Needing refinishing of course. The fuchs are still one of the best wheel made. I had a set of 9 & 11 x 15's I foolishly sold for nothing years ago and nobody wanted the smaller sizes but I know people who pay big money if it is the right size for their car. I help with a lot of restorations and builds so everyone wants something different. Heck Al those solex carbs that were tossed for webers are now worth a fortune. Go figure.

I collect the cupI's and have multiple sets of each size and maker. I also collect Speedline three piece wheels. I have every set but only the RSR fronts which are 9 1/2 wide ET 57 not the 9" wide ET 47's. Not to be confused with the 9.5 Cup rears.

This is a decent resource for wheel info. They pulled pics I posted off the internet for some of their photos.https://www.944racing.de/wheelweights.php Although I try to correct them about some incorrect info but they have never updated it.

Very cool history, the Cup 1 7&8x17 are correct for the RS America, as I’m sure you already know








Speaking of stupid, I should have never traded off and sold a few sets and extra centers and lips, 3.6 SpeedLine for Porsche.

[Cobalt]

Gorgeous 964. Is the Peter Greg Livery something that was done when new or added? Or was this one of his cars? Hind sight is 20/20. I never should have sold the last known to exist factory 94 turbo S flachbau tail in its original gel coat for $10k someone contacted me a few months back offering me $40k for it. But who could have thought things would have changed so dramatically. Although the memories still remain. Thanks for sharing the photos.

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by Cobalt

Gorgeous 964. Is the Peter Greg Livery something that was done when new or added? Or was this one of his cars? Hind sight is 20/20. I never should have sold the last known to exist factory 94 turbo S flachbau tail in its original gel coat for $10k someone contacted me a few months back offering me $40k for it. But who could have thought things would have changed so dramatically. Although the memories still remain. Thanks for sharing the photos.

That was a RS America that Brumos built as a 30th Anniversary model of the 911RS, a friend of mine bought it new, I remember when Brumos was sourcing the factory 73 duck for the build. Because the factory Duck Tail was so much lighter than the RSA lid , that you either needed 2 people or be fast enough to catch the tail before it launched.
Brumos did a few other tricks to make the RSA a bit more special. This is how it looked when originally delivered, I believe that they originally planned on building 3, but a 911 without AC in Florida is a bad sell. Steve got a really good deal on it when he bought it, made money when he sold it ( but nowhere near what they are currently selling for)
Later on the car was a Club car racer, crashed really, really bad (I have pictures somewhere) and has changed hands a few times. Had to laugh the last time I saw it was listed .
What it actually looked like when Steve bought it from Brumos brand new (and after I posted when it surfaced again, the flipper sent me a message telling me I didn’t know what I was talking about , even though I helped find some of the vintage pieces, was hanging out at the dealership while building it and was there when it hit the showroom. And some of the pictures I posted were literally right after it left Brumos.

This is how it looked last time I saw it listed.

Even more funny, another friend owned the Peter Gregg 74 Carrera, done up the same way.


Next to my 914.
When he bought it, it came with both a Duck and the later (in 74) Carrera tail, as it was delivered with a Duck, but Peter had the newer tail put on. I think the same guy a one point owned both.
Somewhere I have a resent picture of the cars together.

[Cobalt]

Originally Posted by Racerbvd

That was a RS America that Brumos built as a 30th Anniversary model of the 911RS, a friend of mine bought it new, I remember when Brumos was sourcing the factory 73 duck for the build. Because the factory Duck Tail was so much lighter than the RSA lid , that you either needed 2 people or be fast enough to catch the tail before it launched.
Brumos did a few other tricks to make the RSA a bit more special. This is how it looked when originally delivered, I believe that they originally planned on building 3, but a 911 without AC in Florida is a bad sell. Steve got a really good deal on it when he bought it, made money when he sold it ( but nowhere near what they are currently selling for)
Later on the car was a Club car racer, crashed really, really bad (I have pictures somewhere) and has changed hands a few times. Had to laugh the last time I saw it was listed .
What it actually looked like when Steve bought it from Brumos brand new (and after I posted when it surfaced again, the flipper sent me a message telling me I didn’t know what I was talking about , even though I helped find some of the vintage pieces, was hanging out at the dealership while building it and was there when it hit the showroom. And some of the pictures I posted were literally right after it left Brumos.

This is how it looked last time I saw it listed.

Even more funny, another friend owned the Peter Gregg 74 Carrera, done up the same way.


Next to my 914.
When he bought it, it came with both a Duck and the later (in 74) Carrera tail, as it was delivered with a Duck, but Peter had the newer tail put on. I think the same guy a one point owned both.
Somewhere I have a resent picture of the cars together.

I recall this now that you mentioned it. I know the current owner of the 74 Carrera. I also had a friend who owned the silver race version.

Thanks for sharing your experience.

I agree I like the RSA tail. I have one on my C2 but it weighs 6 pounds more than the stock motorized pop up tail. Nobody realizes how much the rubber part weighs.

This is the 74 I believe you were discussing. Someone I know owns it now. It was a sportomatic as my understanding was Peter Greg only liked Sportos for street driving.

I will have to show my friend the picture. It appears that they had swapped out the factory metal mirrors for a very common plastic aftermarket mirror. I recall seeing those used on some cars back in the day. Assuming this is the same car I see the wheels were not painted white either.







I will be down for Werks/Amelia and hope to discuss this more when I visit the museum again. Hopefully the #59 964 super turbo will be completed for me to see by then.