Is it just me or is the market finally dropping?

car-reras · 09-02-2010, 04:53 PM

Is it just me or is this early Pcar market finally dropping like everything else did?
Following sales like I do on almost every sale under 1989 cars, it really looks like the classic car market is working it's way down to a bottom in line with housing, unemployment, tight credit, etc. For ever it seemed these cars were immune, but I have seen many, many cars this year go unsold, or lowered to prices I would have jumped on even just last year. I know of at least 5 cars right now that would be amazing purchases, the sheer amount available to me alone, is cause for concern. Just when I think, I should go for this one or that one, another one becomes available...your thoughts?

geshaghi · geshaghi's Garage

As both a seller and a buyer of early 911's, all I'll say is that the market seems very fickle. If you look at auction results from recent Monterey sales, I'm surprised at some of the numbers that were achieved, and I'm even more surprised by some of the no sales. Good cars in good colors are still selling well in private sales, although off the highs of two years ago. Cars with stories are a much tougher sell.

bwall · 09-02-2010, 07:15 PM

Just the other day I was thinking that prices were back on the way up. Not where they were before, but above where they were. But, I prefer geshagi's interpretation as 'fickle'. Another word may be 'mixed'. This can also be seen in the housing and stock markets.

car-reras · 09-02-2010, 07:47 PM

Yes, I am not talking about the top 2% cars, just your everyday nice US Carreras, SC's, driver TES's, etc. Just today I found myself turning down a lovely 74 Carrera for $15,500...I think I would agree with 'mixed' if it were 2% up 98% down, and down a lot. Seemed like prices didn't come down, and all you saw were no sales. I think reality and necessity have started moving prices to meet demand.

geshaghi · geshaghi's Garage

All I know is that every time I want to buy something, prices are high, but every time I want to sell, ...... well, you get the picture.

Putting aside the top 2%, it seems that buyers tend to be more conservative about discretionary purchases and sellers seem to be unwilling to accept significantly reduced sales prices unless they have some compelling need to sell quickly. In the longhood market, it is still difficult to buy good quality car (T, E or S) inexpensively. I'm not talking about concours cars, but nice drivers that don't need thousands of dollars of work to be safe, presentable and reliable. While off the frothy highs of a couple of years ago, these good cars do sell (albeit on the market longer) and buyers seem to be more thoughtful about purchases.

Where I think the bottom has dropped out is for half finished projects, rusty bitsas, cars that have anything but the most minor of needs, and other junk. If you're trying to sell a car with a bad story, or some sort of significant need or issue, you'll have a hard time unless it is priced super-cheap.

GothingNC · 09-03-2010, 06:04 AM

Local shop just sold a 95 993 with 75k miles for 19k.
Silver/Black in really nice shape.

Sold by word of mouth.

Christien · Christien's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by geshaghi

In the longhood market, it is still difficult to buy good quality car (T, E or S) inexpensively. I'm not talking about concours cars, but nice drivers that don't need thousands of dollars of work to be safe, presentable and reliable.

This describes my car pretty much exactly. I had it up for sale earlier in the season (high time of the market) and didn't get any serious offers above 16k. I had one person tell me it wasn't worth more than 13k!

I didn't need to sell it, so I didn't. I was basically looking to get into a driver-quality 3.2 cabrio, so looking for that kind of money, or an even trade. I started it at $22 and went as low as $18, but then decided it was stupid to let it go at that. It's definitely not concours, but safe, reliable and presentable. All the mechanicals had been taken care of (rebuilt engine, tranny, new clutch, shocks, all the big stuff and lots of little). It could use some cosmetic work (new carpeting, reupholster driver's chair), but that's under $1000. Hell, it even came with a spare engine. In the end I'm glad I didn't sell it under value.

car-reras · 09-03-2010, 07:03 AM

Maybe it's just me. Passed also on a beautiful 84 Cab with 91K for $14 and more recently, in fact I think it is still here on CL, an 87 Stunning original low mile Guards Red cab, from second owner...asking was $16,500 and he was ready to deal...

Oh, and a very rare Factory Turbo look 89 Targa in amazing retro gold and Cinnamon with 41K original did sell this weekend here....$19K.

car-reras · 09-03-2010, 08:08 AM

....and the factory M491 Targa I mentioned, actually went up from an original asking of $17K. I guess you could look at that as a price increase, but $19K is still way below what I got for my last two TL's @ $35K in 04 and $32K in early 09...

whiterabbit · 09-03-2010, 08:56 AM

Are you actually looking at these cars physically? Just wondered as I am finding it very hard to find a genuine low mile 1984-1986 coupe (under 80k) that doesn't have issues. FWIW I will pay 20k plus for the right car as its a car I intend to hold a long time.

Seems to me a lot of 1984-86's are going overseas.

car-reras · 09-03-2010, 09:17 AM

'Are you actually looking at these cars physically? '

Indeed I am. These are just the cars local to me. Could be a regional thing, or maybe seasonal, but I do feel we may be very near a bottom (with everything).

car-reras · 09-03-2010, 09:21 AM

'Where I think the bottom has dropped out is for half finished projects'

I don't think these kinds of things ever sold for much, and sales have always languished , so I don't know about the bottom dropping out...just business as usual here, but maybe more supply than usual.

Zeke · 09-03-2010, 02:42 PM

I was going to start a new thread on the same lines, but I'll just chime in here. I don't follow the market on a daily basis like some of you do, but I do check. It's ludicrous what you see people asking in Pano classifieds and other local and regional publications. It's like they are fishing in some big mysterious ocean.

I'd get so little for my car at this point that I'd rather see it stolen. But, in case you get any ideas, it's locked away waiting for weather cool enough to drive. No, the A/C doesn't work and the car is not worth the $ to fix it.

wm711 · 09-03-2010, 07:09 PM

I think this car is as good a buy as I have seen in a while. Ive got a 68 912 and 73 911E targa in restoration currently, so my Porsche car funds are spoken for currently. Wish somebody would buy this... it haunts me.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cars-sale/557737-1987-cabriolet-silver-red-leather.html

Danny_Ocean · 09-03-2010, 08:21 PM

Old news...

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-marketplace-discussion/395796-threat-poor-economy-bring-prices-down-yet-p-cars.html

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-marketplace-discussion/374434-so-slow-housing-market-bringing-prices-down-porsche-cars.html

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-marketplace-discussion/454966-market-conditions-20-year-old-p-cars-2.html

galileo · 09-04-2010, 03:08 AM

I cant believe that silver cab hasnt sold either!!

car-reras · 08:03 AM

Danny,

That is 'old news', those threads were started in 2007, 2008, and 2008 again. I am noticing much more recent developments...

Danny_Ocean · 09-04-2010, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by car-reras

Danny,

That is 'old news', those threads were started in 2007, 2008, and 2008 again. I am noticing much more recent developments...

Exactly my point. People have been debating this subject forever. Unless you're a flipper, it's a moot issue. By the car you want and drive it.

If you have the ability to time markets, then you should be in real estate or the stock market, not Porsches.

car-reras · 09-04-2010, 01:02 PM

Ok, Danny is not interested in this subject, so we should all just forget it :-)

...and just an FYI, I am in real estate, the stock market AND Porsches

Danny_Ocean · 09-04-2010, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by car-reras

Ok, Danny is not interested in this subject, so we should all just forget it :-)

Already have my car. Paid too much for it. But, I've had almost five years of enjoyment while owning it. How much longer are you going to wait to buy the car you've been looking for? We ain't getting any younger.

And remember...the clock is ticking. As gasoline prices rise and more enviro-Nazi's have their way, our cars will become dinosaurs. Maybe you can buy one for scrap value in a few years?