I agree, you can still find SC Targas for under $20K. I've seen 2 this week. They both sold within 1 day, though. And neither really were cars I would want. High miles on both (around 200K), one was a salvage title, generally tired and needed paint.

I don't think these sub 20K cars are generally very good values. Assume 19K, but then you have a car that is complete and driving, but with a lot of "issues." It's going to have some cosmetic issues, usually at best "ok" in the paint area, usually no records or history, complete but tired interior, and all those other things that come with a minimally maintained and cared for 38 year old car.

I'd rather spend $6-7K more and get a much, much nicer, lower mile less worn out example.

When I first got involved with these cars just over a decade ago we used to say that all 911SCs were $20k car. You could buy a $20k and do nothing but fluids, pads and basic maintenance for the next half a dozen or more years.

Or you could buy a $10-12k one and expect to sink $8-10k into it (mostly engine, gearbox and cosmetic refurbishment) in the next couple of years.

On a certain level it's too bad that $20k now is more likely to buy you that rough car that's gonna need some love.

I am the real weirdo in the bunch. About six years ago I bought a beautiful '82 SC Targa for $16k. Over the years I had a lot of work done to it (I'm not a DiYer), clutch, transmission, lots of other stuff. I ended up having about $25k in the car, and assumed I'd never get back that added $9k or so. I enjoyed the car, and it was my dream car, but I found my interest waning over the years.

Here's where it gets interesting: as the prices went up, I got LESS enjoyment out of the car. It started feeling like a "responsibility" since it was so cherry, and was now increasing in value. I'd need to revisit my insurance. I worried about it sitting in my mother-in-law's garage when I couldn't have it here at the house. I drove it even less.

I decided to sell a few months ago, and got $26k for it with very little effort. I basically broke even, which is awesome!

I found I did miss having a toy car, and so went out and bought a lovely 2000 Boxster S for $12k, and have since dumped $5k into it for the usual stuff. This time I KNOW I'm not ever going to see that money again if/when I sell. But somehow I enjoy the car more. It's not just that it is tons more fun to drive (IMO), but that it's also nothing special. There's no pressure or responsibility, self-inflicted or otherwise. Some part of it is surely the novelty, but I'm very happy at this point.

The downside is the near-certain knowledge that I'll most likely never have another 911. I sure have enjoyed the ride, though.

Here's a link to the sale site for my SC, if anyone is interested in what I once had:
1982 Porsche 911 SC For Sale (Sold)

Well put. Thought this was one of the better responses. Times change, cars change, and you change. I like the 'no pressure or responsibility, self-inflicted or otherwise.' Nice post.

Hmmm. Much to digest here. Mortality? Um, a little too cerebral thinking for me and driving a car.
Selling a 911 and then getting a Boxster? Too staid and boring for my blood. Considering selling a 72 or not driving it. Why?

Consider I just drove 10 hours in a 36 year old car with no air conditioning, cruise control, electric windows, locks, Nav or leather seats in 95 degree weather. All these are in a Boxster, and a Camry for that matter. The Boxster costs more, the Camry about the same optioned up.
I dont want either. I've learned life is too short to settle or worry about what might happen, and for me, this 911 is all I've ever wanted in a car, and it isn't going anywhere.

Not really a weirdo at all. You describe the IB 911 version of what happened to 356s about ten years ago. Guys bought them. Cared for them and spent more on them than they could get them for. The cars appreciated and the owners got older and wanted something less finicky and comfortable. They sold the cars for what they had in them or a bit more. And bought a more modern luxurious car. Yours is a story as old as Porsches.
And good on you that it worked out for you.

Discouraging as a buyer, yes. As an owner, its nice - if you're selling.

Unfortunately I got into a habit of buying a different car every few years... different model year, coupe, targa, etc. I think those days are over as I have a threshold on what I'm willing to spend on a car that may get only 1-2k per year.

Fortunately my current car is a low mileage, way above average coupe that I bought from a fellow Pelican at a reasonable price. I always look at other cars and they're either not as nice or over priced, so I think this may be my last one unless I find an incredible car below the current market.

Mike's targa above was always one of my favorites on this forum and it sold for a reasonable price.

Colorado owner
 

I saw your ad when your car was listed. Loved the color.
I become tempted by other cars (boxster, m coupe, miata) for other reasons. Colorado weather changes in minutes
Don't know How many times I have found myself in rain or snow with no visibility because of a poor defroster.
Cold/hot temperature wondering if I brought the right car that day.
What does tomorrow hold for my 911???

That's a beautiful sc targa.

Imo, the unloved sc is definitely a sweet spot of value for the money now.

Thing is there are still daily driver sc's albeit a bit rough but hey no pressure then, available between 10 and 20k so if you want to get back into the 911, there's your ticket.

Not at all, you're spot on. I'm in the same boat except I still have the car. I used to drive this car 4-5000 per year, now barely a thousand. We used to go everywhere in that car, now it mostly sits because I'm afraid to pile miles on it. Somebody door dinged me last year and I almost had a heart attack.

I need to get my head on straight, forget about values and start driving again...not sure how to tackle that though.

I have to say that the rise in value has been good in some ways. Many cars that would have been left in a field or parted out are now getting restored. Look at the swb 912s. You can buy a project now and not be so worried about being upside down when it's finished. I love bringing these cars back to life. I used to build homes when I first got out of college. There's a satisfaction in creating something that wasn't there before. I have a regular job now so today I get that satisfaction from restoring these cars.

Yes, some of the more valuable cars are becoming garage queens but most are still being driven. A $50-$70 911T is still within values we see on the road every day (BMW, Mercedes, even trucks and SUVs).

I for one will always drive my cars as they were intended. There's nothing like turning the key of an air cooled 911 after a particularly stressful day, taking some back roads and blowing off a little steam. I'm a better (happier) person when I get back.

I have to say that the rise in value has been good in some ways. Many cars that would have been left in a field or parted out are now getting restored. Look at the swb 912s. You can buy a project now and not be so worried about being upside down when it's finished. I love bringing these cars back to life. I used to build homes when I first got out of college. There's a satisfaction in creating something that wasn't there before. I have a regular job now so today I get that satisfaction from restoring these cars.

Yes, some of the more valuable cars are becoming garage queens but most are still being driven. A $50-$70 911T is still within values we see on the road every day (BMW, Mercedes, even trucks and SUVs).

I for one will always drive my cars as they were intended. There's nothing like turning the key of an air cooled 911 after a particularly stressful day, taking some back roads and blowing off a little steam. I'm a better (happier) person when I get back.

I got into 911's long back when you could get them cheap. For example bought a 1972 911T with an E engine back in 2000 for $5700. Then moved on to an '86 911 that I kept for 13 years. But like Mike above, I guess I fell out of love with the 911. Great car, but there are also lots of other fun cars out there. Sold the 911 and bought a Boxster which I worry less about and drive a lot more. Also bought lots of motorcycles and other fun to drive cars. Still love the looks of the 911, but not enough to buy another one at today's prices.

So many options out there and so little time. Have to admit that the Boxster and something like the BMW Z3 or 4 have more creature comforts, and can drive incredibly long distances with these comforts (ie working AC, etc) without worry, and parts are inexpensive.

Wait, a Z3 or Z4 is a good option?

I would love to have a Z4 as my daily driver. Nice cars.

I think I would actually prefer a Boxster, but the Z4 is a nice car.

10 years ago I was offered a no rust 1970 911S with a rotten interiour but ran well for $7,500. For that kind of money I thought I could by a cherry 1987 Toyota MR 2, so I did, it had AC and needed nothing. I got bored with it and went back to a rag early 911 for 5 times more money.
The trick is to know what you really like. Which is a lot tougher than you think.

Heretic!
Burn him! Burn him!
SmileWavy

Back in '89 I sold a car for what I thought was a lot of money, and then watched the "value" climb for a year. A couple of years later, I could have bought it back for half of what I sold it for. That is how you spell "bubble".

Z3 M Coupes and Roadsters are amazing cars and can be had for a song relative to Porsche $.

Deals are out there, they are just harder to find...
 

and you have to act lightning quick. Gone are the days of waiting on a PPI and sealing the deal on a handshake, cash and carry.

I bought this 911 this past November $11,800. RoW, 117k, I'm the third owner, met second owner she had traded it in after owning it for many years, she felt she could not trust it on long trips. they kept it on a battery tender in their garage and used it rarely in the 10 yrs she owned it. The alternator was barely putting out 9 volts when I got it. Problem solved, great car strong runner and she even gave me the complete tool kit, all books german language and english, BBS wheel locks and center removal tool, real nice lady and a great car. No rust no body damage, COA shows ordered with 1 option Cruise Control, no AC. Clean car, great price. Just be ready to act lightning fast...http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1410210029.jpg

Words of wisdom here. You never know what you really like until you drive em' all.

Right on. They are nice cars.

I had a Z3. Drove it to Boulder, CO from San Diego with my 2 year old (yes, the airbag was disconnected). Then drove it to Oregon through the volcanic region with my daughter at 3, drove it to Vegas myriad times, drove it through the desert like Hunter Thompson with the top down and 50 psi in the tires flying through El Centro and onto Sedona (where I used to live) to dip in Oak Creek and even went to the James Dean crash site in it (I know, I am a heretic).

Got my buddy into Z3's (they are all over SoCal for a song and a fish taco) - he bought one, then sold it for a Z4 M. The Z4 M is ridiculous, and has it all over the Boxster. Drove that thing up to Monterey going 90 the whole time (maybe 70, but it feels fast). I love Porsche but you can't compare the Boxster (any year) to a Z4 M.

Well, I don't have the Z3 anymore because a tree fell on it in Ocean Beach during one of the once-a-year rainstorms. There you go. Had the Z3 while I have the 911 - but the Z3 would take it all day, everyday. I would have run that Z3 at LeMans if I could have...

The standard issue BMW z3 is NOT something Porschephiles would imbrace.

Z3 M Coupe IS.

"Like the 959 or a Jenson Interceptor FF, the M Coupe is the way too rare result of what happens when engineers take over the asylum. Better than all its siblings and rarer, too, the M Coupe is without question more M than all the other M cars."

The Jalopnik Fantasy Garage: First-Generation BMW M Coupe

Although I sold my 2000 M Coupe to buy a '87 G50 Carrera granite green coupe,
I still miss it. Don't miss the electronics and the Clown Shoe goofy looks.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1410221368.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1410221549.jpg

Sorry... A Z3 is neither a land shark nor a whale. And I bet there was no mescaline nor acid involved...

There are still nice SC cars under $20,000. Yes they need some work, but the difference in this discussion is how much work, and who is doing the work. I work on my own cars, this saves me a ton of money, I usually buy parts from our host or fellow Porsche geeks. If you have to farm this to someone else to do....then do not buy a SC under $20,000.

The key is to find a nice example, needing some work and learn how to fix it, many books, helpful tapes, etc. ....it then becomes a hobby and a attachment then just buying a car for someone else to work on.....

Funny. I bought a z3 M coupe from EAG a bit ago.

Awesome car. more comfort and better seats than my boxer and more fun to drive. Even gets more looks than my RSA. I love it.

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-l...-h455-no/2.jpg

Any group reactions to the huge lot of air cooled Porsches recently listed by Marshall Goldman as part of the 'private collection'? Some great looking stuff, including four '89 Speedsters with less than 7K miles, a bunch of 930s, and plenty of what would look to be very clean examples. But the prices (the ones that are listed) are way up there.

One interesting listing for a silver '89 cab - 8,000 miles, all original equip, etc. listed for $109,500 on ebay. Strange times indeed...

Well, well, well. Seems like even mentioning a Z3 here gets things going.

1) Porsche people do embrace the standard Z3 - I know at least 5 in SoCal that have both
2) A regular Z3 2.5 WITHOUT the M designation has more hp than a typical '65 to early 80's 911 - so I don't think power is the issue here
3) The Z3 doesn't have to be a coupe - in stock form, an open Z3 handles better than a 911 for most people who just want to drive it hard around town.
4) Most BMW people I talk to think the Boxster looks like a suppository with a 'can't tell if it's coming or going look' - but I do not condone this type of language or words. They even go a step further in San Diego by calling it other things, but I won't go there as I like the car myself. I don't want this to become a Ford vs. Chevy or Harley vs. the rest of the motorcycling universe thread.

It is what it is - there are myriad options out there for people who don't want their 911 anymore, can't afford or don't want to bother with current 911 prices, or just plain don't want a 911 in the first place.

Hate to admit it, but my buddy bought a Z3 M 6 months ago for $20k. The dealer that sold it to him has since offered to buy it back for $5k more. Sweet deal. He's holding on to it.

I'm loving watching the Z's compete in IMSA this year, even if they are laying the smack down on the Porsches. The bop needs adjustment.

I recently sold both my 2000 M coupe and 02 M3 for my 911's... Currently building a '81 rally car and have a stock '87 for running around. I love the cars for many reasons, but the power of the M's was nice... Especially the '02 as she was a beast!

All this talk about Z3s etc. You could throw just about any modern sports car out there and get more performance per dollar in a spec book than an older 911 (miata anyone?). The difference is how the car feels and how it feeds the road back to your fingertips. Modern technology has a way of robbing that sensation from you. Heck, my daily driver is a 2013 GTI. It's fast, corners well, has tons of power and is even somewhat comfortable. No complaints. It's fun when I need a somewhat proper car for work but when I have my choice of what to drive, I grab the keys to the 911 every time.

I honestly don't think its a collector thing that's driving the market either. From my perspective, (anecdotal) everyone I know personally that has recently entered 911 ownership or are in the market now are looking to drive them. Maybe not as daily cars but definitely as recreational drivers. They want the experience of driving, not that of investing.

$.02 anyway.


73T
68L

I'm a Porsche guy through and through but the Z3 M was a WOW car for me :eek: By far the most fun car i've ever driven.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1410327351.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1410327409.jpg

Porsche 911 Soft Window | eBay

$225,000. That's just stupid...

Few more years and I can retire on the sale of my 83sc...:D

How about these then:

$130,000 for a U.S Carrera??

1974 Carrera Coupe

$60,000 for a bogus one??

www.ebay.com/itm/Porsche-911-Base-Coupe-2-Door-PORSCHE-911-1974-CARRERA

Right…I'm beginning to think that's the plan anymore…

Unfortunately, these prices make me just want to sit on my car and wait until the '86s start to go to stupid levels as well…then sell for a busload of cash. (not that mine would ever sell for a busload of cash, of course…)

I also realize asking price and selling price are quite different. But I'm seeing a lot of "no lowball offers" and "don't waste my time with offers below $XX,XXX". Wow...

Pricing
 

At least now the SC's are gaining a bit of respect in the market. I hope this will encourage saving a few more now that an engine and/or tansmission rebuild or paint won't automatically put someone "upside down" for market value.

5 years ago decent SC's were around $10k (I know, I bought one). I have been saving for a rebuild and backdate, but it's so much fun to drive that I will hate to have it in non-drive status for what could be many months (or years).

All the BMW M roadster talk has got me interested in one of those machines, what a great bang for buck little roadster. A late build S54 engined M roadster may be in my future unless used GT3 prices ever come back to earth!

I really want a 997.2 GT3, but no depreciation is making that unlikely...

Nah....price is only important when I'm buying or selling.

Not thinking about either at the.moment.;)