Pricing Guidance for Purchase of '84 Carrera

[Pinball81]

Guys, I need some help identifying a value on an ’84 Carrera that I’m looking at. Car is local (or relatively, an hour away) and I’ve had a chance to drive and inspect it. Seller was great… let me take the car for a couple of hours to make sure I was comfortable with it.

Car is owned by a PCA member. He purchased this car from a woman who got it through divorce. Has clean title, but no service records with the car. Car had been parked in storage for several years since her divorce. Odometer shows approximately 62k miles, but no service records to confirm.

After buying the car, seller has done quite a bit of work including the following:
• Repaint in original Slate Blue Metallic (love it!). Seems to be a quality job (took the better part of a year with local shop).
• All new gaskets/seals all around.
• New tires
• Seats recovered
• New headliner
• Weltmeister Short Shifter

I was a little concerned about the need for a repaint if the mileage is correct at 62k. Seller indicated that the paint on one of the fenders had cracked a bit so he assumes that fender had been replaced and poorly painted. He said he decided to repaint the whole car to ensure it was done right.

The good: Car runs extremely well. Paint looks very good and I love the color. Good lines and gaps. No broken head studs and reportedly has good leak down (per seller). Seller has had the car for 3 years, so not a flipper. Very knowledgeable and a true enthusiast. Car is local, which is always a plus.

The bad: Little to no maintenance/history docs with the car (other than what seller has done during his ownership). Interior looks great, but there are a few non-original bits (easy stuff like door handles, mats, etc.).

So, I’m looking for a little guidance on pricing. Assuming a PPI confirms mechanical condition, the lack of documentation (unconfirmed mileage) and non-original paint are the challenges to value in my mind. Very interested to know where you guys would peg value. Thanks in advance for your input!

I’ve posted a couple of photos to give a better idea of the condition of the car.

[Macroni]

Sold a 83 SC not as nice for $35,000.....

[COLB]

Very nice looking car.

Looks like it may have had a R134 conversion. Does the A/C work?

A carfax might shed some light on accident history or hint at true mileage if it is in doubt. If the odometer and the rest of the instruments and electronics are working, and the cosmetics match, perhaps the mileage is legit. The steering wheel looks like a low mileage car, but it looks like it might have been recovered when the seats were done.

Coupe, awesome color, if it checks out mechanically, it is hard to see that car not selling in the high-$30s.

I could easily see a dealer marketing it for $45k on the strength of the (unverifiable) odometer reading.

If you like the color, where are you going to find another one?

[Pinball81]

COLB,

Yes, has had a R134 conversion and A/C blows cold. Good eye!

I will pull a Carfax, but I never feel they're too reliable before 1990... records are always very spotty.

Good comment on the steering wheel. I do not recall that it appeared to be newly wrapped, whereas the vinyl on the seats was very noticeably new.

I'm not hearing you or MACRONI suggest that the lack of documentation and repaint are value killers if it is mechanically sound.

And agreed, the color is awesome... not easy to find.

Thanks for the input!

[COLB]

A repaint is not at all a value killer if it is original color, done to standard -- and is probably a bump in value for most cars.

Maintenance records are important, but were much more important when the air-cooled Porsche world was a buyer's market. A lot of the old experienced Porsche guys around here claim they would never buy a car without records -- but in this market, I think a full ownership and maintenance history might be worth a small premium, but it is not a real detractor in value -- because most buyers are not the "old Porsche guys".

That being said, documents matter to substantiate claims of major maintenance (engine, trans rebuilds) if they are part of the value calculation.

You are not going to have much luck negotiating a price down purely because it lacks documentation. But if the seller is trying to justify a price premium for a theoretical engine rebuild that has no record, you should discount that.

[Pinball81]

Good points. I probably put too much value on paint and paperwork. I sold my '82 SC last summer.... It sold in less than 24 hours with multiple full price offers, and sparked some pretty good conversation on the Marketplace forum. It was a clean car and unique color (Mocha Brown) but had been resprayed and had high mileage at 164k with limited documentation. I thought I priced it aggressively, but I absolutely underestimated the market and left money on the table.

I've been spoiled to have decent documentation with nearly all of the cars I've had. I even have paperwork back to the mid-70s on my '69 912.

[Nachtfalter]

Seems like an awful lot of work on a 65k mile car. New headliner?.... why?

[COLB]

Originally Posted by Nachtfalter

Seems like an awful lot of work on a 65k mile car. New headliner?.... why?

Good question. But 30 year old glue and foam deteriorate.

A bad headliner is more likely a symptom of age or a leaky sunroof than an indicator of unreported mileage.

[Pinball81]

Originally Posted by Nachtfalter

Seems like an awful lot of work on a 65k mile car. New headliner?.... why?

Agreed... I think it was a case of "while you're in there". He pulled the glass for the repaint... then decided to replace the gaskets and do the headliner while glass was out.

[Pinball81]

Originally Posted by COLB

Good question. But 30 year old glue and foam deteriorate.

A bad headliner is more likely a symptom of age or a leaky sunroof than an indicator of unreported mileage.

COLB, Good point. He did mention that the sunroof cables had rusted due to leaking from bad seal. Very well could be the cause for the headliner replacement.

[Pinball81]

It's probably worth mentioning that the seller is a mechanical engineer for a major engine manufacturer. As comes with the personality type, he seems to very much a "nuts and bolts" kind of guy who does not like anything even remotely out of spec.