Basketcase 95 993 convertible value??

[JJK78-951]

Good evening gents,

I have a customer who would like me to help him sell his 95 993 convertible, after doing a preliminary inspection on it today the car is really quite a basket case. That said i'm trying to give him the best advice on selling it, either as-is, or putting some money into it first. My initial thoughts are to sell it as-is to someone who knows what they are doing and it could be a decent car. If he has to pay the shop to fix everything that is wrong with it he is in for some major butt hurt!!

Basics & good stuff:

1995 Porsche 993 convertible
Red exterior, black interior
6-speed manual
New convertible top!
No Check engine light!
Thats about it.

Needs & bad stuff:
No carfax yet but i'm sure it has some red marks on it...
Paint is not good, fading, been repainted, only looks to have original paint on 1 rear quarter panel.
Body damage present in small quantities front, back and both sides. Rear looks like it was hit low, some small cracks in bumper etc.
Passenger rocker panel in front of door has small damage, possibly running over a curb?
Drivers side rocker same thing only slightly further back and slightly more damage
Front right 1/4 has light scrapes, fender slightly pushed in.
Front lower has lots of hard curb/parking hits.
Some sanding marks can be seen through many body panels etc.
Incorrect wheels - 964 - Chrome and the chrome is SHOT.
You get the idea, body needs major help.


Major oil leaks, Valve covers, timing boxes, like Niagara Falls.
Seems to need shocks
Brakes are 50%
outter CV boots on both axles torn
Spark plugs wires are showing age and need replacing, probably needs full 90K service, caps, rotors, plugs etc.

There is definitely more to be found as this was all found just via visual inspection, but it is a drivable project car.

At the shop rate I would estimate a minimum of $5,000 in mechanical repairs, plus would guess it needs at least $10,000 or better in body repair and paint.

I'll get some pictures if necessary, but I think you get the idea. Where would you all peg this car in the market place? Or should I say what is bottom dollar for a 993 convertible??

THANKS!
J

[pnut_lee]

$20k

[JJK78-951]

Thanks pnut. Thanks around what I was thinking, I'm gonna have to drop a reality bomb on him tomorrow and see what he says.

[matt930s]

I would say $16-18k based on the assessment....

MattR

[saxen]

Ill give you $6000 sight unseen

[David Borden]

If it had decent compression or leakdown numbers I could see easily giving 20k-25 for it. Its the perfect car for a mechanically inclined enthusiast looking for a driver.

I have the same car but different colors and its an incredible car. You could take care of the major stuff and literally use it as a daily without worry about killing its value or getting a ding. Lots of freedom and fun in that

IF he is willing to sell for 20k ping me.

David

[dienstuhr]

This sounds much better than a "basket case". To me a basket case is something that's beyond hope.

Reference the original usage as describing a soldier who's lost all four limbs :-(

Cheers

d.

[JJK78-951]

Yes this would make for a good daily car that does not lose value, if I could sell this V8 Boxster I've got I'd probably keep it for myself but oh well... Anyone want a V8 Boxster???

Had a quick conversation with the owner this morning and told him $25K is probably top dollar so he is realistic and knows the car needs some TLC, but it's my job to get him the most out of the car so I may still do a little work to it before we put it on the market.

I'm going to drive the car to lunch today and try to finish my assessment this afternoon. I am a bit surprised based on the condition of the exterior, but the interior is actually in pretty good shape. A/C is blowing cold, climate unit works, windows work etc.

I appreciate the help and interest in the car. I'll get some pictures and take a video as well which should be posted tonight. Once I've had a chance to give everything a look i'll post it in the for sale section with a higher asking price or best offer as I would prefer not to deal with Ebay due to flakes and BS but not trying to start a silent auction here.

Thanks!
J

[JJK78-951]

Originally Posted by dienstuhr

This sounds much better than a "basket case". To me a basket case is something that's beyond hope.

Reference the original usage as describing a soldier who's lost all four limbs :-(

Cheers

d.

haha well I may have been a bit harsh in my initial assessment, the car is pretty rough, but definitely not beyond saving!

I was not aware of where the term originated and certainly hope I haven't offended anyone! Thanks for the knowledge~
J

[nota]

as maybe on the ww1 guys

but in the car world
it is a car with the motor/trans in bits in a basket
ie a roller with most of the motor in a basket

not a driveable car needing work like this car

btw how much for the box+ls

[2ndTARGA]

Here's a data point that might help................

1995 Porsche 911 C4 Convertible

[Southbay356]

here is a cheap paint job for it , WRAP it

[2ndTARGA]

Originally Posted by matt930s

I would say $16-18k based on the assessment....

MattR

I agree. Figure out how much it would take to bring it to the level of this low $40's car and subtract. And then you'll still have a history of neglect at best and accidents at worst.




Porsche 911 Carrera 993 Cabriolet 6 Speed New Top Wholesale | eBay

[JJK78-951]

Originally Posted by nota

as maybe on the ww1 guys

but in the car world
it is a car with the motor/trans in bits in a basket
ie a roller with most of the motor in a basket

not a driveable car needing work like this car

btw how much for the box+ls

Basketcase was the wrong word in this case. First impressions are everything and first thing we did was to pull it on a lift to check the oil leaks and saw all the body damage down low, lack of maintenance etc. and wasn't expecting much from it, but I was definitely wrong in this case, it is better then my initial assessment. I'll post some pics and info shortly.

LS Boxster can be had for $42,000 - one hell of a sleeper, if you put the quiet exhaust on that is This is what it sounds like right now - https://youtu.be/DxmPWBN74kc
Feel free to PM me for more info!

Originally Posted by 2ndTARGA

Here's a data point that might help................

1995 Porsche 911 C4 Convertible

Thanks!

Originally Posted by Southbay356

here is a cheap paint job for it , WRAP it

OK, that. is. AWESOME! It is definitely a good candidate for a wrap job, anyone know what a wrap job goes for? I'm sure there are variables but nothing fancy, just to make it look good.
Thanks!

Originally Posted by 2ndTARGA

I agree. Figure out how much it would take to bring it to the level of this low $40's car and subtract. And then you'll still have a history of neglect at best and accidents at worst.

Thats is about where I was figuring it to be a $25Kish car. The mechanical stuff is actually pretty easy work, the body work on the other hand, to do it right and make it tip top again is what hurts this car. I should probably run a carfax just got busy at work today and this car was on the back burner.
Thanks!!
J

[JJK78-951]

Hey everyone,

Ok after driving the car this afternoon and doing a decent walk around it is definitely not as bad as I initially thought. I didn't have as much time as I would like to look over the car today as we got rather busy this afternoon, but I snapped some pictures and made a quick video which I am uploading to youtube now and should be available within the hour. You can find it here: https://youtu.be/BcwP9JN17_0

The sunlight and camera were not getting along well so while I assure you the paint color is somewhat off and in bad need of a wax job, it is not orange like the pictures show

Here is a pick of the car as well as the 2 areas where there is rocker damage:





I have more pictures available on my microsoft one drive here:

https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=315BA54AA5C355E3!1335&authkey=!AJ5WUy9-Bfur1Dg&ithint=folder%2cjpg

I'll report back with more a bit later once I eat some dinner!
Thanks!
J

[Southbay356]

the rocker damage is no big deal on a "driver"

its something that just happens ,

and they have those mud splatter decals you can put on the lower 12 inches

[COLB]

I would say $16-18k based on the assessment....

MattR

Originally Posted by 2ndTARGA

I agree. Figure out how much it would take to bring it to the level of this low $40's car and subtract. And then you'll still have a history of neglect at best and accidents at worst.




Porsche 911 Carrera 993 Cabriolet 6 Speed New Top Wholesale | eBay

While this may be a useful method of thinking about the financial implications of acquiring a car, it is pretty useless as a pricing tool.

I expect 99.99% of sellers would laugh you out of their driveways if you offered them $16k for their running/driving 993 because it needs bodywork, a paintjob, and a rebuild to match a $45k car.

Taken to its logical conclusion, this approach causes you to price cars at well less than the sum of their parts.

[2ndTARGA]

I expect 99.99% of sellers would laugh you out of their driveways if you offered them $16k for their running/driving 993 because it needs bodywork, a paintjob, and a rebuild to match a $45k car.

You're probably right - and then the car would still be in their driveway - sitting atop the "Niagra Falls" of leaked oil.

There is certainly an upper and lower bound for the market value of any car - but that will be determined, ultimately, by the buyer. $25K has been mentioned here as the upper bound and someone looking for a project may very well pay that, or more. However I personally would not pay $25K for a 993 that needs - at a minimum, $15k of work, has a history of neglect, and whatever "red flags" the experienced OP suspects on the CarFax - when I can buy any number of better cared for cars with good PPI's that need little work - for not much more than the anticipated cost of this car plus the repairs.

[COLB]

Originally Posted by 2ndTARGA

You're probably right - and then the car would still be in their driveway - sitting atop the "Niagra Falls" of leaked oil.

There is certainly an upper and lower bound for the market value of any car - but that will be determined, ultimately, by the buyer. $25K has been mentioned here as the upper bound and someone looking for a project may very well pay that, or more. However I personally would not pay $25K for a 993 that needs - at a minimum, $15k of work, has a history of neglect, and whatever "red flags" the experienced OP suspects on the CarFax - when I can buy any number of better cared for cars with good PPI's that need little work - for not much more than the anticipated cost of this car plus the repairs.

I get that. But what individuals might pay represent only a single data point in a universe of prospective car buyers -- and not always informative ones about the market value of a car -- which is what the OP is trying to determine.

You wouldn't pay that because your preference is for a "no stories", straight car -- which is a $40k car -- and presumably, you have enough money to buy one at that price. So you wouldn't pay $25k for a needy car -- therefor you personally are not in the market for a car like this.

That doesn't mean it is worth $16k.

The guy who buys a car like this is a guy who wants a 993, and doesn't have $40k+ to drop on one. And there are a fair number of those people around -- some willing to pay in the mid $20s for a project.

[bobbyp]

Originally Posted by COLB

The guy who buys a car like this is a guy who wants a 993, and doesn't have $40k+ to drop on one. And there are a fair number of those people around -- some willing to pay in the mid $20s for a project.

+1
And as long as it drives and the owner keeps an eye on it this could be a 6-9 month driver and something to work on during the winter months for a couple of winters until it is just like the new owner wants it.

I'm assuming that Niagara Falls is an exaggeration since in the pics and the vid I don't see a trail. Valve cover weeping and the occasional drop of oil is not a big deal for anyone buying at this price point.

Interior is very nice. Engine bay looks good. A/C works.
Put on a proper set of non-chrome Cup 2 wheels - available frequently here, on rennlist or your local craigslist for $600 or so and I'd say $25k would elicit a lot of responses.