SC vs 965s Cams

[RDG]

We're getting to the reassembling faze on my build. Rods rebuilt arp bolts, new bearings, heads done, stock ports and intake man. Bought a gt35r and halfbay intercooler from Turbokraft, also a new waste gate. Now it's time for a cam choice. My plan was for either the SC cams or 964. TK has some other cams that I think are a reworked version of the 964 being called 965s cams. I guess my question is do the 964/965s cams have a lot of lope, this is for a street car, has never and probly will never see the track, how often on the street would I even be on the cams with the 964/964s cams. I'm thinking the SC might be a better street cams but it seems more are going with the newer profile 964. I'm not against more power, he'll that's what I want, were also doing the lightweight clutch setup and the car previously had a new set of GHL headers and a dual out muff. Famous last question, what would you do..

[Black_Hat]

I have had SC cams , I now have TK 965s cams with CIS
the TK 965s cams perform better everywhere than the sc cams , even off boost
Chris can quote some side by side numbers and the increase over SC cams is substantial
I can pull cleanly in 3rd from 5 mph

Forced to Deal with This

[dos531]

Originally Posted by Black_Hat

I have had SC cams , I now have TK 965s cams with CIS
the TK 965s cams perform better everywhere than the sc cams , even off boost
Chris can quote some side by side numbers and the increase over SC cams is substantial
I can pull cleanly in 3rd from 5 mph

Forced to Deal with This

I love the idle on your car

[RDG]

Thanks Black_Hat, how do those cams idel in your car as compared to the SC.

[Black_Hat]

more lope , read my last post in the link above
you will need to valve notch the pistons

[RarlyL8]

If you are only comparing SC to 964 the cam should follow with the turbo.
For example, if you are after street driving torque then the SC cams with K27-7200 or GT30 are a good match, for more power higher in the rev range the 964 cams mate well with K27/29 or GT35.
Both SC and 964 are slide-in, set timing and go, all will need the 930 oil pump drive.

[RDG]

Ya, I allready have the GT35, and your right both cams drop right in. We allready have a nice set of OE SC cams modified ready to go, The 965S cams Chris sells is basicly a very slightly reworked for CIS 964 cam, it's really splitting hairs at this point, looks like about 8hp at 1k rpm higher for the 964/965S to super simplify. Then there's the quality of the cams themselves, The porsche OE being very high. All being said either way is good, I think we will use the SC cams, Smooth idel, OE porsche quality, Even Porsche used them in there Factory X33 package.
Thanks for the replies
R

[Tom F2]

Originally Posted by RarlyL8

If you are only comparing SC to 964 the cam should follow with the turbo.
For example, if you are after street driving torque then the SC cams with K27-7200 or GT30 are a good match, for more power higher in the rev range the 964 cams mate well with K27/29 or GT35.
Both SC and 964 are slide-in, set timing and go, all will need the 930 oil pump drive.

What setting do you use to time the SC cams? On a 77, will this work with stock fuel injection, distributor, Euro exhaust? My car has this set up, and it does not run as well as the stock turbos I have driven. Have to run a too-rich mixture to make the car drivable. Gets terrible gas mileage too. Lots of power on boost, however. The camshafts are from Webcam, so I am only going on faith that they are actually an SC grind.

[quattrorunner]

I use stock fueling, msd ignition and sc cams. There are no problems with running. It runs great. My engine is a 77 3.0 as well.
Timing is 1.6-1.7 on the cams. This is correct setting.

[Tom F2]

Thank you. I forgot to say that I am running a K27-7200, as well.

[RarlyL8]

Tom, your issue may not be cam related. We set the SC cams at top of spec for max torque off boost. The 330hp factory option used these cams as well. They really wake up the engine.

[Alan L]

There is a grind in between the two you are looking at - sometimes called Super SC, or Elgin. If you do a search you should pull up a thread where I had a similar query. These cams got a very enthusiastic response from the users. Might pay to do a search on these before making a decision. Bolt in.
Alan

[RarlyL8]

The grind is called "SC330", they are nice for a mildly modified street 930.

[911nut]

Originally Posted by RarlyL8

If you are only comparing SC to 964 the cam should follow with the turbo.

The bigger issue is matching cams to port sizes. A cam with more lift (like a 964 cam, for example) will be more effective on a bigger port than on a stock port. This is because eventually the valve curtain area will be greater than the intake port area, so adding more valve lift does not allow more mass flow.
Since the turbo is forcing air into the engine, there's a lot of latitude in selecting what turbo to use and cams aren't really going to affect that choice all that much.

[Tippy]

Anyone know the specs on the 965S cams? Curious.

[RarlyL8]

I made the assumption that the turbo chosen matches the engine. On any engine the cams ports redline boost and turbo all need to work together, for a stock engine this means torque oriented cams and mild turbo. Put big cams and big turbo on a stock engine and you get a turd.

[Moriarty]

I'm in the reflexion process for my (euro) 930. It already has a K27-7200 and a 0,9b boost spring, K&N air filter with a new (empty) muffler.
Next step will be a better IC, a BL adjustable Wur and new cams, still wondering which ones between the SC and the 964, after reading this thread it appears to me that the SC should be the best, what do you think ?

[kenikh]

There's always the 993SS cam for those who have big ports, high compression and like a top end rush.

[RarlyL8]

The difference between the SC and 964 cams is the 964 cams move the torque curve about 500rpm to the right on a dyno graph. Decide where you want peak torque and choose the cams and turbo that will accommodate.

[RDG]

I Think Rarly8 sums it up nicely, If I had opened up the intake man and ports and or added compression I would have done the 964/965S cams hands down, but on a stock compression, stock head and man engine i think the SC will work out quite fine. My builder has done a itb 3.4 with stock euro exhaust and SC cams and did over 500hp on a engine dyno so I don't think they will be a limitation in my setup. I just typed in all the specs for all 3 cams then my iPad froze so screw it. If anyone wants to know just look at the porsche cam grinders web sights, the specs are listed there...
-R