Is Motec the Gold Standard in Engine Management

[tailwind22]

9 out of 10 well known 930 shops seem to recommend and use the Motec line of engine management systems. A Motec system seems to be about the most expensive route to go. Is it the gold standard or if not why do so many of the top shops utilize it?

[Raceboy]

Short answer, no.

Most of the vendors just have installed ECU's from the time when MOTEC was prettymuch the only reasonable one, but times have changed a lot.
There areplethora of ECU's that are onpar or better than Motec at much lower price. Few examples: Link G4, Autronic SM4, ViPec, Tatech etc.

And then there are ECU's that can do anything Motec can do on 930 engine (which is ancient and does not require ANY special features from ECU) at the fraction of the price while still having faster CPU's and more modern and easier user interface.
People should choose the ECU mostly based on the skills of his tuner if the owner cannot tune himself. If he can, then suggest to educate yourself and choose the best that suits the needs. No need to overpay.

[RennSport911rsa]

gold standard as far as what? features? stability? reliability? datalogging? customer support?

what is mentioned above is dead on - the tuner makes or breaks whatever pretty box you choose to use. That being said, having owned Motec's before, their level of customer service (at a price of course), and the sheer expertise you get from their staff is the gold standard. I've owned older versions of LINK, Electromotive, AEM, Pectel. My 2 standalones in each play car now are a Motec and a Haltech - and both firms have been exemplary.

The right ecu depends on what you're trying to do with it, and who can service your car with it

[Tippy]

Without going into big detail, I'd say this; if you can afford Motec, go for it. If you can't but want the cheapest EFI on earth (I think) but still want everything Motec offers, go MegaSquirt MS3X.

The brain of all EFI systems is the processor. I bet none of them make their own (could be wrong), rather procure from companies like Samsung, Motorola, etc.

So what you're left with is, is run of the mill SMT components on the printed circuit boards. I'm pretty confident stating the components you find in a Motec are the same as MegaSquirt, SDS, AEM, Haltech, etc.

Now, processor speed. If you have an EFI system that has a billionth-giga-zillionth hertz processor vs a 8MHz processor on a 930 base engine using no options like WG control, NOS control, anti-lag, traction control, etc. do you need all that speed?

Last point, 1000 cell fuel/ignition maps vs a hundred cell maps. At WOT, there's virtually no hp gain having tons of cells to adjust. Under WOT, there would be gains to be had with tons of cells, but are you willing to pay a tuner to tune for hours upon hours?

That's the questions I think have to be asked.

[tailwind22]

There are some good thoughts here. One that I didn't really focus on is that a 930 with all the bells possible is still a basic set up in the modern engine management world. One of the posts also mentioned tuner support from the factory which would be my guess as to what made Motec so popular with many speed shops.

[Uncle]

As others have said what do you need in an ECU?

If you only require basic controls I don't think MoTec M600's are very good value for money. They are very very good ECU's but the simple fact is as others have stated there are plenty of others that are going to do the same thing for less money down.
It's almost laughable that Motec give you "free" 8 hours use of the wideband lambada control and Data logging when you first start the motor then after that 8 hours you have to pay to unlock it.

If you like playing around with stuff they are good fun though. The Motec user interface is quite easy to use and understand. I've been playing around in it over the last few days and found it as easy to use as the Haltec program.

[Tippy]

Wow! You have to pay for wideband? That's nuts.....

[voitureltd]

Originally Posted by Tippy

Wow! You have to pay for wideband? That's nuts.....

I did not know that. We are re tuning a Motec now. Hope it does not get over limit. They seem not shy when it comes to the extra $$ deal!! Must not have much memory. I have old Electromotive Tech 1 that i just sent in to unlock or something. My dyno shop cannot get it to rewrite the fuel or ignition map. Same business model??

[Uncle]

From the Motec site.

Data Logging
Allows recording of all ECU data to the 512 kB internal logging memory and analysing the data with MoTeC's i2 Standard software. This option is enabled for a free evaluation period of the first 8 hours engine running time.

Pro Analysis
Provides access to advanced i2 Pro data analysis software with multiple graph overlays, X-Y plots, advanced maths functions, synchronised video (manual alignment), and flexible layouts to accommodate virtually any user preference. Requires the Data Logging upgrade.

Wideband Lambda
Allows the use of the on-board wideband Lambda controller for NTK UEGO or Bosch LSU sensors. Available in single version, expandable to the dual version. The single version is enabled for a free evaluation period of the first 8 hours engine running time.

MoTeC > M600 > Upgrade

[Uncle]

Oh and if you want to have a look at the how the tuner interface looks download the program at the bottom of the page. Once you intsall it you can look at the sample page etc.
Must be one of the only things they have ever given away for free!

Saying that you can do the same thing from the Haltec site.

[Tippy]

Quote de Tippy

Wow! You have to pay for wideband? That's nuts.....

I did not know that. We are re tuning a Motec now. Hope it does not get over limit. They seem not shy when it comes to the extra $$ deal!! Must not have much memory. I have old Electromotive Tech 1 that i just sent in to unlock or something. My dyno shop cannot get it to rewrite the fuel or ignition map. Same business model??

"Unlock" sounds like pain in the electronics world. Yuck

[spence88mph]

They look so nice and they're Australian, so I'm behind Motec all the way, all the other systems will simply rob you of hp. They're the Rolex of ECUs, well recognized, well, supported, well branded, good for bragging rights but many options just as good if not better out there.

[rsscotty]

MoTeC > M84 > Overview

[Spenny_b]

Originally Posted by spence88mph

They look so nice and they're Australian, so I'm behind Motec all the way, all the other systems will simply rob you of hp. They're the Rolex of ECUs, well recognized, well, supported, well branded, good for bragging rights but many options just as good if not better out there.

spence88mph --> In what way?

OP - I'm with the guys above who say it's mostly with the outfit you chose to map it. You could pay thousands on the latest super-fast CAN-bus enabled brain, but if nobody supports it, has experience of it, etc. then it's pointless, you won't be getting the best out of it.

I'd also throw in the consideration of reliability/stability....this thing has utter control over your tens-of-thousands of dollar engine. If it decides to s**t itself - code error, hw error, whatever...then its *potentially* your engine going bang before you've even realised it. Forget any further interactions/support/comebacks with the ECU vendor, too late for that despite any help they may offer.

I've chosen MBE for my build - British designed and built (yay ) simply because I've run that brand for 18/19yrs on another toy, a very good pal of mine is going to be mapping it, who has over 20yrs of experience with it and is pretty much part of MBE's development team, so for me it doesn't get much better than that.

If that option weren't there, then I'd probably go AEM through Chris @ Turbokraft, as we've been working closely on my project.

Just my 2p.

Spencer.

[Raceboy]

Originally Posted by Spenny_b

If that option weren't there, then I'd probably go AEM through Chris @ Turbokraft, as we've been working closely on my project.

Regarding AEM, it is one of the systems I would never put on my car. I just tuned a fully built Supra with PnP AEM for Supra (Series 1 with latest firmware) and nevermind the user interface which is a joke regarding user friendliness and functionality (not talking about eye candy), but it also has random weird behaviour like having 1500 rpm idle instead of specified 800 rpm out of the blue which cures by restarting the engine to few other fuel related issues which makes you think that ECU had a mind of its own.

[RarlyL8]

I've hears soooooo many Motec (and others) nightmare stories. I would never even consider EFI unless doing it all myself.

[Miguel Antonett]

^^^ +1.

[aschen]

I would think even the absolute most basic EFI unit has orders of magnitude more adjustability and functionality than CIS.

With this in mind it seems to me the primary feature I would want in an ecu is reliabilty.

of course, I dont really have any experience with these things.

[nocarrier]

Originally Posted by Raceboy

Regarding AEM, it is one of the systems I would never put on my car. I just tuned a fully built Supra with PnP AEM for Supra (Series 1 with latest firmware) and nevermind the user interface which is a joke regarding user friendliness and functionality (not talking about eye candy), but it also has random weird behaviour like having 1500 rpm idle instead of specified 800 rpm out of the blue which cures by restarting the engine to few other fuel related issues which makes you think that ECU had a mind of its own.

I came very close to going with AEM but didn't like the user interface either.

[onboost]

Hmmm.. lots of good talk about EFI/ECU's.. However, let's not forget the harnesses which can cause major issues with trouble shooting and/erratic behavior due nicked or pinched wires, or poorly connected/terminated end points. Oh, and they can be a beeeyatch to track down!

Just food for thought..