Is an engine rebuild possible for a complete novice mechanic?

[Neil Harvey]

Its Friday night after Thanksgiving and what else is there to do.

Someone way smarter and wiser than me, once said, "there is nothing to fear but fear itself".

Mount Everest was conquered, we landed on the moon having never done either before, too. And each of those are far more difficult that rebuilding one of these engines. These engines have a couple of unique querks but are not hard at all. You want to start on something more difficult, I can suggest some.

Don't get the cost of tools mixed into the mix of how hard is it going to be. In my first post I suggested building this on paper first. I can and many others can also, tell you want tools you will need. The cost of tools has nothing to do with your passion level. Passion will overcome any obstacle, cost or fear.

Each of us has different levels of fear and passion. I guess you have to decide where you lie in that scale.

Trust me when I say this, take your time, understand every step before you tackle it and if you have doubts, stop, rethink it and if required, redo. Ask and and all questions along the way. Know that every question you get answered, you will create 3 more. Help is available here and as I have offered, I will help any way I can.

You will have limitations for sure unless you decide to go into this full time and spends hundreds of thousands on tooling and machinery. These are areas you can identify and get outside help. You can save thousands on the disassembly, cleaning and assembly. As for tools, there isn't a huge list that you will need. Many here will loan and help out as well. You may even be able to borrow an engine stand. You need one for the disassembly and the assembly. In between it will be used to hang parts that get painted.

Another consideration, may be to have some else do the long block disassembly, cleaning, machine work and you assemble the engine. You at least get the satisfaction of accomplishing that.

[VFR750]

I did.

It was stressful and I had to do four top ends before it was done. 100% related to nikasil plated cylinders.

You might plan on this taking a long time, but it’s like college: a lot of work and stress to get an “A” in engine rebuilding.

Willingness to take it apart if it isn’t right.

Money. Cutting corners to save money is a fool’s errand. Your car is only worth 1/4 of the total. Engine and transmission 3/4. What you put into it will be what it is worth.

Track all expenses with receipts.

Record all measurements

Take a billion pictures. Especially after you apply adhesive, but before to clamp/bolt the two parts together.

Years later, you will not be afraid of the next one.

[ahh911]

"Years later, you will not be afraid of the next one."

That's an important point, you'll have freedom once you're comfortable having done it once to say casually, yeah, okay i can drop the engine and fix this or that without having to worry about dropping the car off and leaving it for a week or two while you wonder if it's sitting outside overnight. If I paid 25000$ to rebuild, I don't think I'd be driving it to near redline at every empty intersection, at every opportunity... Unless something flies through the side of the engine, I'll fix it, you have an 81 sc, pretty tough bottom end. That gives you freedom, unless of course you've got cash to burn, then that's freedom too!

I'd say earliest scenario is it's done by August next year, but March 2023 would be the right timeframe for my first time, that's the level of patience I required if started this time of year.

Phil

81scl

[chrismorse]

I'm about to do it, but i've been a car guy for almost 60 years.

This job is a major undertaking, you need tools, space, CASH, TIME, MORE CASH and a real desire and commitment to spend enough time researching, understanding what is going on and WHY clearances, cleanliness and planning the rebuild really matter. Not to beat the point into the ground, but this takes a devoted interest - and time.

End of Rant - I love cars, i'm 73, got a lift in my garage - my dad's 74 coupe and an old dirty 77 308 ferrari - for you to have a happy outcome, you gotta be committed/really interested, have the cash and hopefully a local guru, (like i have - Trackrash) that can answer your questions/ loan you tools and lend a hand with the difficult bits.

I am all for self reliance, exploring new things, but if you lack the commitment, space, (and spousal support :-), this might be a good thing to farm out, or partially farm out.

As you have seen, there is a huge availability of the most experienced and qualified help rooting for you to have fun and do it. Does it work for you???

With a lot of optimism and good willl,
chris

[VFR750]

After I finally got done in 2016, I drove it extremely hard for two years.

I know exactly what is right. Especially Rod bolts and lighter pistons meant I set my own redline at 7500. Many track days

After two years, just for the fun of it, I did another top end, with ported heads and a bigger cam. Then did more track days.

In all I have single handed over 8 removals and reinstallation. I have lost count. Under two hours out. Two hours in.

Oh, and then I decided to rebuild my broken transmission.

All the things I did and learned from 2013 to now we’re the first time I did anything like that.

Planning, mental practice, and reading will only get you so far. Jumping in is when it gets real.

And then you will understand why a shop doing a rebuild for $25-30k is a reasonable sum.

[dannobee]

You could always sign up for one of Tony's classes. At the very least you'll walk away with a better understanding of whether it's doable for YOU.

911 engines aren't the most simple engines out there to overhaul, that's for sure. And "book time" for an overhaul by a seasoned veteran is about 60 hours labor. If you haven't done much mechanical stuff before, multiply that by 4-5, at least. Even then, there's a lot of down time waiting for things like parts and machine shop work.

As mentioned before, there are a few special tools necessary, but even those can be overcome with some ingenuity and thought. Many of us have performed repairs at the race track with what we had available, when our own special tools are hundreds of miles away.

And don't forget that a disassembled 911 engine takes up a LOT of room in your garage, and at some point the car itself being in the garage is a burden for precious room. At the dealership, we had the luxury of keeping the car high up on the lift, but still had dedicated engine carts for all of the ancillary parts and a clean room for engine assembly.

[TwoBluPorsches]

Ideally, enlist the help of someone who has done it before.

There are several steps that are best done with more than two hands.
It is helpful to have an experienced eye look over the parts you plan to use monitor your progress and give you feedback. Plan to hear, "not clean enough" multiple times.

There are bound to be local experts in the club that you can talk with and likely convince one to come over and look at your progress, answer questions and help with some of the steps.

First engine I rebuilt was a 911 engine, early 1990's. I was able to enlist the help of the inimitable poster Walt Fricke.

Wayne's book didn't exist, no youtube videos to watch, and I didn't have a forum full of information available. (perhaps a blessing)

[boyt911sc]

Originally Posted by TwoBluPorsches

Ideally, enlist the help of someone who has done it before.

There are several steps that are best done with more than two hands.
It is helpful to have an experienced eye look over the parts you plan to use monitor your progress and give you feedback. Plan to hear, "not clean enough" multiple times.

There are bound to be local experts in the club that you can talk with and likely convince one to come over and look at your progress, answer questions and help with some of the steps.

First engine I rebuilt was a 911 engine, early 1990's. I was able to enlist the help of the inimitable poster Walt Fricke.

Wayne's book didn't exist, no youtube videos to watch, and I didn't have a forum full of information available. (perhaps a blessing)

TwoBlu,

Having Walt Fricke is like playing a pick up basketball game with Lebron James in your team. Walt is an incredible troubleshooter with very impressive experience.

Tony

[deftom]

It's depend of how much you want to rebuild it.

But if you are not very excited by the adventur and money "is not an issu", let someone rebuilt it for you.

+ if you do not have tools, you will "loose" this money on bying thoses tools

[Classic11]

I think what Black993 stated is very important to understand :"Your hands need to be experienced in how to do certain things and how those things are supposed to feel. I don't know how else to put it."

I agree that everything can be studied and experience is #1 but some just have the feel and some don't lets be honest. If you don't have it all you do is question every decision or step you just finished, this is where the stress comes in. I have rebuilt many engines, I started with VW water cooled, many many muscle cars and in recent years focused on just the beloved 911 aircooled. Many builders here in the US have commented here and I really do not question them but having build many different engines, the 911 engine is for sure not the easiest or even one of the easier ones. Yes, it's simple but there are many many parts and therefore many many mistakes that can be made. I am fortunate that its a hobby for me and i can take as much time as I want and need, that is the other very important part in my opinion.
To summ it up, i would not recommend you building your engine with the experience you have.

[911SCRVA]

I am astounded at how much thought and advice this group has given me. Thank you.

I don't know what I'm going to do, but, to address one comment, the thought of rebuilding the engine myself was, yes, initially sparked by cost, but, more deeply, a desire to learn the engine. I have an immense respect for the car and car--and also those who know how to work on it. I would like to rebuild the engine, but, at the same time, I don't want to make a catastrophic mistake mid-rebuild.

You've given me a lot to think about. Once I've explored all the options, I'll be sure to let you know how I'm proceeding.

Again, thank you all very much for your responses.

[Neil Harvey]

Originally Posted by 911SCRVA

I am astounded at how much thought and advice this group has given me. Thank you.

I don't know what I'm going to do, but, to address one comment, the thought of rebuilding the engine myself was, yes, initially sparked by cost, but, more deeply, a desire to learn the engine. I have an immense respect for the car and car--and also those who know how to work on it. I would like to rebuild the engine, but, at the same time, I don't want to make a catastrophic mistake mid-rebuild.

You've given me a lot to think about. Once I've explored all the options, I'll be sure to let you know how I'm proceeding.

Again, thank you all very much for your responses.

At times, I am drawn into helping those that touch a certain part of my soul. I did this for Jeff in Australia. I am offering to help here in a similar fashion.

I am now located in central Florida, not that far from where you are. Maybe there is a way to help you with some in person schooling.

Contact me directly and we can discuss some options.

nh

[DaveA]

LMN Motorsports in Virginia Beach, (757) 947-1451, is an excellent shop. Google LMN Motorsports. Lutzo, the owner, has won the 24 hours of Daytona as a crew chief. Dave

[Jeff Alton]

Lots of good posts here.

Yes, you can do it.

You need all of the correct tools. You need to completely understand each assembly operation and what you are checking and doing during each operation. Every engine builder at one time built their first engine. So the thought that you need experience is moot.

Sure, buy Wayne's book, research the forum for ideas. But in both cases know enough to find out what advice not to follow in both cases.

Call up or email an engine builder and ask for advice. We all likely did it at one point in our careers. Neil has offered help, Henry would likely lend you his ear too. As would I.

If you are going to do it, commit to doing it "right". We have seen DIY rebuilds that were well done and ones where the fellow should not even have attempted it. Pick who you want to be. If you are willing to invest in the correct tools, find a good source for the head rebuilding and other specialty machine work, then give it a go. But don't mess around. If you are not 100% committed, don't start.

Cheers

[hcoles]

I DIY'ed the top end. I don't think I would recommend it if you don't have long history of DIY on mechanical processes and have knowledge of mechanical things in general. For example: torquing nuts and bolts, how O rings work, cleaning threads, use of never-seize, getting and keeping things clean, when a proper tool is needed compared to when using a make-shift tool will be okay, pressing in seals, what items should be triple checked, use of measuring tools and 100 things I'm forgetting. If you can find a pro to do the rebuild after all the sheet metal/etc. is taken off that would be my suggestion. When you have a pro (e.g. Henry Schmidt) do this work they know all this along with how things feel when they go together. They also know many places where the design can be easily improved - the DIY'er is not likely to know these points. Remember there are lots of places for oil to leak. All that being said. There is a certain pride of tackling this yourself and it adds to the experience of owning and getting to know the car.

[Henry Schmidt]

Originally Posted by DaveA

LMN Motorsports in Virginia Beach, (757) 947-1451, is an excellent shop. Google LMN Motorsports. Lutzo, the owner, has won the 24 hours of Daytona as a crew chief. Dave

Not to knock anyone's knowledge but race care crew chief is no indication of mechanical expertise.
I once had an IndyCar crew chief of the year (1990s) work for me as a line mechanic. Great guy, infinite contacts but useless on the line.
I once asked him to clean up the wiring on a track 914/6. After about two hours he came to me looking for a new harness. Right way to do it? maybe if there was actually a replacement available. He was used to just calling Lola for a new harness.

[88911coupe]

I rebuilt mine, but I have to say I've been monkeying around with cars since I was 16, With that said I'd never done ANYTHING close to rebuilding a Porsche engine so, IMHO, you certainly can do this. Just have the mindset to focus and follow Wayne's book. Of course the resources here will be invaluable when you come across something that does not make sense or needs clarification. Go for it, I VERY much enjoyed the project.

[catuck]

I may be heading into similar territory, so you're not alone. Getting my 3.2 ready to install, half a head bolt fell out (had exhaust valve cover off to replace a stud). So, while I've done everything else on my restoration, and swapped the 3.2 for the original 2.7, I've never cracked a 911 engine. Rebuilt a Chevy 350 with my dad 34 years ago, but that doesn't count for much. I ordered Wayne's book and I'll read it to decide if it's something I think I can tackle. With 90k miles +/- on an otherwise very healthy engine I have to decide how far to go, and what performance upgrades I want to/can do.

[Jameel]

I'd say go for it. Lots of balanced opinions here from experienced folks. You have to sort of discover who those people are though from spending lots of time reading here. They will become apparent. Henry's advice on finding a mentor and following their advice will save you from a lot of worrying and over analysis. Wayne's book is indispensable.

Most important advice I can offer is to be patient, and enjoy every step of the process. Don't rush it. Do the research until you find the answers, and if you have to pick from several answers, most the time they are all correct, just slightly different. Example. Carrera tensioners. I'm running them on my car. My brother's 911 does not have them, but we did Jerry Wood's mod to his when we rebuilt his tensioners. Two approaches, both work fine.

You will gain an incredible amount of knowledge and confidence and it will affect how you drive and enjoy your car for the better.

Here's my threads:

Broken head stud. Feeling sort of sick right now...

Rebuilding my '83 3.0

[stownsen914]

I was a complete novice when I did my first engine years ago. I guess that's the case for all of us as first timers . It can be done with research and care.