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Headrage's Avatar
 
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'77 2.7 Basic Rebuild

Total noob here and this may be a lame or un-answerable question

I was wondering if anyone has a ball park figure on what a basic (if there is such a thing) rebuild of a '77 2.7 would run if I performed all of the labor with the exception of the machine work?

Is it possible to do a top end only refresh?

Thanks...
Old 11-28-2005, 08:46 AM
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If it's a typical 2.7 that needs case work, valve guides, new studs, tensioner upgrades, etc. I'd budget $6,000 to $8,000.

Why do you think a top end "refresh" would suffice? Have you done compression and leak down tests?
Old 11-29-2005, 08:58 PM
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Basic rebuild in the UK is about 3k.

The labour on that is about 35hrs @ 40. so around half the cost.
the rest is parts and machining.

There is no reason (with the engine out) you cant do the stripping. The only thing you need to do is

1. Keep everything
2. Keep your eye out for anything untoward.

The cleaning cleaning cleaning and more cleaning is normally the labour intensive bit.

You could however put your heads, B&P a and cases in a big box, send them to a machine shop and say

hey - can you skim the heads flat, put new guides in and build them up oh and whilst you are at it, pop the other bits in the cleaner for me. Bank on a nice friendly 500 or so and hey presto
your bits come back shiny and heads built up.

The you build it back up yourself.
Have an expert on hand for tools and torque settings.
there is enough advice in the pelican mans book to get you through this.

personally I would always have someone do the cam timing for me.

Parts , seals, rubbers, rings and stuff is likely to cost you about 800-1200 dependant on the engine.

All in, you can probably save yourself 1k of labour, however dont forget that having a workshop do it they get it in and out of the car, get it running, get it right and stand by it afterwards if it blows to smithereens. there is value in that.

however, there is also value in doing it yourself if you dont mind your car being off the road longer than it needs be.

If in doubt do half. get it out, strip it, get it machines then get the experts to re-assemble it and get it running.


p.s. cant talk for US prices but work durations should be relative.
Old 11-30-2005, 01:49 AM
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Headrage,

I just rebuilt my 2.7 myself. The prices quoted by Jim Sims are accurate. If you are unsure about rebuilding your own engine, I'd check out Supertec:

http://www.supertecperformance.com/engines.phtml

Henry lists a 2.7 long block for $7200 - less if you can re-use your old cylinders and pistons (I did). And you get a 2 year warranty which includes no leaks.

Just consider both approaches (DIY or Professional), and be realistic about your abilities and what you want to end up with after spending this kind of money.

Rex
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Old 11-30-2005, 05:14 AM
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Why do you think a top end "refresh" would suffice? Have you done compression and leak down tests? [/B][/QUOTE]

I'm actually just trying to prepare myself for the worst. The car has a leak of some kind. Either exhaust or head. I just had it towed to my mechanic today so I should know later today or tomorrow.

I'm hoping hard that it is an exhaust leak..
Old 11-30-2005, 02:46 PM
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I just found out this afternoon that it is a head leak.

Pulled the lover valve cover and found one of the head nuts laying sideways in it's hole.

It's either a pulled stud or somebody really screwed up when the motor was put back together.
Old 12-01-2005, 04:28 PM
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Sorry to tell you Headrage, but that's the sign of a pulled head stud. That's pretty run of the mill for these mag cased 2.7L engines. You will need to rebuild your case. Consider my above post for a couple of options. You could try to re-torque the head nuts, and it may last long enough for you to buy another motor. Be careful what you buy - you will get a lot of advice to buy a 3.0L aluminum block motor, but that may need rebuilding also. That said, if you need options, this is the place to find them - lots of really good advice available here.

Best luck - Rex.
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Old 12-01-2005, 05:01 PM
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The thing that I don't understand is that this motor was torn down not more than 30,000 miles ago. It was updated with the oil fed tensioners and the cams look new. Why the heck weren't the studs addressed?

Jeez!!!

Thanks guys...
Old 12-01-2005, 05:07 PM
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Headrage,

Your first post asked about only doing a top end rebuild. Lots of people with these mid year cars are looking for the cheap way out. I doubt that your car received the needed upgrades to the engine case because they cost more than the car is worth. For me, I look at what it would cost to buy another car. I decided to rebuild the motor, new interior, and a paint job, instead of buying a newer car that I am not interested in. You'll have to decide for yourself whether you want to fix a great car, or cut your losses and move on. If you decide to fix it - you can look at it as an investment. It's a lot of money to get a good rebuild - but you get what you pay for. These engines can last a long time when done right. This is a DIY forum - I think most would vote to fix it right and enjoy it for years. Spend the money up front on quality, and it will pay off in the long run.

Rex
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Old 12-01-2005, 05:37 PM
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Lots of people with these mid year cars are looking for the cheap way out.

I'm looking to rebuild "THIS" motor and keep it. I hear too many horror stories about people that want more but are only willing to pay less and they keep coming back. I have no problem with fixing what is wrong with this motor and moving on.

I'm not willing to start over.

Thanks Rex...
Old 12-01-2005, 05:44 PM
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I doubt that your car received the needed upgrades to the engine case because they cost more than the car is worth.

C'mon, installing case savers while the motor is torn down can't run it up that much...
Old 12-01-2005, 05:46 PM
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Headrage,

You're right - that sounds wrong. I meant to say that the entire engine rebuild could be more than the car is worth. As for why people don't fix the case - it's a big $$$ part of a rebuild. You might be able to buy a good aluminum case for what it costs to fix a mag case 2.7L.

Rex
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Old 12-01-2005, 05:53 PM
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I'm gonna stick with the original case as long as I can....

Thanks.
Old 12-01-2005, 06:35 PM
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The good side is...once you have your mag case all sorted out it will be good for a very long time....and science it was done 30,000 miles ago maybe they put in new ?/?///???? you will have to look and see.
Just make sure you put in ALL the updates right down to get rid of thermal crap if you have it.
throw all the exhaust valves away and start with new guides.
check you line bore, case warp, oil mod, extra goop on last main bearing on assy.
a good idea is case dowel pins ask- Henry...he wont lead astray
Course there are lots of other things that need to be address but are too common to bring them all to the for
Old 12-02-2005, 10:31 AM
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I bought a basket case 74 911 Targa, so I new it was going to need a rebuild. A good quality rebuild on a 2.7 makes it as reliable any any other motor. You just need to make sure the weaknesses are addressed and it's a great time to do upgrades. For me the machine shop bill was one of the biggest expenses, but this will address a lot of the problem areas. Don't scrimp on the machine shop work. I used German Precision in San Jose, beautiful work. Upgrades included RS pistons and cylinders, Carrera oil fed tensioners, 3.0 fuel distributer from a euro car and installed a oil pump from a 3.2. All told I'm into the motor for $6400 and I did the work. I wanted to keep my car completely original, so that's why I went this route.
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Old 12-05-2005, 03:38 PM
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Just an update: I took the car to my mechanic for a diagnosis and possible solution(s) and he asked me to leave it with him for a couple of days. I stopped by today and he told me that the heads re-torqued with absolutely no problem. I started it up and it was nice and quite. The big question I have now is, is this the symptom of head studs pulling out. Stud pulls, nut loosens, re-torque, okay for awhile, stud pulls, nut loosens, etc., etc. Or when they go do they just give it up all at once?

Thanks
Old 12-05-2005, 04:28 PM
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They seem to slowly go...like that...Check your Private messages too.
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Old 12-05-2005, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by YTNUKLR
They seem to slowly go...like that...Check your Private messages too.
Sent you a message.

Thanks,

Allan
Old 12-05-2005, 06:55 PM
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I have a 77 ROW 2.7 - according to all records the head studs were never replaced yet they are metal. ???
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Old 12-05-2005, 09:04 PM
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