Pre-Treatment for Paper Gaskets

[Porsche_monkey]

I'm no Henry Schmidt. I'm probably not even a ChrisBennet, but I do like to see an oil-tight case and transmission when I do a rebuild.

On several occasions I have installed paper gaskets dry and found that they weep just a bit. This is mostly on the timing chain covers, but I'm asking this as a general question.

(I remove or fix and scratches, and I keep everything really clean.)

What is the best pre-treatment for paper gaskets? I have most of the usual suspects on hand: Curil-T, Hylomar, Yamabond, Loctite 518, and high temperature grease. Does it really matter, maybe almost any of these would work, or is there something better?

I'm open to suggestions.

[neilca]

I like to use grease on the paper gaskets. It softens them up and makes disassembly possible without tearing the gaskets. I do this on gearbox gaskets and carb gaskets.

Hope that helsp,
neilca

[Porsche_monkey]

I'm not saying it won't work, but I am reluctant to use a pre-treatment that is soluble in oil.

[WERK I]

I have a personal preference for Curil T. It's non-hardening, nice tack. Smear it (don't gob it on) evenly around the gasket, put it place and it stays there. Comes off easily during teardown.

[Porsche_monkey]

That was the way I was leaning, and I believe it was ChrisBennit's suggested solution, until I read that he is using Loctite 518 recently.

Perhaps Henry will chime in here. He has more experience than most of us combined.

[euro911sc]

When Chris and I rebuilt my tranny I'm pretty sure we used the locktite... it was a long time ago and it was a red bottle. no leaks like 5+ years later though!!

What ever you do... DON't use RTV trust me on that one. Having torn an engine down that someone had used RTV to seal everything on, including paper gaskets, it aint pretty! And it didn't stop the leaks anyway!

Best regards,

Michael

[ChrisBennet]

Obviously, I'm no expert. I still have a motor out there that is leaking so I'm no authority on leak free motors (but I have done another half dozen that don't leak).

For transmission gaskets I use Loctite 518 (red toothpaste gel) or Curil T rubbed into the gasket like suntan lotion (not applied to the transmission case). Otherwise the paper seems to wick fluid.


For the "paper" gaskets on motors I don't use anything except for the chainbox to cam carrier gasket behind the cam thrust plate. I use the high tack spray John Walker recommends now, before that I would use something sticky to hold the gasket in place (518)

For the chain box to case I get the thickest gaskets I can get and that seems to work.

I put the chainbox cover gaskets on dry also - unless they leak and then I grit my teeth and use some Curil T.

The "trick" to leak free gaskets is getting the surface so clean and flat that it would almost seal with no gasket. Gooping sealant on is no substitute for that.
Covers can be flattened with a large piece of marble counter top (the give the sink cutouts away for free) and a big sheet of sandpaper. Shaun Budka (Shaun 84 Targa) showed me that trick.

Scratches in the sealing surface can be filled with JB Weld,
-Chris

[Porsche_monkey]

I stopped reading after the 'I'm no expert part'. Just kidding.

Does anyone know the name of the spray John Walker uses?

Thanks for suggestions. I had previously polished my valve covers in a similar manner (they still leaked a bit) but I had not considered doing the chain covers, I'll try it soon enough.

[SP2]

JW told me to use K&Y Copper Gasket Spray. I used it on my first engine build just recently, and my engine is bone dry. I used it on everything paper: tranny, all covers. Except the cam shaft plate triangular paper gasket I used Curil-T. In Seattle you get it at Action Auto Supply on Aurora. I have also seen a can of copper gasket spray at Napa, but Napa brand. It is probably the same stuff.

[Porsche_monkey]

Do you spray the case or both sides of the gasket?

[tctnd]

I'll weigh in for Hylomar. It is absolutely not oil-soluble but cleans up easily after disassembly. It takes longer to apply than sprays like coppercote but I think it's worth the slight additional effort.
regards,
Phil

[SP2]

I spray both sides. I take a sheet of tin foil and crinkle it up a little so the gasket is contacting very little of the foil. Then I lay the gasket on one side and spray it enough that it is still thin but all you see is copper. Then I flip it over and repeat. Then I carefully pick it up by the edges and it is ready to go. I put it on the studs right away, but let it dry a minute before I slide it down the studs, put the cover on and torque it down. We had our local XXX breakfast club today. After the long drive, I checked again and still bone dry (just installed the engine 2 weeks ago.)

[Porsche_monkey]

I like Hylomar, but it not as easy to find as it used to be. Not sure why.

[Henry Schmidt]

We moisten gaskets with Loctite 574.
Not a bead, or slurry but a very thin coat of 574. We use a clean plastic tray, lay the gasket/s in the tray and rub the Loctite into the gasket with a finger tip. This leaves it wet but not coated.

If the gasket being sealed is constantly being disassembled and assembled (I.E.: race trans) we use Curil T.

[Porsche_monkey]

Thank-you Henry. I will give that a try.

[ischmitz]

I have used Hylomar blue successfully on paper gaskets for the 915. My understanding is that is lubricates the gaskets rather than fliiling gaps.

But then again I am a far cry from an expert

[Porsche_monkey]

Just an update on Hylomar: No longer sold by Permatex, but I found it at Napa under part number 8100.