Aurel`s engine rebuild thread
 

That is it, I took the plunge. A month after purchasing a house with a garage, my long overdue engine rebuild has started,with the engine drop that went rather well this week-end. On my to do list are:
- Broken headstuds
- Carrera tensionner
- Valve guides
- 1st and 2nd syncro gears
- Differential bearing

The car is a 78SC Targa with 110,000 miles
Of course, the list may grow as I start tearing things down...
I will go slow, at least the whole winter, and plan on taking many pictures and post my questions and experiences in this thread.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1191196287.jpg

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1191196310.jpg

Regards,

Aurel

Welcome to the club! Good luck.

I can guarantee the list will grow.....

Update: I`ve removed the CIS, and separated the gearbox. It was uneventful, but boy, is this thing filthy...I can see major oil leaks already. Some serious cleaning sessions are ahead of me...

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1191459658.jpg

Think about how much lighter the engine will be, and how much cooler it will run with all of the gunk gone...

You are a lot cleaner than I was after I dropped mine!

Do a search for differential bearing replacement. Depending on which bearings it will require the use of a special and expensive(like 2k) tool. It has been discussed at length.

The only thing I forgot was the speedo cable, fortunatley I caught it on my last check before lowering.

Hi Do you mean this tool;


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1191508353.jpg


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1191508387.jpg

regards mike

Aurel,
Lurking on your thread with great interest.

A couple of "just curious" questions. What reference books do you have at your finger tips for this project? I assume perhaps Wayne's Engine Rebuilding book and a Bentley manual? But do you have Porsche factory manuals? Other?

Second, assuming you have a regular 40 hour, 8-5-ish job - are you working on the engine rebuild daily? How long do you think you are able to spend on the work daily or weekly? It has been years since I've done any serious engine rebuilding work and back then it was small block Chevys...so obviously not much translates. I have been doing brake jobs of course and and relatively minor work for years which has me wondering if I have the long term stamina to do this job myself? I can be anal retentive as hell and very organized which; according to Wayne's book, is helpful and even necessary but I wonder about my tenactiy, stick-to-it-ness?!

I think your good on the stick-to-it-tive-ness.

As far as books, I have the two Wayne books, and the Haynes manual. I do not have the Bentley, but I`ve heard good things about it. As far as time, I leave home at 7 am and back at 6:30 pm. I can work about two hours every evening when my 18 mo daugther is sleeping. Basically, I would be watching TV if I was not in the garage. It forces me to a slow pace, but that is good because I can read to prepare each session. Monday night, I separated the gearbox and removed the CIS. Tonight, I removed the fan, shroud and wiring harness. On the week-end, I may be able to spend 6 hours/day. Also, I have access to a machine shop at work, which is very cool. Finally, I have saved about $5k for the whole rebuilt. We shall see if I blow the budget or not. For the tenacity, my day job is in research, so tenacity is something I know about. I think the secret is to enjoy the rebuild as a hobby, as much as driving the car. Luckily, I drove it for 5 years, so having it off the road for a while is ok.


Aurel

Yup. First unexpected finding: my fan housing is badly cracked. I will need a replacement one. I`ll post pics later.

Aurel

That's funny. What did I say/writethat has you thinking that? Probably the 4000 posts, huh? Naw, that just means I spend too much time on the computer!

Aurel, Sounds like you are spending about the same amount of time I would be able to spend if I take it on. Your budget sounds a bit low based on what I've read about the likely need for new P/C's. You are assuming you have Nickasils? I have an experienced Porsche friend who owns his own shop and claims to have successfully rebuilt a number of Alusil engines using the original P/C's and new Goetze rings. I know that this is the subject of a LOT of controversy here....and I'm not trying to resurrect that argument. But wondering what are you plans in that regard?

If I do this I pretty much plan on buying new...that same friend has offered to get new P/C's for me at his wholesale price! Plus I just wouldn't want to go through as much time/work/worry as an engine rebuild represents and later regret not having used new. My plan would be to clean, rebuild, update, blast or paint, etc EACH sub-assembly as I remove it from the engine, package it for preservation until the rebuild was complete and set it aside. NOtcertain that would be best but it appeals to my anal side!

I do not know yet what P/Cs I have; But considering the fact that my compression numbers were all within 135-145 psi and that the motor had 110,000 miles, I am hoping being able to leave them together and reuse everything. Of course, only examination, measurements and advice from the board will tell if that is doable. As far as the transmission goes, I may simply get a rebuilt one from vertex. And sure, cleaning and repainting cosmetic parts is on the program too.

Aurel

Aurelien, a tip on the fan housing from Vertex-- check the threads here with photos of that piece before you plunk down after-tax dollars for it-- the casting quality is approximately that of the 13th century. Expensive as they are, I would reach out to Dan Pechtel down in Bordentown, NJ for a used one.

Thanks for your contribution to the forum, keep those photos coming!

Thanks for the tip on vertex fan housings and Dan Petchel.
I just had a little chat with our machine shop guy on how to best and quickly clean motor parts. A power washer with soap is an option. Or, a sheet of plywood covered with paper sheets, put the parts on it and spray gunk remover. Too bad my driveway is sparkling new...I may also borrow that steam cleaner he`s got here...Here are some pics of the shop, and some of the goodies that are in there (lathe, band saw, bridgeport milling maching, Sarix electrical arc milling machine, etc...). Still, I need to find a good local shop for the heads work.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1191611531.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1191611560.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1191611589.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1191611614.jpg

Aurel

Call Bob at anchor atlantic
(856) 589-5577

Did a great job on disfin's heads, and is a good guy as well.

Update: after removing the fan shroud, I can see that the side oil cooler was totally gunked up. No wonder why the motor was running *a little hot*. I probably won`t get much done this week-end, since I have promised wifey to repaint a room, finish unpacking the house, etc...Thanks for all the tips and phone numbers already. This board rocks!:)

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1191674096.jpg


Aurel

One more pic:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1191674697.jpg

Aurel

Little update: while waiting for some tools ordered from our host, I`ve rebuilt and repainted the hot air blower.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1192150051.jpg

Aurel

Update: the motor is on the stand; I found this 1T stand for 40 bucks at pepboyz. Next is removing the heat exchangers. That may be the first difficulty. Repainted the bar too. I use HT paint for BBQ stoves...Things are going well so far.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1192302911.jpg

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1192302937.jpg

Aurel

Summit racing sells a nice polyethylene drip pan that fits on that stand, not super expensive and you will save a fortune in cardboard :)

I`me made some headway tonight. Time to slow down and read before I do something stupid. I removed the cam covers, and found that the tensioners look updated, with this red anodized aluminum piece. However, they are not oil pressure fed. Does anybody know what those are?

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1192328674.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1192328713.jpg

Aurel

Okay, I have old style tensioners, but a safety collar was installed. That is this red aluminum piece.

Aurel

Update: I took the chain housings and the heads off last night. All went well, except that I cracked my left chain housing with the stupid crawfoot wrench. Anyone has a spare one? So there were two broken exhaust studs on each side, lots of carbon deposits, and you can see the oil leaks on the cylinders with broken studs. My cylinders are alusils. I am not sure what to do about them. I have seen some pitting on my cam lobes too. If the machine shop says they need to be reground, I may opt for a 964 profile, JE pistons and QSC cylinders from supertec :) Anchor Atlantic will do the heads, and clean the oil cooler.

As for the gearbox situation, I found that bodymotion can replace all the syncros for $675. That sounds like a deal. I'll ask them to replace the differential bearing too, and that should fix all the tranny problems.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1192665566.jpg

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http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1192665679.jpg

Aurel

aurel,
how far are you going with the rebuild?
you can't split the case the way its mounted now.
good luck
bob

Bob,

I am not splitting the case. This is just a top-end rebuild. At 110,000 miles, there is no reason to go into that trouble. I have no reason to believe there is any problem with the case.

Regards,

Aurel

If your not going to split the case, make sure you check for any leaks around the case, and look inside to see if there is any metal/damage. it would be a good idea to lift and lower each piston rod a few times to see if there is any resistance from metal on metal.

I almost didnt split my case, but glad I did b/c I had a shot journal on the crank.

The red anodized chain tensioner collar looks like its bottomed out on the tensioner housing. There should be a gap below the installed collar. No gap indicates the tensioner has collapsed (bad o-ring). Plan on replacing/rebuilding them.

Sherwood

Hello Aurel,

I am also in the process of rebuilding my 1980 SC engine and I am enjoying your thread. I was in your same situation with no intentions of splitting the case. When I pulled the p/c's out one of my rods one was stiff on the crank. I was very surprised with only 100K on the motor. I then split the case and one of my main bearings was a little scuffed, had crank polished all is good. Also splitting the case allowed me to remove the head studs that were broke near the case with a milling machine. Just wanted to share.

-Matt

I vote to split the case. You'll sleep better at night.

I was planning on installing carrera tensioners. Thanks for giving me one more reason to do it ;).

Aurel

I have seen several engines that otherwise had no reason to split the case, but came apart anyway. The majority had intermediate shaft bearings that were completely shot and showing copper. Some showed marginal oil pumps. It makes no sense to me to take a 25 year-old/100k+ engine down to the case and stop. All the expense is up in the top end. You should be able to get the bottom end done for well under a thousand. Check spigot deck, check crank, polish, resize rods, check intermediate shaft, replace sprockets. New main, intermediate, and rod bearings, check oil pump, check nose bearing. You can get all that done under $1k unless the oil pump is shot - and if it is, wouldn't you have wanted to know?

I screwed up last night :(; I was trying to remove the cylinders+pistons altogether, but I pulled one cylinder too far and the rings slid out of the cylinder. It is not easy at all to remove the circlips and wrist pins with the cylinders still there. Has anyone tried it before?
I have five more chances to do it right...

Aurel

After looking at your tensioner, I wanted to mention that I was unable to install the collars. With new chains, ramps, tensioners, etc., there wasn't enough room to slip the shim piece between the top of the tensioner housing and idler foot. The collars themselves would have fit, but it would have looked a little like yours. I left them out, opting for clearance.

I understand you might want to reuse the PC&rings and I know this leads into the infamous 'while your in there" but new rings would be very wise IMHO.

btw, I also forgot the speedo cable but caught it on final inspection before the final lowering:)

I also was not planning on splitting the case but it really isn't that hard and with all the help here it is definitly doable. Not the mention the satisfaction you will feel everytime you shift gears after it is back on the road!

Mine is all back together and will be installed tonight or this weekend.

there are a lot of threads re. cleaning various parts/methods....
re. the machine shop pictured... I would wonder about it... too clean. ;-)

This machine shop is at my workplace, but it does not work on engine parts. I may just use it for making little parts, as I already did. It is not the one I will be contracting for the head work.

Aurel

np - I was just kidding.. looks much like the machine shop I have at work after I cleaned it up.. in a couple of years they will sell all the tools and that will be that but I'm hanging on as long as possible...