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-   -   The Beautiful Puzzle: 1987 3.3L 930 EFI Build (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-engine-rebuilding-forum/598040-beautiful-puzzle-1987-3-3l-930-efi-build.html)

gsmith660 08-04-2012 02:41 PM

+1 I am a DIY kinda guy also and there is nothing wrong with Megasquirt it is open source and easily configured, it supports a lot of different stuff ie EDIS, and I can tune a car without a dyno and make it run really well. It doesn't have the vanity tax on it that Motec and Haltech has, their are others that aren't real expensive but aren't configured to use a laptop so you can really see what is going on they use a small screen to change parameters.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saml01 (Post 6893448)
I'm a DIY guy like yourself and when I was starting out the MS was recommended by the community for my car and I built it and tuned it from scratch so naturally I would go with what I am familiar with. I was just trying to see if you guys have a preference towards one particular unit due to a specific reason and you basically answered my question.


Ken911 08-07-2012 09:06 PM

Actually several people here used MS. Both ms-2 and ms-3 most of the guys doing thier own tuning use the MS. The choice of ms-2 vs ms3 depends on what spark system and if you going to use sequential injection. If your going to use coil on plugs and or sequential injection then ms-3 is your best bet. Sequential inject is only needed if you end up using really large injectors like for e-85 with a lot of boost and are having trouble getting it to idle and be drivable around town.

CaptainCalf 08-09-2012 06:57 AM

Turbo Damage
 
Turns out the turbo needs more then just a new set of brgs, so it's off to Garrett for a complete rebuild:rolleyes:http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1344524061.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1344524075.jpg

350HP930 08-09-2012 07:50 AM

Well, that's a pretty obvious sign the bearings failed when it was spooling instead of it just seizing up after shutdown. If you are sure it had oil going to it I'd suspect either defective bearings or a contamination issue.

PS - When this was still my project before passing it onto Rick, I was seriously concidering MS as an option since I'm a bit of a hardcore tinkerer.

CaptainCalf 08-09-2012 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 350HP930 (Post 6902241)
Well, that's a pretty obvious sign the bearings failed when it was spooling instead of it just seizing up after shutdown. If you are sure it had oil going to it I'd suspect either defective bearings or a contamination issue.

PS - When this was still my project before passing it onto Rick, I was seriously concidering MS as an option since I'm a bit of a hardcore tinkerer.

Initially it had oil which I confirmed, but something went South since then and we suspect the oil feed line plugged prolly due to the restrictor fitting, which will be tossed!

350HP930 08-09-2012 08:09 AM

Just to state the obvious, make sure to wash and blow out all the plumbing and give the intercooler a good reverse direction wash through with solvents and then a good reverse direction blow through with some hard knocking involved.

Looks like that compressor made some aluminum powder and grit during its self destruct phase and hopefully most of it has been trapped in the plumbing and intercooler grime which means you can make sure it doesn't find its way into any top ringlands or valve seat areas where it can really do damage.

CaptainCalf 08-09-2012 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 350HP930 (Post 6902277)
Just to state the obvious, make sure to wash and blow out all the plumbing and give the intercooler a good reverse direction wash through with solvents and then a good reverse direction blow through with some hard knocking involved.

Looks like that compressor made some aluminum powder and grit during its self destruct phase and hopefully most of it has been trapped in the plumbing and intercooler grime which means you can make sure it doesn't find its way into any top ringlands or valve seat areas where it can really do damage.

Good point & thanks!

CaptainCalf 08-22-2012 08:25 AM

Rebuilt turbo back from Garrett
 
Garrett has a fast turn around time!

Here's a pic of the smoked cartridge & the new one installed and ready to go:
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1345652711.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1345652724.jpg

350HP930 08-22-2012 09:05 AM

Congrats. So I assume the damage to the diffuser was only superficial?

CaptainCalf 08-22-2012 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 350HP930 (Post 6928144)
Congrats. So I assume the damage to the diffuser was only superficial?

Yep, smooth and goSmileWavy

350HP930 08-22-2012 12:10 PM

Is there an ETA for the reconstruction and final tuning. I'm dying to come over to pick up my drink cozy and share the dyno sheets with a friend with a monster grand national for comparison, lol.

CaptainCalf 08-23-2012 04:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 350HP930 (Post 6928510)
Is there an ETA for the reconstruction and final tuning. I'm dying to come over to pick up my drink cozy and share the dyno sheets with a friend with a monster grand national for comparison, lol.

Soon now that the turbo has been sorted and don't forget to bring over the alarm keySmileWavy

350HP930 08-23-2012 06:19 AM

LOL, will do :D

CaptainCalf 09-12-2012 06:43 AM

Progress Videos
 
Here's a vid of the throttle response improvement after Wayne at TPG in Pompano Beach, FL sorted the MAP sensor and Idle valve:
930 EFI running nicely - YouTube

Also, here's a vid of the turbine in the newly rebuild turbo spinning long after shut down, as it should:
Turbo - YouTube

CaptainCalf 09-12-2012 07:00 AM

Boost Switch
 
Wayne also installed a boost switch on the dash to toggle between hi and low boost. He will likely set the low boost with waste gate springs at around 0.8bar and high boost from there up to around 1.2bar. Hope I can keep it in the low boost position at least hafl the timeSmileWavyhttp://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1347462001.jpg

JFairman 09-12-2012 11:21 AM

Good luck with your rebuilt turbo.

Just wanted to mention there are alot of spdt rocker switches available in a size that fits that molded rectangle place in the dash where you put your toggle switch very nicely.
You will be hitting that toggle switch at night when reaching for the headlight switch and it's mounted in a piece of flexable vinyl like plastic with foam rubber backing thats about 1/8" thick that is too flexible for a good toggle switch mount but is OK for a medium size low profile rocker switch.

You could also put a 911 mirror change over rocker switch there if you wanted to use a Porsche rocker switch. Pelican sells them.

If you do that a razor blade cuts out the rectangular hole in the dash for the switch easily. Measure for a snug snap in fit for the switch and use masking tape to make your cut lines for the razor blade.
Pelican Parts - Product Information: 911-613-113-00-M100

CaptainCalf 09-12-2012 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JFairman (Post 6971367)
Good luck with your rebuilt turbo.

Just wanted to mention there are alot of spdt rocker switches available in a size that fits that molded rectangle place in the dash where you put your toggle switch very nicely.
You will be hitting that toggle switch at night when reaching for the headlight switch and it's mounted in a piece of flexable vinyl like plastic with foam rubber backing thats about 1/8" thick that is too flexible for a good toggle switch mount but is OK for a medium size low profile rocker switch.

You could also put a 911 mirror change over rocker switch there if you wanted to use a Porsche rocker switch. Pelican sells them.

If you do that a razor blade cuts out the rectangular hole in the dash for the switch easily. Measure for a snug snap in fit for the switch and use masking tape to make your cut lines for the razor blade.
Pelican Parts - Product Information: 911-613-113-00-M100

Thanks Jim, that mirror switch looks like it would work nicely. I've got a lot of little things to attend to on the car, so if I do hit the boost switch while turning on the lights I'll add that to the growing list:rolleyes:

CaptainCalf 09-20-2012 05:53 AM

Update
 
Since last update Wayne at TPG has fabricated a new intake pipe setup using 3" alum vs the 2.5" piping I had on it so it will flow better now.

Also, he had to send the turbo back to Garrett cuz it seems the seals are leaking causing oil blowing by into the intake which makes smoke. http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1348149130.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1348149149.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1348149160.jpg

proffighter 09-20-2012 06:16 AM

Better flow is always a nice goal, but here I am not sure if this is that good regarding flow. Why does your welder did not used a bow?



http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1348150597.jpg

CaptainCalf 09-20-2012 06:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by proffighter (Post 6987184)
Better flow is always a nice goal, but here I am not sure if this is that good regarding flow. Why does your welder did not used a bow?

Good eye! It may cause a little turbulance there, but prolly not enough to be overly concerned aboutSmileWavy

gsmith660 09-20-2012 11:59 AM

I would not be as concerned with the turbulence as I am with the air having to make a sharp 90 rather than a smooth bend. It very well may be big enough to not cause a problem but if you were on the edge for airflow it would be a major restriction I would think.

350HP930 09-20-2012 05:30 PM

Damn Rick, sorry to hear about the bad luck with the turbos.

On another subject though, as a motorcycle and porshe guy you might appreciate the layout I've working on for my motor project. :)

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1348190535.jpg

The crank is semi-spherical since it occupies the lower cylinder area. I wanted a super short connecting rods for maximum torque and it since it uses the crankcase as a pump I've got to keep the BDC crankcase volume to a minimum.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1348190844.jpg

CaptainCalf 09-21-2012 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 350HP930 (Post 6988358)
Damn Rick, sorry to hear about the bad luck with the turbos.

On another subject though, as a motorcycle and porshe guy you might appreciate the layout I've working on for my motor project. :)

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1348190535.jpg

The crank is semi-spherical since it occupies the lower cylinder area. I wanted a super short connecting rods for maximum torque and it since it uses the crankcase as a pump I've got to keep the BDC crankcase volume to a minimum.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1348190844.jpg

looks very coolSmileWavy

will it produce enough electricity to run my house?

CaptainCalf 10-08-2012 09:55 AM

Martini Bike Build
 
While waiting for news about the 2nd turbo rebuild I've been busy building a custom bike. The bike's colors are all old Porsche color codesSmileWavy
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1349718868.jpg

I should get an update this week on how the newly rebuild turbo is working out...

CaptainCalf 11-17-2012 08:16 AM

side project finished
 
My tunner should have turbo back from Garrett middle of next week, so dyno runs possible by next weekend. In the meantime, here's my initial startup for my bobber project:

Custom Bobber - YouTube

nocarrier 11-17-2012 08:57 AM

Nice!

Woo hoo!

CaptainCalf 11-19-2012 04:31 AM

1999 HD 1250 Martini Bobber build
 
Here it is hitting on both cylinders:

1999 Bobber sorted - YouTube

CaptainCalf 11-30-2012 05:26 AM

Turbo is going back in today
 
Garrett sent our turbo back today, so it will be reinstalled for the 3rd time and tested. If all goes well dyno tuning will be scheduled for next week! We should know what kinda power this baby will make soonSmileWavy

willtel 11-30-2012 09:47 AM

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/support/smileys/clap.gif

CaptainCalf 11-30-2012 09:50 AM

Quote:

<img src="http://forums.pelicanparts.com/support/smileys/clap.gif" border="0" alt="">
Yeah, I'm pretty happy about it too;)

CaptainCalf 12-06-2012 04:41 AM

Dyno Day
 
Finally! We are planning to Dyno this pcar today. If all goes well we should have numbers later today or surly by tomorrow. Tuner said he'll try to keep it below 600hp, but I'll be more then happy with anything close to 500:eek:

CaptainCalf 12-07-2012 04:34 AM

In line for Dyno
 
I think today is a fine day for Dyno tuning!http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1354887234.jpg

PrimeMvr 12-07-2012 05:03 AM

mmmm......Porsches..... :)

CaptainCalf 12-07-2012 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PrimeMvr (Post 7136583)
mmmm......Porsches..... :)

Yep, it's like P-car HeavenSmileWavy

johnman001 12-07-2012 06:03 PM

Wish my 930 was red..... DROOL!

CaptainCalf 12-08-2012 01:49 PM

Not fully sorted yet, but very close! 400whp was all the boost the silicone jointed intake plumbing could hold, so pulling it all off and going back with all hard piping with crimped joints that will hold all the boost we want to make...

kjchristopher 12-08-2012 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainCalf (Post 7138924)
Not fully sorted yet, but very close! 400whp was all the boost the silicone jointed intake plumbing could hold, so pulling it all off and going back with all hard piping with crimped joints that will hold all the boost we want to make...

Joining in late in the thread here - How much boost are you running and what clamps are you using? I run 18-22# on my boosted race motor (not a Porsche) and have zero problems with the silicone connections held by T-Bar clamps. Twelve different connections/clamps.

On Edit: Just found a picture - same clamps and hose I'm using. I'd think you'd be good up to the same boost I'm running.

JFairman 12-09-2012 10:17 AM

When I worked in a large porsche restoration shop doing body work here in West Palm that sometimes had 2 or 3 IMSA GTP teams working on their Porsche 962's there during the Florida races back in the mid to late eightees I remember those cars used silicone hose and either american made aircraft grade T-bolt clamps or they doubled up on the usual Zebra or Norma German hose clamps with two side by side on each end of the hose connections.
They used american made silicone hose and T-bolt clamps and didn't use thin wall low ply chinese silicone hose or cheap chinese t-bolt clamps. I don't know what you're using on your intercooler plumbing but they didn't blow off while running higher boost than you are during the Florida 24 and 12 hour endurance races.

If using american made hose and T-bolt clamps and one blew off maybe they just need to be tightened a little more. If using worm drive hose clamps put a drop of oil on the worm gear before tightening it.

CaptainCalf 12-10-2012 04:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JFairman (Post 7139922)
When I worked in a large porsche restoration shop doing body work here in West Palm that sometimes had 2 or 3 IMSA GTP teams working on their Porsche 962's there during the Florida races back in the mid to late eightees I remember those cars used silicone hose and either american made aircraft grade T-bolt clamps or they doubled up on the usual Zebra or Norma German hose clamps with two side by side on each end of the hose connections.
They used american made silicone hose and T-bolt clamps and didn't use thin wall low ply chinese silicone hose or cheap chinese t-bolt clamps. I don't know what you're using on your intercooler plumbing but they didn't blow off while running higher boost than you are during the Florida 24 and 12 hour endurance races.

If using american made hose and T-bolt clamps and one blew off maybe they just need to be tightened a little more. If using worm drive hose clamps put a drop of oil on the worm gear before tightening it.

Thanks JimSmileWavy It's mostly the thin walled stuff with a mix of clamps. We will rip it all out and go back with as much hard pipe as possible eliminating most of the joints, but we will be using high quality silicone & clamps this time if any are required. This should get us over this last hurdle to our goal of 500 ponies:)

CaptainCalf 12-10-2012 04:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kjchristopher (Post 7138988)
Joining in late in the thread here - How much boost are you running and what clamps are you using? I run 18-22# on my boosted race motor (not a Porsche) and have zero problems with the silicone connections held by T-Bar clamps. Twelve different connections/clamps.

On Edit: Just found a picture - same clamps and hose I'm using. I'd think you'd be good up to the same boost I'm running.

Thanks KJC, it would prolly hold the boost as set up if tweaked properly, but I'd rather have fewer joints to have to worry about so we're gonna have some hard pipe fabbed up to fit snugly that should hold anything we decide to throw at it:)


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