Break in oil - First run, when do you change the oil.

[93nav]

What is the standard practice with the initial run/break in on a complete fresh rebuild? How long before changing oil, time, distance? what about the second oil change?

I did see the other thread about break in, but most of that was about what oil to use.

Thanks

[timmy2]

All documented in Wayne's engine book. Take a look at it.

[93nav]

I have read that section starting at page 192, but the problem is I am getting conflicting advice locally. I need to confirm that I understand what I am being told locally and do not have it wrong, and then may need to diplomatically suggest that the current 'best practices' are followed. So...has there been any real change from what is in Wayne's book, and does anyone know any good diplomats in the upper midwest?

Thanks

Summarizing the book:
Initial run, 20 minutes at 2000 rpm, change oil and filter
drive 50 - 75 miles, change oil and filter
500 miles, change oil and filter to whatever you normally use (I have seen, heard 1000 miles referenced also)

[VFR750]

If you are looking for consensus, you will not find it. People will not agree. So in that case you basically have to choose what makes sense.

What do the local experts say? Less often? More often?

Here is my take on it. Wayne wrote a book and put his personal reputation and business on the line doing so. Most folks aren't that committed to their opinion. IMHO his opinion carries more weight.

If you are having a reputable pro rebuild your engine, and they stand behind their work, then do what they say. They also have committed to the recommendation.


On my third rebuild this year... So I am at least able to comment on this:

It is reasonable to change the oil that often, and it can't hurt the engine to be running clean oil. It might be very valuable to know what's happening at various points in time in the first 1000 miles. It was for me. So I did.

I can honestly tell you the absolutely least expensive thing in your engine is the oil. Even at $10/qt.

it's a $20,000 machine with $100 worth of oil keeping it from destroying itself.

That is my perspective.

[93nav]

As stated, I need to re-confirm what I thought I heard the when I talked to them last, but they say to not change the oil AT ALL for the first 1000 miles. Not even after the initial run. This seems quite radical. Again I do need to confirm that this is what I heard.

[VFR750]

And you could ask what happens if I do put fresh oil in at 20 minutes, 50 miles, and 500 miles?

Nothing bad will happen. Fresh oil = good.

Just refill with break in oil though.

Maybe that's thier point. 1000 miles with break in oil.

[93nav]

Thanks for the replys.

Break in oil is Brad Penn. I agree, more oil changes should be better.

I do not have Bruce Anderson's book, does anyone know if the break in procedure it recommends is comparable to Wayne's? Just trying to bolster my case.

Thanks

[RedCoupe]

Here's a bit of a different angle. I got this info from my father who is a retired mechanical engine with years in automotive and aircraft engine design as well as a holder of an A&P license to work on his own airplanes. He said that used oil contains some carbon that can be beneficial to prevent scuffing of cylinders and camshaft wear. He said that through testing it was found that some high load engines suffered less problems during break in by mixing some used oil in with the fresh oil at changes or by not completely draining the oil when changing it. Despite knowing that my father had good success mixing in used oil in his newly overhauled aviation engines, I've never actually put used oil in my rebuilt auto engines. However, I wonder if that may be part of the reason that some people say not to change the oil too soon when breaking in engines. I also wonder if the high zinc break in oils may be serving somewhat the same purpose as my dads mix of new and used oil in his airplane engines.

[911 Rod]

Originally Posted by RedCoupe

Here's a bit of a different angle. I got this info from my father who is a retired mechanical engine with years in automotive and aircraft engine design as well as a holder of an A&P license to work on his own airplanes. He said that used oil contains some carbon that can be beneficial to prevent scuffing of cylinders and camshaft wear. He said that through testing it was found that some high load engines suffered less problems during break in by mixing some used oil in with the fresh oil at changes or by not completely draining the oil when changing it. Despite knowing that my father had good success mixing in used oil in his newly overhauled aviation engines, I've never actually put used oil in my rebuilt auto engines. However, I wonder if that may be part of the reason that some people say not to change the oil too soon when breaking in engines. I also wonder if the high zinc break in oils may be serving somewhat the same purpose as my dads mix of new and used oil in his airplane engines.

Interesting.

[afterburn 549]

One of the newest discoveries is piston ring micro welding .
Now the inside circles tell me to use the best oil I can find and run it for a 5 seconds
then complete cool dwn.
10 sec, complete cool dwn
20 sec '' ' ''' ''''
etc etc till you get to 5 min.
This will give you way better leak dwn numbers .
Now go to the dyno and proceed light at first to full throttle / load after several progressive runs

[Sub8]

Originally Posted by afterburn 549

One of the newest discoveries is piston ring micro welding .
Now the inside circles tell me to use the best oil I can find and run it for a 5 seconds
then complete cool dwn.
10 sec, complete cool dwn
20 sec '' ' ''' ''''
etc etc till you get to 5 min.
This will give you way better leak dwn numbers .
Now go to the dyno and proceed light at first to full throttle / load after several progressive runs

Perhaps on a race motor where you have full fuel and coolant temp control? Do that on a normal OEM and most of your oil would be unburnt fuel after the 5th start.

[afterburn 549]

I used that technique on an engine here (not Porsche ) with good results and it was carbed .
We certainly have a menu to choose from !

[TibetanT]

Originally Posted by VFR750

I can honestly tell you the absolutely least expensive thing in your engine is the oil. Even at $10/qt.

it's a $20,000 machine with $100 worth of oil keeping it from destroying itself.

That is my perspective.

This is VERY GOOD advise. Wayne's book also gives you the best advise for "What to do after the rebuild" which is also VERY GOOD advise.

Both of these guys are right on, and I, personally, would never think of deviating from VERY GOOD advise.

GL

[sixbanger]

Change the oil. I know someone who didn't when told to.