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Chain fence eating turbo
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 9,124
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Victor-Reinz gaskets and stated QC issues
Ok, I've read before to avoid these at all costs and go Wrightwood. But, I used these once before, and everything seemed to line up and no oil pressure problems.
Chris Carroll of Turbo Kraft, Steve Weiner of Rennsport Systems, and Henry Schmidt of Supertec Performance, all have ditched Victor-Reinz due to QC issues. So that's a lot to be said! Only one I know from reading was a major issue was Chris having no oil pressure from the large, green, squared face "O"-rings not sealing against the case requiring a complete teardown. Dr. Dempsey chimed in on a thread and stated he had contacted VR and found no complaints about their gaskets having issues. With that said, could I use the cylinder head kit from Victor-Reinz and use only the case kit from Wrightwood? Meaning, what exactly are the problems associated with these gaskets? Dimensionally wrong, material used, what exactly? TIA
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Cory - turbo'd '87 C3.2 Guards/Blk, 3.4, 7.5:1 CR P & C's, 993SS cams, Borg-Warner S366 turbo @ 1.2-1.5 bar, depending on mood  , Treadstone full bay IC, 70mm TB, TiAL F46 WG, HKS 1 1/2" BOV, twin 044 pumps, MicroSquirt AMP'd w/GM smart coilpack, Bilstein coilovers, Tramont wheels (285's rr, 225's frt), Big Reds frt, 993 rr., tower brace, MOMO wheel
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01-04-2017, 08:33 AM
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Registered
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: wisconsin
Posts: 2,553
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Tippy, what did you end up doing...?
It's interesting looking at the pelican sales ranking for many items... Victor reinz outsells the next brand 5 fold. Then, boutique brands like wrightwood are a factor of 2-3 behind that... Clearly, the vast vast vast majority of people use victor reinz. Most of that, is because it's 1/2 to 1/3 the price.... This holds true for gasket sets, bearings, bushings, etc.... I am sure victor reinz is lower quality... But which gaskets? I like your idea of mix and match... Is that what you ended up doing? |
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08-15-2017, 06:04 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Nash County, NC.
Posts: 8,474
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But remember, for the major builders, they don't care the cost of any seal sets or part as it's just a profit margin and warranty. The more new parts they use, the less chance of warranty issues
In 38 years of building, one person insisted on wrightwood sets, which I saw no difference in. On the Reinz gaskets for the last 10 years the thermostat "O" ring seal has been my only problem but a strip of 574 above the seal has sufficed. Bruce |
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08-15-2017, 06:34 PM
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Chain fence eating turbo
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 9,124
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Haven't even pulled the trigger.
Going full Wrightwood, though. |
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08-15-2017, 06:35 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: wisconsin
Posts: 2,553
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Quote:
Bo |
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08-15-2017, 06:48 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: wisconsin
Posts: 2,553
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Quote:
Rocker o rings are $70!!! That's nuts. An Oring at the hardware store is 3 cents. Kind of nutty... |
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08-15-2017, 06:50 PM
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Chain fence eating turbo
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 9,124
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Quote:
That's a full teardown to almost the start. |
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08-15-2017, 07:24 PM
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Chain fence eating turbo
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 9,124
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Those rocker seals are not "O" rings, they are flat
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08-15-2017, 07:25 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: wisconsin
Posts: 2,553
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Quote:
But here is what I figured out so far. Building a motor is a DOUBLE slippery slope... The first slope, is getting in way deeper than you intended, because its hard to draw a line on where to stop... The other slippery slope, is in regards to what quality of parts to put in... Head studs... Steel$? Supertech/ARP$$$? Porsche $$$$? Rod bolts? Leave? Original$? Arp $$$? Rod bearings? Leave? VR$? Clevite $$$? Case bearings? Leave? VR$ Porsche $$$? Gasket set? VR$? Porsche$$$? Aftermarket$$$$? Oil pump. Leave it? Rebuild$$? Upgrade$$$$? Heads? Leave if within tolerance? Rebuild to new $$$? Honestly, Where does one draw the line on a refresh? Looking at the pelican ranking is actually very enlightening. I never looked at those before. Not sure if those numbers reflect an annual ranking, or cumulative lifetime ranking for the availability of those parts. But what the rankings suggest, is that the vast majority of people that rebuild their motors use basic replacement parts... I would think if the parts were horrible, and had tons of returns, at some point Pelican Parts would no longer carry them? I value the opinion of every engine builder on this site (Thanks!!!). I do recognize though, that the builders on this site are the premium motor builders. Cream of the crop. Many building high performance modded engines and race engines. Failure is not an option. When this is your livelihood, and your reputation rides on your product, you are going to put in the best parts. If Average Joe takes his car to an engine builder... I suspect that the most basic available parts are used... Average Joe, given the choice between a $5000 rebuild and a $15,000 rebuild won't have to think about it much... For me, so far got the Supertech head studs, plan on getting quality main/rod bearings if needed and arp rod bolts. Hard to go back and correct these issues... Last edited by bpu699; 08-16-2017 at 04:59 AM.. |
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08-16-2017, 04:29 AM
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Registered
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Loxahatchee, florida
Posts: 2,894
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The other thing that bugs me about getting the gasket rebuild kits is all the crap you dont need thats in the kit. This time around i went with WR gaskets but only got what i needed instead of the VR rebuild kit. It was less money. The thing that also made me decide was the undersized O rings on the oil pump causing a rebuild. The other thing that bugs me is Why are the rsr rocker shaft o rings so expensive?
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88 turbo Guards red Targa slant nose, and yes I am a horsepower junkie, 3.4liter,7.5 to 1 JE pistons, Adjustable WUR, Imagine fuel head, 1 bar waste gate headers,allthe cis toys. Now apart to become the next EFI monster. fabbing my own intake, headers Individual throttle bodies, MS-3, pauter rods, Xtreme twin plugged heads, gt-2 evo cams cop's. 2019 Silverado 6.2L |
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08-16-2017, 05:05 AM
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Registered
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: wisconsin
Posts: 2,553
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Quote:
The rocker o rings seem silly... I understand that its a flat washer/etc. But in the whole universe of washers/orings, there isn't a comparable substitute? Why not just use anaerobic sealant on the very outside? $70 for 24 O-rings seems nuts. Mine didn't even leak to start with... No one has found a substitute? |
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08-16-2017, 06:00 AM
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Registered
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: wisconsin
Posts: 2,553
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There ya go... someone found a solution for $10 in England...
https://www.impactbumpers.com/forum/index.php?/topic/9216-rsr-rocker-shaft-seals/ Any reason that wouldn't work? |
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08-16-2017, 06:23 AM
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Chain fence eating turbo
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 9,124
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bpu, you and I are cut from the same fabric. If I find a suitable alternative, I'm all over it.
Thanks for the find |
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08-16-2017, 09:34 AM
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Chain fence eating turbo
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 9,124
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A lot of checkbook mechanics buy all new stuff and go overboard.
Reality is, if it's within spec, checks out fine for no cracks, it's good. I rebuilt thousands of F-15 jet engines in my early career. 75% of this board it seems, goes above and beyond what a serviceable part is compared to what we reused in a fighter plane engine that ran at the ragged edge of blowing up (not really, but you get the point). I examine the load and if the part is reciprocating ot not to determine how much inspection or tolerances are required to determine if it's good or bad. Static parts usually can have nasty gouges in them and be fine. Case in point, a chain housing. Nothing will happen. Spinny parts (reciprocating), minor nick could lead to catastrophic failure. Wouldn't want a gouge out of a con rod or crank throw. That's the way I evaluate and my $0.00000001. 😂
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08-16-2017, 09:50 AM
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Registered
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Loxahatchee, florida
Posts: 2,894
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Quote:
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88 turbo Guards red Targa slant nose, and yes I am a horsepower junkie, 3.4liter,7.5 to 1 JE pistons, Adjustable WUR, Imagine fuel head, 1 bar waste gate headers,allthe cis toys. Now apart to become the next EFI monster. fabbing my own intake, headers Individual throttle bodies, MS-3, pauter rods, Xtreme twin plugged heads, gt-2 evo cams cop's. 2019 Silverado 6.2L |
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08-16-2017, 10:12 AM
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Registered
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: wisconsin
Posts: 2,553
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Quote:
But I know there is limits. My income can't support the "best of everything" in all cases. And at some point, you gotta make choices. Plus, there is huge satisfaction doing it myself. Sometimes, you buy something cheap that works really well. Picked up an EBAY CUT50 plasmacutter. Usually $200. That's not even real money. There is a guy in Milwaukee that buys these in bulk, replaces the cheap most likely to fail internal components, and sells for $300. Good for him. Bought one. This is the coolest/cheap Toy in my garage. I would never spend $1000 on a plasma cutter. Just don't use it that much. But for 300$, this things a hoot and works great!!! I have to ask myself. Would I rather be at work an extra 50++ hours, make $$$, and pay someone to do it all. Or, would I rather NOT be at work, misuse my time working on the car, and enjoy the process...
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08-16-2017, 11:55 AM
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