used z3 to miata comparison?

hdtwice · 06-28-2003, 09:22 PM

I am thinking of picking up a weekend fun, ragtop, carve the curves kind of car. I have been hearing about both cars; anything to share with someone looking. (of course the thoughts might be a bit biased in this forum, it's okay, my ears are still open)
Thanks

RRysedorph · RRysedorph's Garage

First of all, if you're a girl, buy the Miata. If you want to club race, buy the Miata. If you want something fun and not look like a "Goob" buy a Z3.

Jared at Pelican Parts · 07-15-2003, 01:36 PM

Miata's feel a lot faster than they really are. Keep in mind what they are, a cheap open top roadster with not much in the way of creature comforts. Essentially you are buying this generations MGB. The Z3 is much more refined, more powerful and much more classy in my opinion.

LeftyS7 · 07-27-2003, 07:37 PM

I strongly disagree, I have a 2001 M Roadster and drive my wife's 2000 Sport Package Miata and, recently, a 2002 Miata. The BMW (we're talking M Roadster, now) excels in three areas: Power, brakes and safety (side airbags). It also has more leg room and,somewhat, more headroom but less elbow room.The BMW is rock solid from eighty to one hundred and twenty. The Miata cruises nicely at eighty but isn't as solid. The Miata otherwise handles much better than the BMW and has much less chassis flex. It has better trunk space, a spare (which other Z3s do have) a top that is simple to raise and lower and has a GLASS rear window with defroster element, more storage space in the cockpit (decent cup holders) larger mirrors (though the german optical quality is superb), a front strut tower brace and much more comfortable though less adjustable seats (and better visors). I got 31 MPG for a weekend of 600 miles of spirited driving in the hills of northern California doing 70 and 80 on back roads so the range is much gretater than the M, certainly. The smaller engined Z3s can't compete in autocross against the Miata, where agility tells, for track days it is perfectly balanced. I see as many women driving Z3s as Miatas where I live and Miata owners are friendlier, most wave back when you wave. BMW owners don't. There is a much greater range of parts and accessories, naturally, since there are so many more sold. The Miata's Bose Stereo sounds better than the Harmon Kardon and the six CD changer is in the dash, not taking up a significant amount of limited trunk space. The BMW is designed for cruising; look at the small amount of negative camber for the front wheels, the Miata is made to turn (what sportscars are SUPPOSED to do, imo), look at the greater negative camber. Do you want to cruise in a straight line or excel in the twisties? Miatas are almost indestructible and trouble free. Check Consumer Reports. Daily drivers are in the 160,000 mile mark with NO repairs other than maintanence items. Oh. more people DO "Oh" and "Ah" over the BMW but they haven't driven it.

After spending this past weekend in my wife's Miata my M Roadster is for sale.

Jared at Pelican Parts · 07-29-2003, 11:51 AM

You'd rather take an Miata over an M Roadster?

To each his own I guess.

LeftyS7 · 07-31-2003, 07:49 PM

You bet, ever actually driven one?

Jared at Pelican Parts · 08-01-2003, 08:51 AM

Yeah I have. It is exactly what they were designed to be, a cheaply built, lightweight car. Dont get me wrong, they a fun little things, but to compare it to an M Roadster, c'mon man!

LeftyS7 · 08-13-2003, 09:48 PM

I guess you didn't read my comparison, haven't driven a Miata very much or are in love with the name/roundel BMW. The better power and brakes don't outweigh all the other areas that the Miata surpasses the BMW, driver's comfort being the most critical: the BMW seat is UNcomfortable, as is the steering wheel rim. For weekend drives in the mountains I can go as fast, if not faster, than the BMW, have acceptable trunk space for luggage for two and not have to stop as often in remote areas to fill up. The Miata may be inexpensive but it is not cheap and thay are virtually indestructible with no repairs necessary, only routine maintanence. They made Car and Driver's Ten Best list for many years, something that no Z-3 iteration has ever done.

Jared at Pelican Parts · 08-14-2003, 08:22 AM

well you are entitlted to your opinion. I've driven both cars, and i honestly cant see a comparison between the two cars.

LeftyS7 · 08-17-2003, 08:33 PM

Well, at least we agree on that, I can't either.

jens_uk · 08-19-2003, 05:22 AM

I haven't driven an M roadster, but I have driven a Z3 and a few late model Miatas. Personally, I would get the Z3 because it felt tighter and because I'm too tall (6'1") for the Miata - I just don't fit in them since the current bodystyle came out. Not that I fit especially well in the pre '99s, but it was more on the livable side.

I like the light, tossable nature of the Miata, and am often tempted by them, but in the end I'd come back to the Z3 - just more my style.

Also, I wouldn't knock the BMW for lack of negative camber in the front. Look at a Boxster - that's a car made for turning, but the front wheels seem vertical, esp. compared to the back - visually, doesn't look like any front camber. There are lots of ways to get handling, and boiling it down to one spec isn't fair.

I thought the Z3 was around 29 mpg highway with a 13.5 gallon tank; versus the Miata at 28 with a 12.7 gallon tank, which should make range differences minimal (though your M might not be as thrifty).

The glass vs. non-glass backlight is probably the Miata's greatest strength, so I guess it would depend on how often you get to put the top down.

Jared at Pelican Parts · 08-21-2003, 02:34 PM

My main problem with the Miata is that is feels cheap when you drive it, sorry. I've seen so many Miatas out here in CA that have that oxidized fiberglass look, which tells me that the paintwork was not up to scratch. They can be really nice cars, provided they are upgraded (anyone ever been in a Monster Miata with the Ford 302? FUN!) They just remind me too much of an MGB. Plus they have sort of a dubious reputation in CA if you are male and own one.

LeftyS7 · 08-21-2003, 07:19 PM

Yes, Miatas are known as "Chick" cars but 90% of the Z3s in Nevada are driven by "chicks" and the only M Roadsters I've seen have also been driven by "chicks"..

I'm 6' 3" with a long torso and the 2000 Miata is O.K for head room, I just brush the top with my head, but the BMW is only a little bit better, maybe one half inch. I don't have as much headroom in the earlier Miatas.

Leg room is much better on the BMW but that's not a problem for me.

Here in Reno we've got cars in the Miata club that are 13 years old, daily drivers, and the paint is fine on them. I suspect in California the average BMW owner is more fastidious about detailing than is the average Miata owner.

My M Roadster gets about 20 mpg on the road, 17 mpg around town.

I drive both cars back to back and on a daily basis. (My wife's out of town and the BMW was in a shop for a couple of days getting an invisible bra installed.)

The switch gear on the BMW feels more substantial but the plastic parts have sharp edges to them: end of wiper and turn signal arms and even the pushbutton in the handbrake has a casting ridge to it. Not what I expect in a high priced car.

We've beaten Boxsters and even a few Boxster S at autocross in the Miata. Can't say that about Z-3s because I've never seen one autccrossed. Have also beaten M Roadsters on the curves at track days but was left in the dust on the straights, of course.

We'll see how it autocrosses in a few weeks but it's going to be hard to take luggage and helmets out of town.

Eric-325I · 10-07-2003, 09:39 AM

Seems like comparing apples and oranges... I surely don't believe the Z3 was meant to compete with the Miata, especially the M version...

Personally, my brother was a Miata owner and loved it. I found it fun, slow, cheap (looking and built) and the paint was crappy after a short time... Yes, he did care for it.

I drive Bimmers rather than Accords or 626's for the little something extra (lot's of things actually) that they offer... the Miata is just bland...

LeftyS7 · 10-07-2003, 05:00 PM

Autocrossed the M Roadster and it's now officially up for sale.

Jared at Pelican Parts · 10-08-2003, 04:35 PM

I still dont understand how the Miata can seriously be compared to the M Roadster.

Out here in California, I see so many Miata's driving around with the paint oxidized, and uneven panel lines. I thought about buying a Miata at one time for a cheap fun car, and didnt after seeing how the cars are built.

LeftyS7 · 10-10-2003, 07:01 PM

You are entitled to your opinion, of course. But if you haven't had extensive time driving the two cars your opinion is baseless. I have, I've driven them back to back; they stand side by side in my garage: a silver 2001 M Roadster and a silver 2000 Miata with sports package. I've driven them on the highway, on city streets and on Sierra mountain pass roads, and I've autocrossed both, I've driven the Miata on several track days, I won't be keeping the BMW long enough to drive it on the track. The Miata handles much better, the BMW excels on the highway, I've done 140 mph in the BMW, 120 mph in the Miata. The BMW was rock solid at 140 the Miata wasn't at 120. I'd rather have a car that handles better in the twisties than one that does 140 mph on the highway, I don't have many opportunities to do 140 I do have many opportunities to drive mountain roads. My wife's response after driving the BMW for an hour on mountain roads: "I could get used to this". (She autocrosses and does track days with me and has taken the Barber and Russell Driving School courses with me at Sears and Laguna.) You don't need to get used to the Miata, it's a treat from the start. Our Miata club has many '90 - '92 cars with appropriate mileage and they are all in terrific condition and with one exception none of the cars in the club have required any repairs, just routine maintanence. I would rather have the BMW if I had a one hour commute on freeways to work every day otherwise I'd rather have a Miata.

Ted Cannon · 12-10-2003, 12:01 PM

It's certainly a matter of personal opinion. What is good for one, is not for another.....thank God!

Overall: If you want to drive a Mazda, buy the Miata.
If you want to drive a BMW, buy the Z Roadster.

Like everything, both have strengths and weaknesses. It's less expensive to manfacture a Mazda than a BMW. That doesn't mean it's not a great car.

I too have spent extensive time on both cars. I've even got a 1963 MGB that was built for Road Atlanta, and my Z3 still makes me smile the widest when I'm toring in it!

Lefty.......wanna trade that M3 for another Miata?

LeftyS7 · 12-10-2003, 04:24 PM

Sold it. But I would have considered a trade for three Miatas.

Ted Cannon · 12-11-2003, 05:28 AM