Transmission Fluid Change Gone Wrong

[khakwanit1]

hi,
I recently got the coolant, brake fluid, and transmission fluid changed on my 05 Boxster at a local mechanic shop. After the services were done, I kind of realized that the mechanics weren't qualified to do the job. At first, they were unable to locate the coolant flush valve and I had the 101 book with me and tried showing them but they refused to look at it because they are the mechanics and know what they are doing. After doing a horrible job with the coolant, I was already in a bad mood and had to go to the office for an hour. When I came back, they had done the brake fluid and the transmission fluid. I brought the ATE blue brake fluid and Swepco gear oil to be used on my car. Everything seemed fine at first and the gears were shifting very smoothly. It wasn't till the next day, I felt that the first and second gears weren't engaging easily. I actually had to use some force for it to engage. Even when I was going from 3rd to 2nd, it would require force. After the engine warmed up, it became better but I really don't know if this is normal. What could have they done wrong with changing the transmission fluid? Maybe it might become better on its own in a week or two. Should I go to the dealership and get it changed again? Thank You

[dad911]

I don't know where you are, but I suggest getting it to a 'real' shop as soon as possible.

If they didn't bleed the coolant, you could have more serious problems, and I would not run the transmission like that, there is obviously something wrong, like not enough or wrong fluid.

[JFP in PA]

If you are not going to service one of these cars your self, you need to make sure that whoever you choose to work on them (1) Has some experience and specific knowledge of what the car requires; (2) They own a pressure bleeding system such as the Motive Products system; (3) They own a vacuum filling system for doing the coolant; (4) They mix the OEM coolant (only) with distilled water (only) before they vacuum fill the system; (5) They fill the gear box with the OEM lube (we have seen just about every after market gear oil, none of them have worked as well as the factory fill).

We regularly get new customer-prospects that want to “audit” the shop before brining their “baby” to us for service; we welcome the chance to show them who we are and how we do our jobs. Any shop that cops an attitude of “Hey, we’re professionals, we know what we are doing” should be avoided; after all, you are the one spending the money…………….

[khakwanit1]

I mixed the coolant with distilled water prior to bringing it to the shop. They didn't have any of the vacuum products. They basically opened two hoses from the bottom and removed all the old coolant and just added the new one. I was very worried in the beginning because I prepared 6 gallons of coolant to be used and the car only took 2 gallons. On the way back, the coolant level message appeared on the screen and I immediately stopped the car and added 2 more gallons. Once I got home, I read the article again and located the pressure bleeding valve and did the last few steps again. All together, the car took 4 gallons so I am assuming 80 percent of the coolant has been replaced. I used swepco gear oil because it's sold on this website and thought would be a good product because its pelican approved. I will probably get everything replaced again in a year or so. I just hope that the transmission problem goes away or I will have to go to the dealership and get it done as soon as possible. I live in in Long Island, NY. If you know any good shops around here, please let me know.

[khakwanit1]

They used the entire bottle of gear oil and according to the book that is more than enough. I just don't know what are the consequences of an overfilled transmission. I have all the tools to do the job myself and I regularly change the engine oil at home. I just don't have time anymore and its cold outside.

[JFP in PA]

The simple fact that they did not know how to properly do a simple task like change the coolant says that you should not wait a year; they did not do a quality job. Just because someone owns tools does not make them a mechanic, it makes them a tool owner. You need to get the coolant issue corrected ASAP. These cars do not like air pockets in the cooling system, and do not take well to being overheated; it has been proven to be one of the fastest ways to kill an otherwise fine engine.

As for the gear oil, the most common complaint we have heard when aftermarket gear oil is used is poor shifting, followed by "noise". Porsche uses some odd-ball full synthetic product that they have made to their specs, the major aftermarket companies (the honest ones anyway) admit they do not have a match for it. The OEM gear oil is not expensive and is readily available.

Chalk this up as experience and get the car attended to………..

[khakwanit1]

I will make a service appointment with the porsche dealership tomorrow. Thank You

[khakwanit1]

I should have gone to the dealership the first time. Porsche dealership is more than an hour away from my house and I figured these are normal maintenance services and shouldn't be that difficult. Should I get both the coolant and transmission fluid replaced or just the coolant? How much would it probably cost (approximately)? I have already paid 450 dollars including the fluids at the previous shop.

[JFP in PA]

You should also check with board members that live in your area, I'm sure there are several top quality indy shops near you that will do a good job and save you some bucks over the dealer, but check around and ask questions.

Try and track down a guy by the name of Maurice Schoir (not sure of the spelling), he frequents this board as well as Pedro's and RennTech. Maurice lives in your area and know everyone worth knowing; he can probably set you up with someone that knows what they are doing.

[JFP in PA]

The biggest savings would be on the hourly labor charges; dealers (depending upon the location) charge well north of $150 an hour (some actually get $200+); indy's charge in the $100-125 an hour. Figure an hour to do the brakes and clutch bleed/flush, half an hour to 45 min. do the gearbox oil change (it can be draining while they are doing something else), and an hour or so to drain and recharge the cooling system. Refilling the cooling system with the vacuum unit is a 5 min. project, the rest of the time is draining the system.

[intakexhaust]

Am I reading this right? $450 for brake, trans fluid and coolant change (T&M) and done at Knuclehead Motors? Well at least they are experts at draining... like your wallet. Should be $200 tops for fluids and labor at an indy. Screw the dealers too.

BTW- I'll do my 3.2 911 for $120. No coolant required, $17 takes care of the trans, and a bit over $100 gets a complete brake job on all four - new pads, whisker shaved rotors and fluid change. DIY DONE!

[Meirschwartz]

About a year ago I bought my 2001 boxster S with 74k miles.
Since the car didn’t have any service history records, I decided to do all the basic maintenance.
One of the things bothered me the most, was the stiffness of the transmission.
The recommended oil change is more or less around the current mileage, So that’s where I started.
Assuming the transmission oil was never changed, I ordered the original OEM transmission oil from sunset Porsche. (Based on our dear friend JFP advice).
To my surprise, when I drained the transmission, clear and clean oil came out, indicating the oil was changed recently. (Definitely didn’t look or smell like a 74k oil).
No need to say that I replaced it anyway.
I can tell you that there is deference with the OEM oil.
The transmission runs better, and it is easier to shift then before.

[intakexhaust]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

The biggest savings would be on the hourly labor charges; dealers (depending upon the location) charge well north of $150 an hour (some actually get $200+); indy's charge in the $100-125 an hour. Figure an hour to do the brakes and clutch bleed/flush, half an hour to 45 min. do the gearbox oil change (it can be draining while they are doing something else), and an hour or so to drain and recharge the cooling system. Refilling the cooling system with the vacuum unit is a 5 min. project, the rest of the time is draining the system.

Right on about 'it can be draining while they are doing something else' and 'refilling the cooling sys w/ the vac unit is a 5 min. job. Even with todays advanced brake systems, proper brake fluid flushes are fast including reset indicators if needed.

This is one of the problems of jobs in America and screwing the general public. In the automotive service industry and I'm not just singling Porsche but this includes GM, Ford and everyone else. I most certainly have high respect for good quality techs and shops as they deserve to be paid for expertise, continued training as specialist, investment in tools and facility, etc. but for such a simple task as fluid changes, IT'S NOT A TECHNICAL or difficult task. No high paid employee or shop should yank out on customers for these type of services. Even worse is when they screw up the basics. I wouldn't take this cr@p from any shop or dealer.

[JFP in PA]

While I really hate to cast aspersions on other shops, I have seen several that totally left me scratching my head. One five man shop I recently visited that only worked on performance cars did not have a single torque wrench in it, not one. Another that supposedly specializes in “German Performance Vehicles” did not own a vacuum filling system or a pressure brake flushing tool. And both of them charge top dollar for their work. Kind of makes you wonder, particularly when you think about how much shop time, much less “come backs”, something like a $100 vacuum coolant system saves on every coolant change out. Hell, even Honda and Nissan spec a vacuum refilling system for their entry level cars…………….

[khakwanit1]

I got a chance to drive the boxster today and the transmission felt a lot better. It is much smoother and shifting has significantly improved. The brakes are fine too so im assuming they did use some vacuum device for that but I can't confirm it because I wasn't there. My negative attitude towards the shop after the coolant issue made me believe that the whole thing was a disaster. However, I am not going to complain about the transmission and brakes anymore. Coolant level is normal and I did bleed the air out and the engine is running great. The temperature is stable and the car sounds good. I am not too concerned about the money because the owner of the shop is my patient and he is definitely not getting any discount from now on. I am going to drive the car for another few days and If I feel anything wrong, I will take it to a proper shop. Thank You so much and I really appreciate your help.

[Steve986]

Now that I've taken the time to read this thread, my curiosity has gotten the better of me. Are you now saying that you're not going to take the car to another mechanic?!!!

If you added two gallons yourself on the way home I'd say there's very little doubt of an improper job! You most likely have air still in your cooling system that can damage the engine. At the very least you need your cooling system properly flushed.

[khakwanit1]

If there is still air in the coolant system, shouldn't I see any symptoms? I made my decision solely based on how the vehicle is running. I honestly feel that there is no more air trapped in the system because when there was air, the temperature went way above 175 and now its only a little over 175 (normal) and I check the fluid level everyday. Can I do something at home to remove the rest of the trapped air? I already opened the bleeder valve and let the car run for 10 mins and added more coolant. After that the level remained normal.

[Steve986]

If there is still air in the coolant system, shouldn't I see any symptoms?

I don't know about that, I wouldn't be surprised if pockets can remain without obvious symptoms.

[khakwanit1]

The sensors would have detected it as well like it did before. I might just get it done just to be on the safe side.