Old spoons are loads of fun......

fred cook · fred cook's Garage

Yep, pun intended! I like to take an older Colt or Winchester or Marlin out for a plinking session now and then. Most of the pieces in my collection date back to pre WWII time frame but I do have some that go as far back as 1872! My latest favorite is a Colt Police Positive Target model that dates to 1935. Typical of Colt target guns, it has a really nice trigger in both single action and double action. When it comes time to grab a (usually) .22 rifle, I like to take either a 1900 vintage Marlin Model 1897 or a Colt Lightning pump rifle from the same time frame. Just something about blued steel and nice wood that is hard to beat! Some pictures:

1901 Colt Lightning and Marlin 1897

1935 Colt Police Positive Target w/target grips added

1941 Colt 1st Model Woodsman Target w/target grips and Wyeth flap holster

1930 Colt Officer Model 38 Special w/carved grips

Seahawk · 07-14-2018, 06:29 AM

Cool!

I love the 1941 Colt 1st Model Woodsman Target w/target grips and Wyeth flap holster.

I need one of those!

My son just bought a Finnish Mauser (?)...we shot it yesterday when he got home from Norfolk.

I'll post a few pics later.

Seahawk · 08:31 AM

It is a Finnish Mosin-Nagant. Jack can tell you why that is cool, I cannot.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mosin%E2%80%93Nagant

I shot it freehand yesterday: 5 inch groups at 50 yards with iron sights. For me, that Annie F'ing Oakley territory.

KFC911 · 07-14-2018, 11:33 AM

OK Annie

I just have to click on Fred's threads like this...just can't help it....drool. Thanks!

tabs · 07-14-2018, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seahawk

It is a Finnish Mosin-Nagant. Jack can tell you why that is cool, I cannot.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mosin%E2%80%93Nagant

I shot it freehand yesterday: 5 inch groups at 50 yards with iron sights. For me, that Annie F'ing Oakley territory.

That is not a Mauser.

Moisin Nagants are not Mausers. A Finnish Moisin is the way to go especially a HB one with SAKO markings...the only way to fly.

I have toyed with the idear of having one as a cheap plinker. NAW...it distracts from getting something really gud.

tabs · 12:18 PM

I don't have either the Lightening nor Marlin.but have the PPT's, OFM's, as well as the pre war WMT

I do have a real nice Rem 12C 22 wrf.

I tend to luv the old hardware...it has class and quality built in.

At one time I had a pile of the OM's...4", 4.5", 5", 6" 7"....22, 32 even a 7" (I regret selling that one), and the ubiquitous 38.

What I really like are the King Super Conversions...I have the trio 22, 32, and 38. As well as a OP 22 KSC. .I have seen one 32 and heard of another in 40 years. The 22 is very scarce.

KFC911 · 07-14-2018, 12:17 PM

Tabs...as yer speeling has degraded, has you forgotten how to post pics?

tabs · 07-14-2018, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seahawk

It is a Finnish Mosin-Nagant. Jack can tell you why that is cool, I cannot.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mosin%E2%80%93Nagant

I shot it freehand yesterday: 5 inch groups at 50 yards with iron sights. For me, that Annie F'ing Oakley territory.

As for Mauser's as of late I am partial to the GEW 98 and 98 Kar AZ's. finding one wt matching no's is the trick...most likely if you find one it is a WW1 or maybe a WW2 bring back.. 1916 is the magic date for a WW1 bring back...dam now that I gave away a secret I am going to have to....

The other thing that is interesting about them is the possible German Freikorps association.. a stock stamp of "EWB" stands for the Bavarian Freikorps, of which Ernest Rohm was a major supplier of arms to..(Rohm was Hitler's buddy and right hand man in the party until he wasn't). Hitler got his start in Munich (Bavaria in the early 20's). The Freikorp is pre Nazi Party, composed of returning WW1 vets who were violently opposed to the communists. There was in essence a civil war in Germany after WW1 where the monarchists and right wing battled it out with the communists (Spartacus movement) in the streets.

If I were to collect German it would be WW1 into the Freikorp Weimar era stuff. The Nazi era stuff is very popular and has been collected to death and that does nothing for me. Finding Freikorp's or Spartacus stuff would be a real challenge, as they were ad hoc movements in a time of real turmoil.

Close to 20 years agoI saw a collection of WW1 German Air Korp memorabilia come up for sale at Julia's auctions. In the collection there was one of Von Richthofen's first 60 aerial victory (after #60 he stopped having them made) sterling silver trophy cups... with the name and date of the plane engraved on it...it went for 15K. The only one ever saw. Another interesting piece that I saw auctioned much later was a Pre WW1 US Army Pilots wings that went for 1500. That is another rarity.

For years I looked for a post WW1 Springfield 03 that was not rebuilt nor molested. Those are real tough to find as most were rebuilt by the military either before WW2, during or after. Most likely it would have to have been a civilian sale in the pre WW2 era. I found a couple that did not measure up and were sixed. In 12/16 I saw a real clean looking one at Cordiers auctions in PA. I called on it...The configuration was a bit strange in that the bolt was in the white and not SNed with an elctropencil. the only 03's wt bolts in the white are National Matches and they after 1924 were Sned wt electro pencil, the crown of the barrel was not star gauged as it should be on a NM. It did have the rear NM sight...Hmmm. I decided to go for it and got it for the cost of a clean standard pre WW2 03.

I get it and it is star gauged with the star gauge no on top of the barrel under the hand guard. BINGO it is a 1922 style 03 NM. It was consigned by the family along with other WW1 vets memorabilia.. Apparently the family connection to the vet had lost all meaning, maybe it was one of his children or even grandchildren who knew him that had passed on and the family decide to get rid of the stuff. I kept a copy of the other consigned stuff along with his name to go with the rifle.

After WW1 a lot of vets joined veterans organizations that held meetings, and then there are the shooting matches at Camp Perry which remain popular today. Also WW1 popularized the BA rifle where as before American preferred LA rifles. This vet was a member and a shooter so he apparently bought what he carried during the Great War from the DCM. It was well cared for and remained in the closet for nearly 100 years as it is nearly pristine.

American commercial rifle makers before the 1930's didn't mfg BA sporting rifles, to fill that gap the Springfield arsenal in MA built 03 Sporters to fill the demand for BA hunting rifles. They were sold through the DCM. the fit and finish on them is of really good commercial quality...in that era there were customs being made by the likes of Griffin Howe, Ownes, Niedner, Hoffman and Sedgley among others. those 03 Sporters come up for sale every so often. G&H is still in biz today..

fred cook · fred cook's Garage

This is probably a 1 of 1 Colt. It started life as a Colt Model 1877 "Lightning" chambered in 38 Long Colt. Made about 1886. Fast forward about 65 years (1953) and a gunsmith by the name of George Matthews located in California decided he needed a gun to take along on walks into the desert and created this. He made inserts for the cylinder and relined the barrel to shoot .22 rimfire, reshaped the birdshead grip to look more like a single action army and added ivory grips. He casehardened the receiver and rust blued the grip frame, cylinder and barrel and made the hammer and recoil plate to work with a rimfire cartridge. In 1969, Guns and Ammo put out a hardback annual that had articles about custom guns. This little 1877 is shown on page 180 along with a short write up. This Colt works perfectly in both single and double action. There were some other gunsmiths that did this kind of conversion, but they converted most of their guns to single action only. So, what you have here is a 132 year old Colt that is essentially brand new! I have shot it a bit and found that it works quite well. Holsters for Colt Lightnings are just about impossible to find so I got Ed Buffaloe in Texas to make a traditional styled holster complete with a hammer loop and pigskin lining. Don't want rough ole leather wearing off any of the bluing!

Jeff Higgins · 07-14-2018, 08:27 PM

Oh yeah - old guns. Good clean fun. Here are a few of mine, a Ballard Pacific in .45-70, a Remington Hepburn in .45-90, and a Winchester Highwall in .40-70 Sharps Straight. All are fine shooters with cast bullets and black powder. The newest one, the Highwall, dates from their first year of manufacture, 1885.

tabs · 07-15-2018, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

Oh yeah - old guns. Good clean fun. Here are a few of mine, a Ballard Pacific in .45-70, a Remington Hepburn in .45-90, and a Winchester Highwall in .40-70 Sharps Straight. All are fine shooters with cast bullets and black powder. The newest one, the Highwall, dates from their first year of manufacture, 1885.

Some cold blue will make them spoons look new again.

KFC911 · 07-15-2018, 02:22 AM

....but he did a nice job on the deck

fred cook · fred cook's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by tabs

Some cold blue will make them spoons look new again.

Talk like that will get you horsewhipped in some circles! But, of course, you were jesting, right?

dmcummins · 07-15-2018, 07:59 AM

I’ve got several old spoons. I’m planning on taking the 1886 45-70 out soon.

Jeff Higgins · 07-15-2018, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC911

....but he did a nice job on the deck

Ooh boy, don't get me started on "name brand" deck sealers. I pressure wash and seal every September. Tried something new this year - you can see the results. I'm just glad they don't try to push this stuff as a "stock finish". Grrrr....

I actually have considered having these refinished. They have no value as "collectables", just as shooters. I hunted with the Ballard for a few years, my hunting partner hunted with the Hepburn at the same time. We both killed a few deer with them.

The Hepburn is the only "original", but even at that, I have now replaced the sights. The Ballard was re-chambered and re-bored from .40-63 to .45-70 in the 1940's, with the new caliber rather crudely stamped over the old. The Highwall was originally a .40-70 Sharps Straight, but with the original chamber meant for .403" diameter bullets - with a .408" groove diameter. My buddy had it re-chambered, at my behest, to the "modern" chamber that allows for .408"-.410" diameter bullets. It shoots far better that way.

So, yeah, re-finishing rifles like these really isn't a foul, as it would be with more collectable, valuable rifles.

dmcummins · 07-15-2018, 08:03 AM

And here is a old pre war German 22.

dmcummins · 07-15-2018, 08:06 AM

I’ve posted pics of my dads old 1885 before.

dmcummins · 07-15-2018, 08:14 AM

And I’ve found myself shooting this 16 ga model 12 built in 1941 regularly at the sporting clays coarse. I hit 89 out of a 100 at the fun shoot last weekend. That’s my best so far. Better than I’ve done shooting my 12 ga Ceasar Guerini that cost close to 10X what the model 12 is worth.

I’ve ordered a new stock and forearm for the model 12. I want a longer LOP and the pad I’ve added slips around a bit. And I want some nicer wood .

Craig T · 07-15-2018, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmcummins

I’ve posted pics of my dads old 1885 before.

Now THAT is spoon porn!

dmcummins · 07-15-2018, 09:29 AM

Thanks, I got some information from a Winchester expert. It’s a first variation shutzen. One of 49 made and the first in rimfire. There were two identical guns made and shipped on the same day.

Most of the shutzen s were second variation.

I’m not sure what all that means, but it sure is a pretty gun.