Anyone do property management for a living?

jhynesrockmtn · 08-14-2018, 08:01 PM

In my search for a post career career, I'm thinking about going into residential property management. I've managed my own rentals for years and currently own a 6 unit apartment building. If I'm managing that, I may as well manage some more is the train of thought. I'm not looking to get rich. I'd focus on smaller landlords, single family to units my size. I'd need to take some courses and get my real estate license. If I could pay for my healthcare and have $2,500/month left over after expenses I'd be happy. Anyone with experience care to chime in?

WPOZZZ · 08-14-2018, 08:05 PM

I manage my own properties. I have a mix of 40 apartments, houses and condos. Lots of people hate property management and the problems you deal with. Me? I have no problem with it. The only thing is when something breaks, it is usually at night or on the weekends. Just make sure you have a good group of trades people you can depend on. To me, it is easy money, and I only work when there is a problem, or when I have to do paperwork.

LakeCleElum · 08-14-2018, 08:30 PM

I know a gal that makes good money doing this. She manages for owners that list on VRBO/AirB&B.....Owners live out of the area, so she schedules cleaners, landscapers, repairs, etc...

epbrown · 08-16-2018, 01:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WPOZZZ

I manage my own properties. I have a mix of 40 apartments, houses and condos. Lots of people hate property management and the problems you deal with.

Did you already have a degree or certification for it?

KFC911 · 08-16-2018, 02:17 AM

I think I'd prefer to keep my "day job" or just croak instead

.

fastfredracing · 08-16-2018, 02:56 AM

A customer and his mother started a company doing this . They are thriving at it , but 7 years in, and they are throwing in the towel .
He says , that dealing with the people , day in , day out has simply burnt them out Rarely is it a positive experience . They have a few hundred properties that they take care of .
I have 6 properties, and find it hard to take care of at times

yahh · 08-16-2018, 04:58 AM

My girlfriend has been in property management since she got out of school in 2012 and is now a property manager. She loves it, but I can definitely see it taking a toll on her. She is trying to make a corporate move before she gets too burnt out with face to face issues.

Don Ro · 08-16-2018, 05:12 AM

I did some work for the MBA who was responsible for the money that got Apple off the ground...a huge estate, they had.
They asked me to take over the maintenance of their property in the Los Altos Hills...Calif.
The word spread and soon I was managing the personal properties of other Silicon Valley big hitters.
Then, an opportunity to manage a large condo complex...that did me in.
Too many petty complaints and in-fighting during HOA board meetings. I resigned from that within 4 months.

berettafan · 08-16-2018, 05:39 AM

briefly did it on the side and deal with several on a regular basis now.

STAY FAR AWAY. it is a miserable job with no end to potential lawsuits from lunatic tenants, owners, HOA's, etc etc etc.

my buddy and I opted to get out of the business when a unit owner in one of our first buildings called me on a Saturday and asked me who she would sue if her father fell down the back stairs. no one had fallen but this was her question. I explained to her she would sue herself and her neighbors as the HOA.

Stay far, far away from it. it is a job for a young man with nothing to lose.

recycled sixtie · recycled sixtie's Garage

When I was on the condo board there were always a couple of owners who gave us a really hard time at the AGM. So we hired a condo lawyer to attend each subsequent AGM. It is worth the money to do so and he is still there on a regular basis.

The worst situation I have heard of was several years ago in our city when a condo owner knifed a condo management rep following a meeting.

It is a tough way to make a living. You can choose tenants for your properties but not choose the owners in a property you manage. Not for faint of heart but is doable if you are so inclined.

Dantilla · 08-16-2018, 06:50 AM

I've enjoyed property management, but I've only managed properties I own myself.

Several years ago I hired a management company for a smaller apartment complex I had.
Most of their business was single-family homes and duplexes, so when they lost a key person due to medical issues, and needed to scale back, I asked if they would rather not deal with my apartments. I was surprised to find out I was their favorite, as we worked well together with a spirit of cooperation. Most owners looked at the management company as an "us-vs-them" situation, assuming the management company was out to rip them off.

Perhaps I'd managed enough by then to truly know what it takes, time and money, to have a well-run apartment community.
It doesn't happen by itself.

Dantilla · 08-16-2018, 06:55 AM

A friend who has acquired a bunch of single-family rentals of his own has been asked several times by others to manage for them.

He recently decided to form a new management company and work for other owners, with the goal of being very picky on properties he will manage, and "firing" property owners who cause problems.

I'll get an update on how it's going for him and report back.....

Tidybuoy · 08-16-2018, 07:02 AM

I'm wondering, as a property management company, can you pick and choose your clients? If I were in that business, I would strive to manage higher quality properties to minimize issues. It seems like people that have constant maintenance issues and complaints are dealing with crappy real estate.

Don Ro · 08-16-2018, 07:26 AM

^^^
My negative experience was mostly due to personality issues WRT the condo owners.

jhynesrockmtn · 08-16-2018, 07:45 AM

Good responses, thanks for the input. I am in a position to be picky with who I would take on and I would not need to take on a property for $ reasons. I would never manage an owners property who was renting out a condo. I've had many friends with bad condo experiences and most associations actively (for good reasons) move to limit rentals. I'm meeting with a smaller property management company owner next week who is on the Board of the landlord association I am part of to pick his brain.

epbrown · 08-16-2018, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by recycled sixtie

When I was on the condo board there were always a couple of owners who gave us a really hard time at the AGM. So we hired a condo lawyer to attend each subsequent AGM. It is worth the money to do so and he is still there on a regular basis.

Here in KY, you can manage a property you own with no credentials but to manage other properties you need a real estate license and a bunch of classes in property management. Pretty much all the classes are about legal issues. Talk about alarm bells.

recycled sixtie · recycled sixtie's Garage

Interesting topic. There are management companies and there are management companies. You can pick and choose your management co and you can give notice to your present one if you are not happy with it. When I was on the board we gave notice to the existing management co because they would not let us handle our money.

We found a new management co that they let us sign cheques and receive checks and deposit them. 2 board members had to sign for checks and there was no chance of misappropriation of funds. The original man co was a huge listed corporation but the complaints against them were huge. Extricating ourselves out of that contract needed the help of our condo lawyer.

A management co to be successful must be firm but fair. If you need a condo lawyer then so be it as it is worth it. A personable person representing the man co at an AGM helps . There will nearly always be rebel rousers at the meetings though.

CalPersFatCat · 08-16-2018, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by epbrown

Here in KY, you can manage a property you own with no credentials but to manage other properties you need a real estate license and a bunch of classes in property management. Pretty much all the classes are about legal issues. Talk about alarm bells.

In Ohio, same requirements.

The fly in the ointment is finding a Broker willing to put his E&O insurance at risk by allowing one of his agents to do property management.

The answer of course would be to get your broker license as soon as possible. Quite a process to get to a different end.

I have a 40 unit, a 4 unit and am acquiring B and A class SFR's at a brisk pace. These B's and A's are essentially self managing. They are brand new rehabs, occupied by millennial's, whom pay the rent with their iphone. On the rare occasion when they are "late", they much prefer to click on "add late fee" than to have a conversation with me. When I was in SoCal I had a gal pay a $90 late fee every month for 2 years before she finally moved out. I don't mind the lates and I don't mind the extra money. Whatever. It's just a part of it (the buy and hold game)...

My advice is beg, borrow, and (almost) steal to get private money and buy and manage for yourself. Learn about syndicating. Network.

There is a ton of money out there. Go find some of it.

DL

LWJ · 08-16-2018, 09:04 AM

I used to manage my own properties. I was awful at it.

I hired two managers. One is awful. One is ok.

I have a bunch of clients in the biz. You can make ok money, no money, or good money. Just like anything.

I think this is a good idea as you have realistic expectations. You will most likely find many other owners who want to hand the tedium off to you. As said before, having a crack team of contractors and maintenance people makes your life much better.

As said above, pick your clients.

Here is some professional advice. I do commercial insurance with these folks. You will want to have Errors and Omissions coverage if you manage for others. You will want to have Tenant Discrimination coverage as well - tenants like to make claims! General Liability claims to PM's are few and far between but the coverage is priced disproportionately high. Don't know why. If you can get it from State Farm or similar, it will be cheaper. USLI has a nifty sounding policy with lots of coverage baked in but there are significant coverage holes in the GL portion. Last piece - have separation of duties on the accounting end. The large volumes of cash make it very easy to embezzle.

Last, on the health coverage, if you can have an employee or two, you can buy group coverage. It typically offers more options and better pricing that individual. That said, you are in Washington, which is sort of a train-wreck in this area.

jhynesrockmtn · 08-16-2018, 09:06 AM

Quote:

My advice is beg, borrow, and (almost) steal to get private money and buy and manage for yourself. Learn about syndicating. Network.

There is a ton of money out there. Go find some of it.

If I were younger, I would be more in this mode. I've always had a regular job and owned residential rental property on the side. At it's largest, my ex and I owned 4 single family rentals in Seattle and a commercial building (apts and retail) in a small town. When we divorced, I sort of got out of the game before moving to Spokane which is a small town by Seattle standards, I bought the building I have now after liquidating my last Seattle property in 2016.

I am 55, my wife is a bit older will start taking her SS early 2019 and work part time. We have other solid retirement holdings, large cap high dividend stocks and managed funds. The 6 unit building we have throws off a nice positive cash flow and we have about 60% equity in it. I'm not looking for more debt. If we found a good deal, I might acquire a few more units but the market is hot here now and not a good time to buy. If it were to cool off I'd start looking for a duplex or fourplex.