A border discussion outside PARF?

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by ficke

We could start with the sanctuary cities.

Absolutely. All federal funds to the states that have these should end immediately.

[group911@aol.co]

Originally Posted by 996AE

Google is your friend.

Let say for kicks that I am factual correct. And, I am. The illegals are sucking the system dry. Even the LA Liberal Times said it. Housing, schools, hospitals, police, fire jails all strained directly by our 1M illegals in LA County alone. This is a fact. The net loss to providing for unskilled, poor health uneducated people is not hard to comprehend.

What is your answer to these facts?

This issue is not that we are not compassionate and dont want to help. But when your lifeboat is full, and it is (22T Fed debt.) tough choices have to be made. How many is too many?

Guess you're gonna have to school me on Google searches as I can't find the one supporting your "facts".

[URY914]

As I understand it those that cross the border without any papers/ID can not simply be "returned". The country has to agree to taking them back, but without an ID which country do the go back to? It's a problem that not often explained.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by stomachmonkey

Agreed, my opinion is we should be tackling it in the reverse order.

Work on other stuff and we may find we need far less wall than currently proposed.
.

I listened to an interview with an immigrant who talked about the message they get in Honduras - bring your child and apply for asylum and you are much more likely to get in and stay while your asylum case is being decided, plus your kid gets a head start on life in a place where there is work. The smuggler charges a lower price for adults with a kid.
That's the message they get.
How much suffering could we stop by correcting the message they receive in their home country? Educate them before they leave of the dangers and the small likelihood that their lives will actually be better. If there really is an interest in alleviating the humanitarian crisis we would be putting resources into preventing them from embarking on a journey fraught with that we describe as "murders, rapes, and assualts", we would be working to stop them from embarking. It's cruel and ultimately a recipe for failure if all we do is put up a barrier and let them suffer the murders, rapes, assualts, and other depredations on the journey north and only then let them figure out that they had been lied to by the trafficers.

[996AE]

Originally Posted by group911@aol.co

Guess you're gonna have to school me on Google searches as I can't find the one supporting your "facts".

Here are just a few samples of facts on the cost of supporting illegals in SoCal. None of these studies talk about the impact these uneducated, poor health, unskilled people put on our schools, police, fire, jails, housing, roads and bridges.

Our life boat is full. 22T in Federal debt., and growing. How many is too many?

Please dont let the facts hurt your feelings.

https://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2013/09/16/undocumented-la-county-parents-projected-to-receive-650m-in-welfare-benefits/

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/la-made-1-3b-in-illegal-immigrant-welfare-payouts-in-just-2-years

https://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2007/10/illegal-immigrants-cost-l-county-1-billion-year/

Please note the Billion dollars cost to taxpayers is 10 years old. I know facts, math, logic and reason can be a stretch for Liberals but do you think, try hard now that maybe this 12 year old study if done today is A) higher cost to taxpayers or B) Lower

Hint. There are more illegals today than 12 years ago and healthcare cost have skyrocketed since 2007.

These studies are old but you get the point. Today its not PC to do these studies and publish results. Fear, hate and racist if you do. But you get the points. Cost are higher today than before as populations have swelled and cost have soared.

If you will take the time to read and look at the math here the numbers are staggering. Now, multiple this buy the 75k per month that we know about crossing our borders illegally, and the many others we dont catch and ask yourself how long can we sustain this invasion?

Hard truths.

We are a great, compassionate people. But we are no good to anyone, including our own families if we kill the goose laying the golden eggs.

We simply cant have an open door and open check book and feed the world. God knows I wish we could but its not feasible.

Please wake up.

[996AE]

Originally Posted by group911@aol.co

Guess you're gonna have to school me on Google searches as I can't find the one supporting your "facts".

Here are just a few samples of facts on the cost of supporting illegals in SoCal. None of these studies talk about the impact this uneducated, poor health, unskilled people put on our schools, police, fire, jails, housing, roads and bridges.

Our life boat is full. 22T in Federal debt., and growing. How many is too many?

Please dont let the facts hurt your feelings.

https://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2013/09/16/undocumented-la-county-parents-projected-to-receive-650m-in-welfare-benefits/

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/la-made-1-3b-in-illegal-immigrant-welfare-payouts-in-just-2-years

https://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2007/10/illegal-immigrants-cost-l-county-1-billion-year/

Please note the Billion dollars cost to taxpayers is 10 years old. I know facts, math, logic and reason can be a stretch for Liberals but do you think, try hard now that maybe this 12 year old study if done today is A) higher cost to taxpayers or B) Lower

Hint. There are more illegals today than 12 years ago and healthcare cost have skyrocketed since 2007.

If you will take the time to read and look at the math here the numbers are staggering. Now, multiple this buy the 75k per month that we know about crossing our borders illegally, and the many others we dont catch and ask yourself how long can we sustain this invasion?

Hard truths.

We are a great, compassionate people. But we are no good to anyone, including our own families if we kill the goose laying the golden eggs.

We simply cant have an open door and open check book and feed the world. God knows I wish we could but its not feasible.

Please wake up.

[Tobra]

Originally Posted by stomachmonkey

Absolute nonsense.

Not one bit true.

You are mistaken, and your tone is a bit harsh.

[RSBob]

I was so wrong, this discussion doesn’t belong in PARF at all. PARF is where people relentlessly try to convert the opposition to their point of view citing ‘facts’ while the other side dismisses said facts and it goes on for pages and pages and usually deteriorates to insults. This is nothing like that.

[billybek]

Originally Posted by RSBob

I was so wrong, this discussion doesn’t belong in PARF at all. PARF is where people relentlessly try to convert the opposition to their point of view citing ‘facts’ while the other side dismisses said facts and it goes on for pages and pages and usually deteriorates to insults. This is nothing like that.

Lol!

[stomachmonkey]

Originally Posted by 996AE

Here are just a few samples of facts on the cost of supporting illegals in SoCal. None of these studies talk about the impact this uneducated, poor health, unskilled people put on our schools, police, fire, jails, housing, roads and bridges.

Our life boat is full. 22T in Federal debt., and growing. How many is too many?

Please dont let the facts hurt your feelings.

https://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2013/09/16/undocumented-la-county-parents-projected-to-receive-650m-in-welfare-benefits/

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/la-made-1-3b-in-illegal-immigrant-welfare-payouts-in-just-2-years

https://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2007/10/illegal-immigrants-cost-l-county-1-billion-year/

Please note the Billion dollars cost to taxpayers is 10 years old. I know facts, math, logic and reason can be a stretch for Liberals but do you think, try hard now that maybe this 12 year old study if done today is A) higher cost to taxpayers or B) Lower

Hint. There are more illegals today than 12 years ago and healthcare cost have skyrocketed since 2007.

If you will take the time to read and look at the math here the numbers are staggering. Now, multiple this buy the 75k per month that we know about crossing our borders illegally, and the many others we dont catch and ask yourself how long can we sustain this invasion?

Hard truths.

We are a great, compassionate people. But we are no good to anyone, including our own families if we kill the goose laying the golden eggs.

We simply cant have an open door and open check book and feed the world. God knows I wish we could but its not feasible.

Please wake up.

Amazing you read those and still don't realize exactly why you are wrong.

[rcooled]

Originally Posted by stomachmonkey

Amazing you read those and still don't realize exactly why you are wrong.

Could you please point out either why those statistics are wrong, or why they don't support 996AE's position?

[group911@aol.co]

Originally Posted by 996AE View Post
Google is your friend.

Let say for kicks that I am factual correct. And, I am. The illegals are sucking the system dry. Even the LA Liberal Times said it. Housing, schools, hospitals, police, fire jails all strained directly by our 1M illegals in LA County alone. This is a fact. The net loss to providing for unskilled, poor health uneducated people is not hard to comprehend.

What is your answer to these facts?

This issue is not that we are not compassionate and dont want to help. But when your lifeboat is full, and it is (22T Fed debt.) tough choices have to be made. How many is too many?

Originally Posted by group911@aol.co

Guess you're gonna have to school me on Google searches as I can't find the one supporting your "facts".

I'm still waiting for that LA Liberal Times article you quote.

[stomachmonkey]

Originally Posted by rcooled

Could you please point out either why those statistics are wrong, or why they don't support 996AE's position?

Originally Posted by 996AE

...Once entered with family in tow they are now on the taxpayer payroll for life.

That's an opinion not supported by any fact presented because there is no fact that supports it. Only US citizens, and conditionally, legal residents are eligible for public assistance. There's a hint in there.

Originally Posted by 996AE

We cant send them back.

Sure we can. We do it all the time.

Originally Posted by 996AE

Healthcare, food, shelter, education all paid for by US taxpayers.

Yes, paid for by taxpayers. That's another hint. So is this, there are two sides to a balance sheet.

[stomachmonkey]

Originally Posted by group911@aol.co

....
I'm still waiting for that LA Liberal Times article you quote.

Me too.

[JackDidley]

Originally Posted by group911@aol.co

This issue is not that we are not compassionate and dont want to help. But when your lifeboat is full, and it is (22T Fed debt.) tough choices have to be made. How many is too many?
.

^^^^^ This. Get things under control, if that is even possible. At some point the situation has to change. I have dealt with illegals and it was not good. They took advantage of the U.S. education system for their kids. They took advantage of the medical system when the kids were born and paid for none of it. When they got their 1099 it went in the trash. I did contract work for the same company and I paid my taxes when the time came.
I do not do politics. I do not judge people by the way they vote. I have other priorities but it is time to do something.

[KFC911]

I attended a bridal shower yesterday afternoon and discussed embroidery...

See ya in PARF ....