Jax guys....was it NAS?

[KFC911]

Big azz jet in the H20...has to be NAS? Any details....cool as hell to be on a sailboat beneath jet fighters

[KFC911]

Nevermind....saw Byron's post in the other thread...

[Racerbvd]

Yes

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by KC911

Big azz jet in the H20...has to be NAS? Any details....cool as hell to be on a sailboat beneath jet fighters

Can someone translate to English please? I don’t read “a Florida man shorthand” or whatever that was written in.

[KFC911]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

Can someone translate to English please? I don’t read “a Florida man shorthand” or whatever that was written in.

Nope

Byron understands...any Jax guy would!

[Zeke]

NAS = National Airspace System.
Glen, I think you already know about them. Or should. I read about them last year. Kind of a freaky deal if you ask me. Apparently if the military wants an otherwise commercial flight to be more or less out of the system, they fly by the rules of the NAS using all of the resources of the FAA.

Anyone who understands this better, please chime in.

[93nav]

NAS - Naval Air Station???

[Eric Coffey]

Originally Posted by 93nav

NAS - Naval Air Station???

Yes, NAS = Naval Air Station (JAX in this case).

The other NAS (National Airspace System) just refers to the all-encompassing network of airports/navs/atc/airspace/regs/etc.

[seafeye]

News article said the plane left ORF around 0530, flew to NAS JAX, Gitmo, then back to NAS JAX. Crash around 2140, or approx. 16:10 hrs after the first takeoff. No mention if it was one or two crews.

[Eric Coffey]

Originally Posted by seafeye

News article said the plane left ORF around 0530, flew to NAS JAX, Gitmo, then back to NAS JAX. Crash around 2140, or approx. 16:10 hrs after the first takeoff. No mention if it was one or two crews.

Guaranteed crew change. No more 16+ hour days for flight crews (changed it a few years back).

[seafeye]

You sure? On reserve pilots can do 18 hour duty days. Line holders 14 plus 2 hour extension.

[Racerbvd]

A link to pictures

https://www.actionnewsjax.com/news/photos/chopper-photos-sky-action-news-jax-over-nas-jax-after-plane-skidded-into-st-johns-river/946301790

One I took crossing the Buckman bridge, just south of NAS.

[rattlsnak]

Originally Posted by seafeye

You sure? On reserve pilots can do 18 hour duty days. Line holders 14 plus 2 hour extension.

^^That isn't exactly right... Part 135 and part 121 and part 91 flight crews all have different rest/duty requirements and limitations. Part 121 is 16 hours max by reg, BUT 99% of all airlines have contractual limits much lower than that, usually around 10 or 12 hours and also based on the time of day, how many time zones you cross, etc.. . Part 135 can have up to 14 hours of duty, and part 91 has NO limit. Miami Air usually operates under Part 135 so had to been a crew change or somebody in deep doo doo..

[seafeye]

I’m not sure any 121 airline has a 10 or 12 hour limit. That would be awesome. That chart was copied from our Union website. 117 is what we use for our rest rules. Our contract isn’t as restrictive.
I actually prefer the older rest rules. 8 hours flight before. Now it’s 9. Depending on the amount of legs.
18 hours is actually legal for reserves. And a lot more frequent than you’d think.
Just yesterday with the weather delays at New York we were scheduled 16:39 duty day.
Miami air flying a 737, I’m going to assume they are operating under part 121.

It’s interesting to note that the highest paid Captain at Miami Air is about what a 3rd year First Officer makes at a major airline. Retirement is 1/2.

[KFC911]

Originally Posted by Racerbvd

....

One I took crossing the Buckman bridge, just south of NAS.

The St. John's is only waist deep for much of that area....except for the dredged channel...and the tide . I know....

This would have been funny except for the pets in the belly of the jet .

[tcar]

Private Charter Airlines Flight – Miami Air International



And the fleet... the -400 is all first class; chartered to sports teams, mostly...

http://www.aircharterguide.com/Operator_Info/MIAMI+AIR+INTERNATIONAL%5Bc%5D+INC%5Bdot%5D/1922/ATLANTA/2124

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by KC911

The St. John's is only waist deep for much of that area....except for the dredged channel...and the tide . I know....

This would have been funny except for the pets in the belly of the jet .

Yes, the nor not rescuing the pets really bothers me

[tcar]

Originally Posted by Racerbvd

Yes, the nor not rescuing the pets really bothers me

Too risky, they determined...
Since the hold is mostly under water, they probably died within minutes of the immersion...

Rescuers went into the hold, no visible pet crates or sounds whatsoever.
The plane was still settling slightly; was too dangerous to send people in there....

[rattlsnak]

Originally Posted by seafeye

I’m not sure any 121 airline has a 10 or 12 hour limit.
18 hours is actually legal for reserves. And a lot more frequent than you’d think.
Just yesterday with the weather delays at New York we were scheduled 16:39 duty day.
Miami air flying a 737, I’m going to assume they are operating under part 121.
.

99% of 121 carriers have @12 hour scheduling limit....contractually.. Reserve crews have the same limitations... No carrier for hire can be scheduled for more than 16 hours (if you dont have contractual limits). You can certainly start a trip and be delayed due to weather etc enroute, and go over the limit, but you cannot depart KNOWING you will be over the limit when you land.

@seafeye Shoot me a PM with your carrier. I apologize in advance if I'm wrong, but if i am, you're the 1%!

[seafeye]

Hate to jump to conclusions but sure looks like pilot error. Maybe a fatigue issue as well. Still trying to source wether the crew was on duty for 16 hours...

On May 5th 2019 the NTSB reported in their press conference, weather has complicated their efforts. The FDR was read out, preliminary information indicated the IAS at touchdown was 163 knots, 178 knots over ground (about 15 knots tail wind) at 30 degrees of flaps, ground spoilers deployed 3 seconds after touch down. The left hand thrust reverser was inoperative and the aircraft was dispatched under MEL. The CVR is still in the tail of the aircraft and under water. About 1200 gallons of fuel were remaining (some fuel spilled into the river). Divers are currently trying to remove the pets from the forward cargo bay. The crew initially planned to land to the west (runway 28), however, as the aircraft got closer to the airport they requested runway 10. Due to a deployed wire barrier the runway threshold was displaced by about 1200 feet leaving 7800 feet of landing distance available. (end of conference)