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-   -   recent mass shootings what's going on ??? (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic-discussions/1036487-recent-mass-shootings-whats-going.html)

KFC911 08-09-2019 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabmando (Post 10552881)
The argument of "ban the AR-15" is also valid if we view this from a standpoint of the 2A being abused by people. Why shouldn't we ban it? People are abusing it.. right?

I say no ban....just controlled....like full-autos, etc.

Why not? At least more scrutiny than my Henry .22 had...jmo.

cabmandone 08-09-2019 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC911 (Post 10552889)
I say no ban....just controlled....like full-autos, etc.

Why not? At least more scrutiny than my Henry .22 had...jmo.

But where do you stop from a scrutiny standpoint? I don't recall if I pointed it out here but there are semi auto shotguns capable of holding a 30 round barrel drum. How about pistols with extended mags or double stack mags? Where does the line get drawn? I'm not suggesting a ban of the AR... just making the point that the slippery slope argument of people potentially abusing a red flag law could be applied to guns as well.

Rawknees'Turbo 08-09-2019 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabmando (Post 10552875)
Nope! Dad said he'd write any of the kids out of the will if they became attorneys. I would support a red flag law because I believe there is potential for it to stop someone from carrying out a mass shooting. Like I said, sure it "could" be abused... but if the argument is "don't do it because someone will abuse it", then the argument of "get rid of the 2A because people do abuse it" is a valid argument.

This is a very good point; many people have been abusing gun ownership since the inception of 2A (and even before), so therefore, it should have never been put in place to begin with. Interesting how that argument can pretty much be applied to every rule and regulation you can think of.

Tervuren 08-09-2019 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rawknees'Turbo (Post 10552494)
I just saw a brief video of The Orange Man Bad claiming that violent video games are a contributor to real violence and that they should be dealt with. Guess that bisch doesn't pay attention to stats that say otherwise. :)

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/here-s-what-we-know-about-links-between-video-games-n852776

Well, it seems he did.

I know my reaction to my first semi-modern bloody video game.

"I would never want this IRL".

The mental and family framework is far more important.

It controls how you react to what you see.

People who play these games and later kill people, already had the mental framework in place to "go postal" prior to playing these games.

At least Trump is meeting about it instead of dictating; I wonder if they'll change his mind and rhetoric?

My advice to parents speaking as a gamer? The longer you can keep your kids engaged physically the better. Don't use electronic devices as pacifiers. If your kids have questions, work out answers with them, maintain inquisitiveness and problem solving. Teach your kids to persist to success.

Video Games are very useful, I learned a lot from the use of online games especially. An incredible world of people I may only know for a short while; a desire to win and inquire ability to rapidly recognize different ways people think and shift the way I act to get along. If I want to win, there will be people I disagree with on my team. To win, I have to work with them regardless.

The games are not the root problem. They can be a blessing. Do your best to build a healthy mental framework that seeks success and can move past failure.

At an early age direct control of yes this and no that is very good, builds discipline, an important part of structure.
But there comes an age where you have to promote inquisitiveness and finding answers; because you won't always be there to say yes this is good, or no that is bad.
Fail to do that, and as soon as they are out of your house they'll go straight for whatever you said no to.

Any videogame, violent, or non violent, can be bad or used in a way that is bad.
There is a lot of non violent content that is designed to be addictive rather than positive, that is bad.
Movies/books/videogames also will always be used by the creators for ideological preaching in some way.
At a young age I'd treat them no different than a neighborhood kid playing with your kid. Unless you are present, you won't directly know what that neighborhood kid is teaching your kid.

island911 08-09-2019 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabmando (Post 10552875)
Nope! Dad said he'd write any of the kids out of the will if they became attorneys. I would support a red flag law because I believe there is potential for it to stop someone from carrying out a mass shooting. Like I said, sure it "could" be abused... but if the argument is "don't do it because someone will abuse it", then the argument of "get rid of the 2A because people do abuse it" is a valid argument.

You are missing the fundamentals of freedom. --Which isn't free, but rather a smart balance of fundamentals on human behaivor that afford the individual the best environment for the pursuit of happiness.

island911 08-09-2019 08:59 AM

So much of the population believes that every gun owner should be flagged. --Abuse is certain. Not maybe.

KFC911 08-09-2019 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabmando (Post 10552891)
But where do you stop from a scrutiny standpoint? I don't recall if I pointed it out here but there are semi auto shotguns capable of holding a 30 round barrel drum. How about pistols with extended mags or double stack mags? Where does the line get drawn? I'm not suggesting a ban of the AR... just making the point that the slippery slope argument of people potentially abusing a red flag law could be applied to guns as well.

17 in a pistol, 15 in a rifle....or ever how many a .22lr holds.

See...it was that damn easy :)

If you gots a problem with those #s....lets talk ;).

You can still get 'bout anything more...but with more restrictions and scrutiny...like full auto.

madcorgi 08-09-2019 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC911 (Post 10552889)
I say no ban....just controlled....like full-autos, etc.

Why not? At least more scrutiny than my Henry .22 had...jmo.

At this point, the question is not whether there will be a ban, but when. As soon as a Democrat takes the WH, it will be possible to do it through executive action or declaration of national emergency. Think they will resist that urge?

But a more intriguing possibility has arisen of late. Trump is signaling he wants to do something on guns, and is suggesting background checks be expanded. Said today that McConnell is on board with it. The Post reported last night that he is already planning a signing ceremony in the Rose Garden. Perhaps Trump is planning a little unexpected reality show type twist by going hard over on gun control? That would be awesome.

Chocaholic 08-09-2019 10:23 AM

Yet, you would criticize.

Tervuren 08-09-2019 10:24 AM

Speaking of exposing kids to violence.

Church!

Songs about how good it was that a man was beaten, bruised, and whipped until he no longer had enough flesh to be recognized as a man. He was nailed to a tree with a crown of thorns beaten into his head. It was a good thing to stick a spear into his corpse just to make sure he was dead.

Rivers of blood, fountains of blood, bathing in blood! All these things in songs, probably even oceans of blood.

A man stands up screaming, "I BEEN COVERED IN THE BLOOD! I BEEN COVERED IN THE BLOOD".

Do any of you objectively step back and realize how much blood and gore is brought up on a regular basis in church?

cabmandone 08-09-2019 10:29 AM

AGAIN... it would not be possible for a democrat, should they win, to ban a certain type of weapon. It would most certainly go to the Supreme Court where it would be tossed in a hot second. The action by the POTUS to divert funds towards border security is totally legal and in no way, shape, or form changes the constitutional powers of congress. That's a bull**** democrat talking point.

I haven't had a single supporter of expanded background checks explain exactly which of these mass shootings expanded background checks in their current form would have prevented. There is no proof that expanding background checks to include private party sales will do anything to reduce the occurrence of mass shootings. It's a symbolic gesture.

cabmandone 08-09-2019 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by island911 (Post 10552943)
So much of the population believes that every gun owner should be flagged. --Abuse is certain. Not maybe.

That's an assumption more so than a reality.

flipper35 08-09-2019 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by island911 (Post 10552413)
Police: Man with rifle, bulletproof vest at Springfield, Missouri, Walmart store

Was it a Police man?

Point being, slap on a badge and suddenly...

It was an off duty firefighter. Police arrived 3 minutes later.

Eric Coffey 08-09-2019 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabmando (Post 10552875)
but if the argument is "don't do it because someone will abuse it", then the argument of "get rid of the 2A because people do abuse it" is a valid argument.

You are conflating rights with laws.

flipper35 08-09-2019 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tervuren (Post 10552932)
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/here-s-what-we-know-about-links-between-video-games-n852776

Well, it seems he did.

I know my reaction to my first semi-modern bloody video game.

"I would never want this IRL".

The mental and family framework is far more important.

It controls how you react to what you see.

People who play these games and later kill people, already had the mental framework in place to "go postal" prior to playing these games.

At least Trump is meeting about it instead of dictating; I wonder if they'll change his mind and rhetoric?

My advice to parents speaking as a gamer? The longer you can keep your kids engaged physically the better. Don't use electronic devices as pacifiers. If your kids have questions, work out answers with them, maintain inquisitiveness and problem solving. Teach your kids to persist to success.

Video Games are very useful, I learned a lot from the use of online games especially. An incredible world of people I may only know for a short while; a desire to win and inquire ability to rapidly recognize different ways people think and shift the way I act to get along. If I want to win, there will be people I disagree with on my team. To win, I have to work with them regardless.

The games are not the root problem. They can be a blessing. Do your best to build a healthy mental framework that seeks success and can move past failure.

At an early age direct control of yes this and no that is very good, builds discipline, an important part of structure.
But there comes an age where you have to promote inquisitiveness and finding answers; because you won't always be there to say yes this is good, or no that is bad.
Fail to do that, and as soon as they are out of your house they'll go straight for whatever you said no to.

Any videogame, violent, or non violent, can be bad or used in a way that is bad.
There is a lot of non violent content that is designed to be addictive rather than positive, that is bad.
Movies/books/videogames also will always be used by the creators for ideological preaching in some way.
At a young age I'd treat them no different than a neighborhood kid playing with your kid. Unless you are present, you won't directly know what that neighborhood kid is teaching your kid.

What about paintball or Airsoft? Airsoft especially as it has realistic weapons and you are running around shooting each other, literally.

The kids and I go out and play now and then. It is good exercise. Most of the people I have played with were pretty well rounded. There was one pair the local youth pastor invited who were attending the local college on a track scholarship. They were from Chicago and it brought back some intense memories. Said youth pastor is now with the Border Patrol.

island911 08-09-2019 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabmando (Post 10553040)
That's an assumption more so than a reality.

It's an observation of reality.

Others in possession of Guns causes anxiety in many who are afraid of guns.

Is it the UK where beat cops don't carry for fear of making people uncomfortable? Yes, people have anxiety.

Here's the thing, all sorts of US citizens carry deadly force while keeping out of sight in effort to lower anxiety in others. But make no mistake, that anxiety is real and will generate all sorts of "Red Flags" against gun owners for the new found crime of possessing a firearm.

island911 08-09-2019 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric Coffey (Post 10553058)
You are conflating rights with laws.

https://66.media.tumblr.com/793b2344...4o7go1_400.gif

Nailed it.

Rawknees'Turbo 08-09-2019 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tervuren (Post 10553032)
Speaking of exposing kids to violence.

Church!

Songs about how good it was that a man was beaten, bruised, and whipped until he no longer had enough flesh to be recognized as a man. He was nailed to a tree with a crown of thorns beaten into his head. It was a good thing to stick a spear into his corpse just to make sure he was dead.

Rivers of blood, fountains of blood, bathing in blood! All these things in songs, probably even oceans of blood.

A man stands up screaming, "I BEEN COVERED IN THE BLOOD! I BEEN COVERED IN THE BLOOD".

Do any of you objectively step back and realize how much blood and gore is brought up on a regular basis in church?

That is one of the many things that has both disgusted and made me laugh about organized religion since about the age of 13-14; the absurd hypocrisy of it all is really something to see.

fintstone 08-09-2019 11:31 AM

If you ban the sale of black rifles...then the folks that already have them will have a serious advantage in a gunfight. Doesn't that just make things more dangerous?

island911 08-09-2019 12:11 PM

LOL

apparently we need to make some efforts to make others not so anxiety ridden.


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1565381088.jpg

just look at all of those mean BLACK guns on the wall.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1565381456.jpg


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