The trades.

[pmax]

Who got traded ?

[Brian 162]

Originally Posted by biosurfer1

Might be decent money but so many tradesmen I know look 20 years older than they are, have back problems, knee problems, joint issues, respiratory issues, and on and on. I'm sure health and safety in that industry has come a long way but it sure makes it hard to suggest that route to youngsters.

You are correct. I worked in HVAC. I did a lot of heavy lifting delivering and removing commercial boilers and water heaters. My back, lungs and knees are fine. I breathed flux every day while soldering, plus working around asbestos and fiberglass. My old company was really good regarding health and safety.
I retired in 2015 at the age of 55. The only lingering issue I have is with my hands. I have slight pain between my thumb and forefinger. It's from holding large copper pipe and cutting in without using a pipe vice.

[look 171]

Where do I start?

We have the same problem here and it seem the only young men who are willing to do any type of work are the Latino youth that aren't college bound. I have not seen a young white kid working the trades in a very long time. Unlike 30 years ago when I started. My painter was an Irish American, tile setter was of Greek heritage, the other was British. If these kids have any college in them such as Jr college, we've lost them and many of them wouldn't go into the trades. Even in Jr colleges, the trades are look down upon by faculty, parents, and other students. I have not seen any young punks under the age of 25 or 30 working for any of my subs. My stucco man, his two kids, one is willing to sweep floors, the other works as a driver for Amazon instead of working for dad. He's done pretty well for an immigrant from south of the border with absolutely no education. Both his kids did not finish HS and has no plan to take over the business. I suppose I understand that also, b ecause I did not take over my dad's jewelry making business only to push forward with my own interest.

I taught Shop classes upon graduation from college. My CA credential is still valid and paid to keep it that way every few years. It was Wood shop, construction and architecture. I was the dumping ground for the failing kids. Not many of the parents wanted their kids in those classes because they were in the trades themselves working for little money because many of them were first gen immigrants with little schooling. Some of the faculty say it to me all the times. "Put those who fail english or math in your class so they can learn a trade. Special ed kids need to learn a trade so they can make a living". My reply was always, do you want that special ed kid working on your brakes or build the cantilever home's foundation on the hill side or you want the math wiz?

John is correct, the trades are not friendly to one's body. By 50, they need to slow way down. My father told me and I am glad it was the only thing it stuck with me. There's always someone that will do the heavy lifting. For a couple years in my early 20s, I did some dirty work including framing. I hated it, so I no longer do them after that. The finish work, I enjoy and still do a bit here and there to keep myself sane.

I am not sure if I want my sons to be in this business? Its a tough gig, and getting more difficult to make any serious money. Jobs are still out there and plenty, but the competition is getting fierce from all the cut throat immigrants. It always been this way, they charge labor plus materials without insurances and lic. The way things are going through the roof, it will be a tough pill to swallow in the next few years. At 120-230 an hour, there's not too much money to be made. Clients just aren't willing to pay it, where as the guy from Craigslist are asking 40 plus parts.

[look 171]

you get an elec. car, Vash?

How did it go, they get done today?

[pmax]

Steve !



Mr Crazy legs himself, wow.

https://www.nfl.com/photos/top-15-trades-in-nfl-history-0ap2000000336962#4feef89b-add8-4df8-89e1-5a8b7743c031

[pmax]

Joe !

[black73]

I disagree. Health issues usually come from the individual's own use and abuse of his body. Very often off duty. It's not the job that kills the body, it's the decisions. And genetics can play a part also.

There is skilled labor and then there is labor labor. Once a skill is acquired, the labor labor goes down, making the job easier for the older geezers. There are some grinding jobs, but the skilled craftsman will figure out how to do it without hurting himself.

As far as 401k, etc., Non unions are pretty sketchy on this but most union jobs provide a gov protected pension

Originally Posted by jyl

Issue I see with most trades is that the body gives out eventually. How many carpenters, drywallers, plumbers, auto mechanics still able to work full time in the field at 50? 60? Sure, some will have their own sub business by then, but obviously the great majority won’t. They need to be saving and investing. But AFAIK these jobs don’t tend to have 401k plans and employer matches - I could be wrong. Trade education should include financial classes.

Originally Posted by biosurfer1

Might be decent money but so many tradesmen I know look 20 years older than they are, have back problems, knee problems, joint issues, respiratory issues, and on and on. I'm sure health and safety in that industry has come a long way but it sure makes it hard to suggest that route to youngsters.

Originally Posted by Brian 162

You are correct. I worked in HVAC. I did a lot of heavy lifting delivering and removing commercial boilers and water heaters. My back, lungs and knees are fine. I breathed flux every day while soldering, plus working around asbestos and fiberglass. My old company was really good regarding health and safety.
I retired in 2015 at the age of 55. The only lingering issue I have is with my hands. I have slight pain between my thumb and forefinger. It's from holding large copper pipe and cutting in without using a pipe vice.

[Bugsinrugs]

I was still doing hard labor at 67. Torn rotator cuffs in both shoulders made me retire. On occasion I will help my old work mate ( he is 65) when he gets in a bind. Boy oh boy! The soreness is crazy!

[VINMAN]

Originally Posted by look 171

Where do I start?


I am not sure if I want my sons to be in this business? Its a tough gig, and getting more difficult to make any serious money. Jobs are still out there and plenty, but the competition is getting fierce from all the cut throat immigrants. It always been this way, they charge labor plus materials without insurances and lic. The way things are going through the roof, it will be a tough pill to swallow in the next few years. At 120-230 an hour, there's not too much money to be made. Clients just aren't willing to pay it, where as the guy from Craigslist are asking 40 plus parts.

The home improvement business is very tough right now. Iv'e been involved in it since I was a teen. Was my side gig up until 2014 when I retired. Then it became my full time thing up until the present. Used to be extremely profitable. Not so much anymore. Yeah the say the business is booming, but with the price of material, and getting way underbid by the immigrants and the craigslist crowd, it's a struggle to pull a profit. Folks want fast and cheap work. Past few big jobs weren't even worth it. ( guess that why I work two other jobs part time...)

Seriously considering hanging it up.

Originally Posted by black73

I disagree. Health issues usually come from the individual's own use and abuse of his body. Very often off duty. It's not the job that kills the body, it's the decisions. And genetics can play a part also.

Gotta agree.

While some jobs do beat you up a bit, most trades guys I know, really don't take care of them selves that well. Smoking, diets of eating crappy unhealthy foods on the run, fast foods and energy drinks. Lack of real exercise afterwards.
That crap catches up with you eventually

.

[jyl]

I guess part of the answer is that kids are in fact going into the trades - it’s just more non-white immigrant kids.

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by jyl

I guess part of the answer is that kids are in fact going into the trades - it’s just more non-white immigrant kids.

It depends.

I live in a fairly rural area and there are plenty of kids of all backgrounds in the trades.

But, big but, kids in this area grow up, in the mean, knowing how to work since they are raised on farms or in families that value having their children know how to work. Almost all the HVAC folks are as white as the soles of my feet.

I have written here before that my son had friends that absolutely loved working on my farm when they were in HS and, later, when some were in college.

Make your kids work, they want to work. Will they *****? Probably, but that is when you turn off the TV and internet, take their cars keys and phone and let them know who the f is in charge. That is what parents used to do.

Starting around 12, my Dad gave me a punch list on weekends I needed to get done on the ranch....all age appropriate and I could work in sporting events if i was playing. My sisters as well.

There was zero debate and if you tried to mommy/daddy them, complain, god help you.

I have friends who live in nice houses with lawns their teenagers didn't mow, didn't prune, move mulch, rake, sweep: get **** done.

Again, Manuel Labor isn't a Cuban Jockey. Get to work. BTW, I ask my son every few months for a day of help: There are just some things on the farm that require two men that trust each other to get accomplished. He gives me his schedule, constraints and we work it out. He is a busy lawyer. He drives up from Norfolk after work on Friday and we get it done on Saturday, bleed over into Sunday once in a while.

There are about 1000 kids a year that are true geniuses that get a pass from working...I have yet to meet one.

[Baz]