English 3 Speed Bike Questions

[afterburn 549]

Some questions-
I am doing my bro a favor,- (fixing his stuff)
Two 3 speeds here, the late 50s
One needs frame off paint, and I am not doing it - Is there a place stateside to send this to for rather professional results?
Next-
Where to get a 3-speed hub? This one is not working very well, or a whole wheel with a hub?
Or even a 5-speed wheel or hub. ( I read there is such stuff)

A Place that deals with these for parts too,- if you have a name to drop.
Thanx in advance.

[Baz]

eBay has a lot of them.....

[Baz]

Not sure but probably posting photos and more info would yield more and better feedback from the brain trust here. Lot of bike folks so probably worth the effort.

[LWJ]

Waaay back, my Mom had a sweet Raleigh. It was a steel frame, sturmy-archer three speed. Smooth and fast. Brakes were mostly absent but other than that, it was a great ride.

There are lots of places to paint frames. That shouldn’t be a challenge. Getting the decals? No idea.

The three speed hub? I suspect they are somewhat generic.

Let’s see what Herr O says. He’s a bike nut.

Cool project. Show some pics.

[look 171]

https://www.etsy.com/listing/1003640933/custom-bike-decals?gpla=1&gao=1&&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=shopping_us_c-paper_and_party_supplies-paper-stickers_labels_and_tags-bumper_stickers&utm_custom1=_k_CjwKCAiAyPyQBhB6EiwAFUuakoDC1d-1UMsBSOEkA2j9wt4mHl17MFI7iutnymL3xtGSmyQGs-z9ehoCTkcQAvD_BwE_k_&utm_content=go_1844702814_71423499562_346364769243 _pla-316808249018_c__1003640933_12768591&utm_custom2=1844702814&gclid=CjwKCAiAyPyQBhB6EiwAFUuakoDC1d-1UMsBSOEkA2j9wt4mHl17MFI7iutnymL3xtGSmyQGs-z9ehoCTkcQAvD_BwE

Check this guy out for stickers

Any body shop should be able to paint it for you but I suggest you strip or prep the frame. It can be done in a couple hours with simple automotive sand paper

[MFAFF]

If its an English bike from the 1950s the three speeder is most likely to be one of these:
https://www.sturmey-archer.com/en/products/3-speed

And as you can see a new one to suit is probably available.

Or a decent service, as at the time they were serviceable by a normal (for the 1950s) mechanic. Ball bearings etc are all still available.

In fact all of the bearings could do with a service or replacement. Quality was often lower than today and a new set of decent modern bearings brings great improvement.

All 1950s English bearings would be imperial sized and so getting replacements in the US should be straightforward.

Also think about replacing the brake pads with a modern high quality version, the rims of these older wheels are thick so wear is not often an issue, however the power of the brake is low compared to modern ones and can be improves by modern pads.

Places like:
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com
https://www.wiggle.co.uk

Can give you an idea of what is on the market with those...
Be lovely to see pics.

[look 171]

I can ask a friend about the hub. He's played with lot of them and love the Sturmy-Acher for its simplicity and durability or places to buy them if that's needed.

[LWJ]

Original? I suspect the rims were chrome finished steel. Which, doesn’t grab brakes worth a darn.

If you are going to have a modern set of wheels, consider anodized aluminum. It stops very nicely.

[LEAKYSEALS951]

Three speed hubs on english bikes- usually sturmey archer.
Pretty much bulletproof rebuildable. Often just need a cable adjustment to shift right.
I would start by replacing the shifter cable and adjusting ot properly.

The hubs are rebuildable, but when you first pull one apart, you will feel like you just popped open a new automatic transmission. Have a big bucket and clean floor to catch all the parts.

Older english raleighs have a bit of collector appeal on vintage bike forums. These bike are like having an old p-car in the bike world, but without the high value.

I would consider selling the vintage bike to a collector at a reasonable price, and just buying something new for the friend. By the time you upgrade all the stuff, you will have spent as much on a newer bike, ruined the collector value of the vintage bike, and still not have something as light/fast/functional as a new bike.

It will be a heavy frame with a lot of flex, heavy cotter cranks, heavy/poor braking steel rims, steel bars/ stem/ heavy seat/ seatpost/ and poor brakes even with al. rims.

The SA is cool, but is also mechanically inefficient compared to regular bikes and has a limited range of gears.
There are custom reproductions of vintage decals available, but research will be needed.

now 'if' you could fix the better bike by new tires and simple cleaning of the hub (perhaps the cable fixes it), then by all means go for it. If you are going to be in over $100, then think through the big picture before jumping in. It will add up.

[LEAKYSEALS951]

If a properly adjusted new cable and properly working shift lever doesn't fix it, the 3 speed also has an oil port on the hub, where you can add some new oil, and that might be all that is needed there instead of pulling it apart.

In terms of restoring it 'right' a lot of these frames also had hand painted accents, if not logos, so it's a rabbit hole. My parent's frames had this. Good luck

Edit- also be wary of the cotter style cranks. It may look as simple as removing the bolts and pulling the crank arms (to get access to relube the crank spindle), but in my experience, those things can get frozen on solid and can go south quick.

[stevej37]

My older brother had one in the late 50's. I remember him taking me on rides. I would sit cross-wise on the top tube and hang on to the handlebars.

Anxious to see some pics.

[herr_oberst]

I think what you're doing is a really great thing; This friendship must mean a lot to you and I admire what you're doing..

I'd suggest taking a look at the Sheldon Brown website. The Godfather of old bikes. https://www.sheldonbrown.com/oldbikes.html

The thing about bikes is that even though they're pretty simple, there's pitfalls if you're new to the game and new parts for old bikes can be hard to come by if you wreck something. Pay special attention to the Bottom Bracket and headset. These are two areas that require the use of special tools, and there are a lot of versions of these. French, Italian and English are all different, and English bikes don't necessarily use English threading. (French is mostly French though)
It might be well worth your while to find a bike shop that can help you out here; for a few bucks they can take these assemblies apart for you and help you reinstall them when you get all the parts cleaned and regreased.

Pay special attention when removing the cotters from crank arms. You don't want to roach the cotters, they are generally NLA and it's easy to mangle them if you're not sure how they come apart. You Tube is your friend. (Edit, so is heat.Cherry red.)

3 speed hubs just require education. Once again, there will be special thin wrenches for the bearing cones so once again finding a bike shop to do this work for you might pay in the long run. The guy that can rebuild your 3 speed hub would also be able to tell you if an internal 5 speed hub will work with your bike.

(The front hub bearings also need the thin cone wrenches to take them apart. Regular open end wrenches will not work at all)

You can strip your frame with sandpaper or just have it media blasted. I've used rattle cans and I've paid to have frames powdercoated. I know people that have taken them to automotive painters to good effect, but that can get pricey!

Ebay will be the place for reproduction decals if they're available for your bikes.

Is the paint on these bike really so bad that you can't just buff it out? I've seen automotive polishing compounds and waxes used to pretty astonishing effect on older bikes.

[MFAFF]

https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/search/?term=archer&sessionid=7daea80c46c5731b4460e6926e309d7605c2cdc9


Might be a bit too much of a deep dive... however SJS Cycles are a very good bike store and the guys know what they are talking about and respond to e-mails.

I'd suggest you take a few pictures of the bike, and details, like the hub and brakes etc.
If you can see any part numbers on them then add those.

They "should" be able to help you put together some key service items and what you can do to bring the bike back to life. As Look 171 stated you can add oil to the hub (probably) and you they should know what sort and any products to free things up if they have gummed up after years of inactivity.

I use these guys for parts on old and new bikes.

[Otter74]

Pictures would help, and also I'd just like to see them

[herr_oberst]

One other thing; if you just want to write a check and be done with it, there are plenty of folks that do bike repair as a side gig or as a way of just staying busy in retirement.
Check out Facebook Marketplace or Craigslist and see if you can't find a guy or gal in your neck of the woods that has the tools and the knowledge and is just working out of a garage or a basement...

Also, when fuel prices spike this summer, there's going to be a ton of people suddenly thinking that they could just as easily ride that bike they bought 20 years ago to work, and shops are going to be slammed doing tuneups and fixing tires and that kind of stuff. In other words, get on it if you're doing it. Good luck Afterburn. You're doing a nice deed.

[NutmegCarrera]

Original poster -
Not sure where you’re located. If feasible for you, there’s a really neat bike shop called “Yellow Jersey”. Andrew Muzi is the owner.
Shop is located not far outside of Madison, WI.
Andy has been open every day (yes, every day) since sometime around 1970.
He does paint, frame repair, and is actually quite reasonable.
He is one of the few shops that will actually repair a component - instead of just telling you to throw it out and replace.

I bet he has capability to get pretty much anything.

Used to be on State Street in Madison - a stone’s throw from the Capitol.

Good luck.

[LEAKYSEALS951]

Originally Posted by afterburn 549

well...he is 80 years old as said earlier bought it when he was 14..He will prolly just hang it on the wall, which is just fine with me.
*If Sheldon will do this,- i would rather have a receipt from him then the hobiest guy dwn the street?

*He said he would, I have to get him and you guys some pix.....give me 48 hours and I will / should have them posted.
As per USUAL, this place is the place for help for everything!

Thanx !

Sheldon Brown passed away several years ago. His site (or at least the archived info) is still up though.

[LEAKYSEALS951]

Originally Posted by afterburn 549

IDK, I just talked to a guy an hour ago.....no clue who, but can do.

Hey, just send it to a Sheldon- Any Sheldon will do!

edit- I wonder if someone has taken over his place. Wouldn't be surprised.

[herr_oberst]

Originally Posted by LEAKYSEALS951

Sheldon Brown passed away several years ago. His site (or at least the archived info) is still up though.

Yes. 'Sheldon Brown' is a brand at this point. I'm really sorry I didn't make that clear. His website was the gold standard for a long time for things bike related.

[nota]

hub is a craig's list bike parts item or whole wheel
S-A is the english standard 5 speeds are a bit better if really riding

jap brands are ok but less collectable Shimano or suntour

repaint to new likely costs more then the bike is worth
but there may be repro decals or shields if a bigger corp