Breaker(s) for Challenger Panel - What type?

hcoles · 07-18-2023, 06:46 PM

Hello Electrical Experts,
I have a Challenger Panel and need to add a double breaker 40amps for a mini-split system (240 volt).
Are there different qualities of breakers? E.g. the Home Depot breakers might be for cheap construction/etc.
How do I know that the breaker is the correct dimensions compatible with the panel.
Cutler-Hammer and Eaton seems to be a common recommendation.

Below are pictures of the panel sticker and currently working breakers for my air compressor and an unused breaker.

Thanks.

hcoles · 07-18-2023, 08:09 PM

I'm reading a bit more on Challenger.
It looks like Eaton/Cutler Hammer purchased Challenger. In 2014. So it makes sense that Eaton/CH breakers are recommended.
There were problems with the Challenger panels. Exactly what was wrong I can't find on the internet so far. There may be a way to inspect the inside of the panel.
When I put a new breaker in I'll be sure the contact force seems high enough.

1990C4S · 07-19-2023, 11:59 AM

Challenger panels have a terrible reputation. Factual or electricians urban myth? I can't tell you.

I would put in a new breaker panel.

hcoles · 07-19-2023, 05:04 PM

Yes, it seems Challenger doesn't have a good reputation. There was a recall on Challenger GFI breakers. Maybe the bad rap stems from that.

look 171 · 07-19-2023, 05:48 PM

Off the top of my head, I think it was Zinsco, Pushmatic and maybe Challanger and something else that would over heat and breakers wouldn't not trip causing it to melt. I have to look but those are the ones we do not touch. If we do its a complete replacement. No need to get involve in law suits.

dad911 · 07-19-2023, 06:21 PM

https://waypointinspection.com/issues-with-challenger-panels/

We have a challenger panel in Florida I need to get changed, we had some trouble finding a company that would insure us.

billybek · billybek's Garage

Federal Pacific/Pioneer was another manufacturer of panels and breakers that you would like to avoid.

Home Depot and other big box stores have complete panels loaded with breakers that are really not that expensive.

There is a fair amount of labour involved in the changeout. With older panels I would recommend getting rid of them before spending any money on them.

jrj3rd · 07-20-2023, 07:42 AM

Uses Eaton/Cuttler Hammer breaker style BR. Should be an easy get at HD/Lowes/Menards. Put in your new breaker for your minisplit and figure out when it is a good time to upgrade/replace panel. Breaker should be about $20. If you put in a new panel upgrade it to the Eaton/Cuttler Hammer CH style.

hcoles · 07-20-2023, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrj3rd

Uses Eaton/Cuttler Hammer breaker style BR. Should be an easy get at HD/Lowes/Menards. Put in your new breaker for your minisplit and figure out when it is a good time to upgrade/replace panel. Breaker should be about $20. If you put in a new panel upgrade it to the Eaton/Cuttler Hammer CH style.

Makes sense. I figure I can install the new CH panel but it might take time.
An electrician will cost $$$ to do it.
Not a great excuse to wait but an excuse none the less.
My Challenger panel is a sub panel. They converted my original panel to a sub panel also when we did the remodel. I don't picture that because it is 70 years old and I don't know why it hasn't caused a fire. That needs replacing also.

hcoles · 08-09-2023, 07:56 AM

If I was going to replace the panel what brand and model(s) should I consider? Square D? Are there different models to consider other than the number of slot? I think I need a 125 amp model and this is a sub panel. Are the good ones sold at Home Depot or should I go to a specialty house?

hcoles · 08-09-2023, 08:25 AM

For example should I get a load center that support QOB breakers. Then I can use QO breakers or QOB breakers.

1990C4S · 08-09-2023, 08:29 AM

Any big brand that has breakers stocked in the big box stores will be fine.

Schneider, Siemens, Eaton, Square D, etc.

If you're hiring an electrician ask him/her what brand they prefer.

And buy one spare 15Amp breaker. Or two.

dad911 · 08-09-2023, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hcoles

Makes sense. I figure I can install the new CH panel but it might take time.
An electrician will cost $$$ to do it.
Not a great excuse to wait but an excuse none the less.
My Challenger panel is a sub panel. They converted my original panel to a sub panel also when we did the remodel. I don't picture that because it is 70 years old and I don't know why it hasn't caused a fire. That needs replacing also.

It's not intuitive but breakers are sized to protect the wire. If the main panel was converted to a sub, what/where is the main? What size is the breaker for the service panel? Are there other sub panels/generator panels? How long and what size is the wire from the main to this subpanel?

As a subpanel it's much easier to swap out, as long as it is protected by a breaker that can be turned off.

hcoles · 08-09-2023, 10:06 AM

The panel I want to replace which is outside was a main and is now a subpanel. The "new" main, now near the corner of the house, has two sets of 100 amp breakers going to the two sub panels. I'm not sure what the wire size is feeding the sub panels. I should be able to turn off the subpanel as you say. Thanks for the comments/info.

hcoles · 08-09-2023, 10:09 AM

I can post more pictures....
1 - the outside panel I want to replace
2 - the main service panel with the two sets of 100 amp breakers

hcoles · 08-09-2023, 10:30 AM

I think I would want a load center that can take tandems, GFI, arc fault, etc.

MBAtarga · 08-09-2023, 12:40 PM

I'd suggest SquareD. Both panels in my house are, and I went SquareD when I built my shop. Readily available at the big box stores.

Zeke · 08-09-2023, 02:01 PM

Square D had Homeline and the commercial stuff. I haven't bought a panel in awhile so IDK what they have now.

https://www.galvinpower.org/square-d-qo-vs-homeline/

Neilk · 08-09-2023, 02:18 PM

I have had some Square D breakers pop off regularly in our newish home. The electrician blames their sensitivity and has swapped some out. So is it a bad breaker to blame or do I have some electrical issues? It seems to be the same couple of breakers.

hcoles · 08-10-2023, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeke

Square D had Homeline and the commercial stuff. I haven't bought a panel in awhile so IDK what they have now.

https://www.galvinpower.org/square-d-qo-vs-homeline/

One interesting difference between the Homeline and QO panels is the Homeline has an aluminum buss bar and the QO has copper.