Hybrids vs EVs

[sc_rufctr]

My current "daily" (W140-S420) is running/driving well but I have been thinking about my next daily.

Right now a gently used Hybrid Lexus seem like a sensible option (spending a whole lot less on gas also sounds really good). Or I may buy something like a late model Mazda 3 sedan and keep things simple. Pure EV's are generally a royal PITA & very expensive is Aus.

[Steve Carlton]

I thought you guys all drove Outbacks.

[sc_rufctr]

lol... Not all of us

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by Steve Carlton

Curious why you think so. I got 40mpg in mine after the battery ran out.

My understanding is the ICE engine in Toyota's PEH has some ability to charge the battery. I may be wrong.
All the Volt ICE can do is maintain the charge level you choose when you manually switch to gas power. I typically use the ICE when I'm on an interstate going a steady speed and save the battery for in-town driving. It would be great if the ICE could bleed off a little of the power it is generating in steady-speed driving to increase the charge level.
After driving on the battery, I find the noise and vibration of the ICE annoying. It's funny that the engine noise in the Volt is annoying, but I love the sounds my Porsches make.

[aschen]

Originally Posted by Steve Carlton

Even Hellcats need to be schooled now and then.

Wonder if there is an economy button in a hellcat to complete the circle of absurdity

[aschen]

Originally Posted by masraum

Which is impressive. I commute in my Boxster S. My commute is ~84 miles, and 99% on I10 or similar so my avg speed is usually ~72mph. I don't "try" to get good mileage, I probably hit 100mph a half a dozen times per trip (each direction, no downshifting, just accelerate in 6th). I usually average 22mpg. I think Porsche said that I could get 23mpg highway. I suspect if I worked at it, I could get 23-25mpg (drive slower, use hypermiler tactics).

Hybrids just encourage frugal driving, the menus and instruments are set up to gamify it. Still a boring car but adds a small element of entertainment. One of the biggest perks this summer has been the electric AC though. With 3 young kids I am waiting in the car a lot in pick up lines and the eternity it takes a whole family to strap in. Nice freezing ac without idling the car.

I put no effort into optimizing fuel economy in the Cayman. Hardly even pay attention to it but my indicator has always read above 20mpg not too bad for 365hp and a heavy foot.

[Norm K]

Originally Posted by chapo

New Prius finally looks good. My TDI keeps giving 36-42 mpg and its paid for.

Prius styling always turned me off, which is why we went with a Lexus CT200h: Toyota hybrid engineering in a car that looks more like a "Hot-Hatch" than it does a hybrid.

It's nine years old now and approaching 150K miles, and is not only bulletproof (knock on wood) but still delivers 45-50 mpg in the type of driving we do. Oh, and the styling has aged quite well, too, so it still looks like a fairly new car.

We still love the GX, and the War Department adores her second-gen Ridgeline, but I don't see the little Lexus going anywhere for a long while.

_

[wilnj]

Originally Posted by Norm K

Prius styling always turned me off, which is why we went with a Lexus CT200h: Toyota hybrid engineering in a car that looks more like a "Hot-Hatch" than it does a hybrid.

I remember reading that the Prius styling was modeled from a gold fish for its high volume /low drag coefficient shape.

I’ve always liked the Lexus styling too.

[gacook]

I prefer hybrids to EVs. My wife's SUV is a plug-in hybrid. She gets 40ish miles all electric, then 40-45mpg; pretty damn good for an SUV.

If we NEVER took road trips, an all electric would be fine...but we do, so it's not

[cockerpunk]

Originally Posted by gacook

If we NEVER took road trips, an all electric would be fine...but we do, so it's not

i dont really understand this point of view. everyone i know with an EV goes on road trips way more often than other people .. because its functionally free.

might take you an extra hour or two to get somewhere after a day of driving ... but who cares, its free.

[aschen]

Are superchargers free still?

It is cheaper to take a road trip in a prius than any tesla. Do the math, 56mpg on the freeway, be sure to include depreciation insurance and tire cost and maintenance. I would say include the value of your time and for frustration with in op chargers and the like but prius still wins without those bennifits.

[cockerpunk]

Originally Posted by aschen

Are superchargers free still?

It is cheaper to take a road trip in a prius than any tesla. Do the math, 56mpg on the freeway, be sure to include depreciation insurance and tire cost and maintenance. I would say include the value of your time and for frustration with in op chargers and the like but prius still wins without those bennifits.

no its not. its much cheaper to road trip in a telsa than anything gas powered. its less than 20 dollars a day, and even a prius is going to be 40-50 a day. any kind of truck/SUV is going to be well over 100 a day.

[unclebilly]

So if you have a Tesla and you fill it up at Harris Ranch, does that make it a diesel hybrid?

Asking for a friend...



https://jalopnik.com/tesla-supercharger-location-diesel-generator-report-1850804146?fbclid=IwAR2Q3QNL00P_yOrbmqAY7MOpFaY0ZE eLh8bO5XdmoVgkp-iKUimJ50w9jdw

[aschen]

Cost per mile for prius gas vs supercharger electricity is a tiny bit higher for a prius depending on a 1000 other variables of course.

everything else is substantially cheaper on a prius tires, insurance, depreciation. Occasional 30$ oil changes for the prius occasional 1500$ new screen for the tesla, we'll call a wash.

cost aside long haul Roadtripping an EV is a hug compromise over IC, it deliberately obtuse to suggest otherwise.

[cockerpunk]

Originally Posted by aschen

Cost per mile for prius gas vs supercharger electricity is a tiny bit higher for a prius depending on a 1000 other variables of course.

it not though.



i dont get it. where is the compromise? have a free road trip, elon does the driving, or get there an hour sooner and pay 100+ bucks a day for the privledge? thats a deal.

teslas make for pretty ideal road trip cars.

[Norm K]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

no its not. its much cheaper to road trip in a telsa than anything gas powered. its less than 20 dollars a day, and even a prius is going to be 40-50 a day. any kind of truck/SUV is going to be well over 100 a day.

Prius = 550+ mile range (that's over six-and-a-half hours at 80 mph!), then maybe ten minutes to fill the tank, take a leak, grab a snack and get back on the road.

Oh, and you failed to figure in the additional cost of a night in a hotel, a result of the well-recognized broken/slow/already-in-use-and-several-cars-ahead-of you-at-the charging station syndrome.

_

[Steve Carlton]

Originally Posted by aschen

Wonder if there is an economy button in a hellcat to complete the circle of absurdity

No, but there's a black key that limits the car to 500 hp. So, if you see a teenager at the wheel, it's really game on.

[aschen]

Not detailing the math for you, its all over the internet. cost per supercharger depends on area but its works out to about 10c per mile at .25c per kWh as a google indicated median. About 12c a mile for prius gas again depending. Its comparable. This thread is about Hybrids vs EVs not f150s.

So barely any cheaper energy cost than a Prius, not free. Everything else is more expensive in the tesla.

Not really commenting on compromises since this is so plainly obvious to literally almost everyone. Even my wifes super tesla fanatic friend. Model S model X for the husband and their 10yo sienna tucked in the corner of the drive for the occasional road trip

[Steve Carlton]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

My understanding is the ICE engine in Toyota's PEH has some ability to charge the battery. I may be wrong.
All the Volt ICE can do is maintain the charge level you choose when you manually switch to gas power. I typically use the ICE when I'm on an interstate going a steady speed and save the battery for in-town driving. It would be great if the ICE could bleed off a little of the power it is generating in steady-speed driving to increase the charge level.
After driving on the battery, I find the noise and vibration of the ICE annoying. It's funny that the engine noise in the Volt is annoying, but I love the sounds my Porsches make.

If you use the gas engine to charge the battery, it'll be less efficient. Volts get around 40 mpg (highway in my experience) and around 100 mpge. Still, it would have been nice to have the option to charge the battery regardless of efficiency so you'd have more quiet miles available before the next plug in. I don't think lacking this feature means "Toyota out-engineered GM," though.

[MMARSH]

Originally Posted by aschen

Are superchargers free still?

It is cheaper to take a road trip in a prius than any tesla. Do the math, 56mpg on the freeway, be sure to include depreciation insurance and tire cost and maintenance. I would say include the value of your time and for frustration with in op chargers and the like but prius still wins without those bennifits.

I have free supercharging for life on my Model S. Drove from LA to Seattle, Drove around for a week, then drove back to LA. One the way even out pulled a Z06 who wanted to play alittle. It cost me nothing. Left Sunday Morning, got to Seattle Monday afternoon. In a gas car I would've left Sunday Morning and gotten to Seattle Monday morning. Right now the average gas price for premium fuel in California is a little over 6 bucks.....I think I'll hang onto the Tesla for awhile. Oh and maintenance. In 97K, other then tires I've spent 790 dollars.

Addmittingly, my car is an earlier car, thus the free supercharging. My wife's newer model 3 charges significantly faster and has longer range, but no free supercharging.