Pleading down a speeding ticket

[KFC911]

Shaun ... march yer azz down to "wherever" ... IN PERSON and ask to speak to an Asst. DA (or magistrate?), and ask them. Do it in person .... and tell them exactly what your motive is...

You want to pay the fine, but with your clean driving record are trying to keep "points" off your driving record and the insurance "hit".

Yer welcome

Best of luck!

[rfuerst911sc]

About 1.5 years ago I got nailed for 74 in a 45 . It was a remote 2 lane road in the mountains . I was polite with the officer and he gave me the ticket . When I got home I started searching for a lawyer that specializes in speeding tickets .

Took her a few months because court system was packed . On my behalf she got it knocked down to a point on my license and pay the fine . I haven't had a ticket in over 25 years that may have helped . My insurance has not gone up . I consider myself lucky .

[javadog]

Talk to the prosecutor before the court date, preferably in person. Proffer a deal whereby you pay the fine if he agrees to amend the charges to something that won’t go on your record. Explain that you have to drive a lot for work, along with the extenuating circumstances behind the speed limit on that stretch of road. Failing that, ask him for deferred adjudication, even if you can’t find it in the code. Failing that, try the defensive driving school option.

If all else fails, hire an attorney and have him deal with it.

I haven’t had a ticket in years, but back when I used to get them on a fairly regular basis, none of them went on my record.

[CalPersFatCat]

The best man in my wedding owned a tire and auto repair chain (25 stores or so) in California and Las Vegas. He got several speeding tickets every year, usually commuting between SoCal and Las Vegas, but also many in Orange and LA counties. Once, he got a ticket NB I15 on one day and the very next day, SB on I215... from the same CHP. lol.

Anyway, His lawyer would find out the court date and on that day my buddy would fail to appear on the speeding infraction would turn to a misdemeanor warrant that day at close of court business.

The following day, the lawyer would go to court, plead guilty to the misdemeanor failure to appear, pay the fine and the speeding infraction did not show in his drivers history. It would show a dozen misd warrants as dismissed but no moving violations.

I have no idea how that may have affected his insurance but I doubt that it did, because he had a dozen pickup trucks and box trucks and I never heard him mention it.

One other thing, I don't think that it was horribly expensive to have that done. I'm pretty sure that this attorney was a traffic offense ONLY attorney. I do remember meeting him a time or two (my buddy had 8 Angels season tickets and 4 Dodgers season tickets) and the guy was not very impressive.

DL

[hcoles]

Originally Posted by Shaun @ Tru6

Here is the code

Section 17. No person operating a motor vehicle on any way shall run it at a rate of speed greater than is reasonable and proper, having regard to traffic and the use of the way and the safety of the public. Unless a way is otherwise posted in accordance with the provisions of section eighteen, it shall be prima facie evidence of a rate of speed greater than is reasonable and proper as aforesaid (1) if a motor vehicle is operated on a divided highway outside a thickly settled or business district at a rate of speed exceeding fifty miles per hour for a distance of a quarter of a mile, or (2) on any other way outside a thickly settled or business district at a rate of speed exceeding forty miles per hour for a distance of a quarter of a mile, or (3) inside a thickly settled or business district at a rate of speed exceeding thirty miles per hour for a distance of one-eighth of a mile, or (4) within a school zone which may be established by a city or town as provided in section two of chapter eighty-five at a rate of speed exceeding twenty miles per hour. Operation of a motor vehicle at a speed in excess of fifteen miles per hour within one-tenth of a mile of a vehicle used in hawking or peddling merchandise and which displays flashing amber lights shall likewise be prima facie evidence of a rate of speed greater than is reasonable and proper. If a speed limit has been duly established upon any way, in accordance with the provisions of said section, operation of a motor vehicle at a rate of speed in excess of such limit shall be prima facie evidence that such speed is greater than is reasonable and proper; but, notwithstanding such establishment of a speed limit, every person operating a motor vehicle shall decrease the speed of the same when a special hazard exists with respect to pedestrians or other traffic, or by reason of weather or highway conditions. Any person in violation of this section, while operating a motor vehicle through the parameters of a marked construction zone or construction area, at a speed which exceeds the posted limit, or at a speed that is greater than is reasonable and proper, shall be subject to a fine of 2 times the amount currently in effect for the violation issued. Except on a limited access highway, no person shall operate a school bus at a rate of speed exceeding forty miles per hour, while actually engaged in carrying school children.

I'll try to unpack this in case it helps... I thought the CA Vehicle Code was written poorly in spots....
Looks like "red" below indicates if you are over the posted limit by any amount that is evidence your speed was unreasonable. I assume the speed limit was duly established. Did you get caught by radar, pacing or visual estimate?

Section 17. No person operating a motor vehicle on any way shall run it at a rate of speed greater than is reasonable and proper, having regard to traffic and the use of the way and the safety of the public.

Unless a way is otherwise posted in accordance with the provisions of section eighteen, it shall be prima facie evidence of a rate of speed greater than is reasonable and proper as aforesaid
(1) if a motor vehicle is operated on a divided highway outside a thickly settled or business district at a rate of speed exceeding fifty miles per hour for a distance of a quarter of a mile, or

(2) on any other way outside a thickly settled or business district at a rate of speed exceeding forty miles per hour for a distance of a quarter of a mile, or

(3) inside a thickly settled or business district at a rate of speed exceeding thirty miles per hour for a distance of one-eighth of a mile, or

(4) within a school zone which may be established by a city or town as provided in section two of chapter eighty-five at a rate of speed exceeding twenty miles per hour.

Operation of a motor vehicle at a speed in excess of fifteen miles per hour within one-tenth of a mile of a vehicle used in hawking or peddling merchandise and which displays flashing amber lights shall likewise be prima facie evidence of a rate of speed greater than is reasonable and proper.

If a speed limit has been duly established upon any way, in accordance with the provisions of said section, operation of a motor vehicle at a rate of speed in excess of such limit shall be prima facie evidence that such speed is greater than is reasonable and proper;

.... but, notwithstanding such establishment of a speed limit, every person operating a motor vehicle shall decrease the speed of the same when a special hazard exists with respect to pedestrians or other traffic, or by reason of weather or highway conditions.

Any person in violation of this section, while operating a motor vehicle through the parameters of a marked construction zone or construction area, at a speed which exceeds the posted limit, or at a speed that is greater than is reasonable and proper, shall be subject to a fine of 2 times the amount currently in effect for the violation issued. Except on a limited access highway, no person shall operate a school bus at a rate of speed exceeding forty miles per hour, while actually engaged in carrying school children.

[wilnj]

Just went through this in July with my middle daughter. 40 in a 25. She was in a commercial zone and assumed she was ok at 40 in a 35 but it was very clearly signed a 25.

I called the DA right away, he said to set a court date and call him again the week before to remind him. Since my daughter is 17, he was very clear that as a probationary driver, he could not make the ticket a non-moving violation.

Zoom court date came and was a s***show. I thought we would each have our own assigned time but instead it was typical municipal court with 25 people logged into zoom. Attorneys, defendants, judge, clerk, etc.

We waited our turn, I reminded the DA again of our conversation. He made a recommendation to the judge as we had discussed and it was accepted. Paid the fine online and that was it.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by KC911

That's not even necessary most of the time .... but of course they will have an inside track. It's the $ystem ...

Here in Houston, there was an attorney that would handle tickets. I think it was $60. I used them once. I went in and this guy showed up in the courtroom before the judge showed up and said "who here is using Kubosh?" About 15-20 folks raised their hands. He spoke to all of us and then left the room. He came back a bit later and came and went a few times. It turned out that he was also working one of the other court rooms at the same time. In the court room that I was in, all but one of the tickets was dismissed (no cost at all, just gone). In that one case, the guy had been a dick to the cop, and the cop made a note of it. Since he'd been a dick, the cop wouldn't play ball.

[greglepore]

Its jurisdiction dependent. Some places, the cop is the prosecutor, other places have an ADA that does it; I'd call the court and find out who prosecutes traffic tickets and call them in advance...explain that you haven't had a ticket in years-they can check-and that you just want to preserve your insurance rates, and the schtick about the speed limit change and you were unaware but will be more prudent. You might still have to do the zoom, but it helps to have the deal in advance.

[Steve Carlton]

Maybe try calling the court to see if traffic school is an option.

[brp914]

When you get the letter in the mail you can pay online or request an extension. Request an extension of arraignment (= 2 or 3 mo). The day before your arraignment go online and request night court, if possible (= 1 or 2 mo). Show up to your arraignment and plead not guilty and request hearing before judge. Waive your right to speedy trial (= 2 or 3 mo). Go online and request a delay of your trial date. On the hearing date, which by now is over a year later, look at the gathering of people outside court. See your officer? In my last case, I wasn't sure. I walked up to a cop and asked if he was Officer so-and-so. "Nope". Phew! He asked if I was so-and-so. "Nope". You listen intently as roll is called once in court. Talk about high anxiety. If he answers "Here!" your goose is cooked and you plead guilty when your case is called, otherwise home free. If guilty you can still request traffic school. It's worked 2/3 times.

I'm sure we're responsible adults not doing 100 in a school zone. But here in CA, the state tacks on a nonsense 40% fee of their own. I really hate the games, but a simple speeding ticket can be several hundred $ plus a point on you record and higher insurance.

[paulitr6]

Pay the money for a lawyer. in my area 250.00 will usually get it dropped or deferred.
Then if you keep your nose clean for a year it goes away. It can cost much more if your ins. goes up. Even if its a small amount. But over 7 years until it drops off your driving record it works out to way more than the fee for a lawyer.

[brp914]

Originally Posted by masraum

Here in Houston, there was an attorney that would handle tickets. I think it was $60. I used them once. I went in and this guy showed up in the courtroom before the judge showed up and said "who here is using Kubosh?" About 15-20 folks raised their hands. He spoke to all of us and then left the room. He came back a bit later and came and went a few times. It turned out that he was also working one of the other court rooms at the same time. In the court room that I was in, all but one of the tickets was dismissed (no cost at all, just gone). In that one case, the guy had been a dick to the cop, and the cop made a note of it. Since he'd been a dick, the cop wouldn't play ball.

Gosh, gotta wonder if that atty and judge would be seen out on the golf course.

[p911dad]

I had one of these a few years ago, 51 in a 40MPH zone. Radar motorcycle town cop. A buddy of mine, a Detective in a neighboring county, called this a "dick ticket", cop just making his quota. Went online, found a $99. traffic ticket attorney in Charlotte. Talked on the phone, he wanted to know if I had a clean record which I guess is important to plea down a ticket.
I gave the asst. a CC# and he contacted the ADA in the County Court. Got it reduced to a "disobeying a traffic device" (speed limit sign) and paid a $100. + court costs fine to the court. Got a 1 point mark on my license instead of 4 points. I saved me a trip into the city to appear in a courtroom in the center of Charlotte (major hassle).

[ramonesfreak]

The way I’ve handled these is to call the prosecutor (hopefully there is one) and if your record is good, offer to plead guilty to a charge that doesn’t add points. This has always worked for me. You want to call ahead of time to work this out because in doing that, you will be saving the cop some work. Hopefully you were the cops only ticket that day but even if he has 5 tickets on, you’ll still save the cop, and the judge, and the prosecutor some time and they all like that. If the prosecutor says no, ask he/she for an adjournment to allow you an opportunity to retain counsel, then see what happens and proceed accordingly. Good luck.

[Rick Lee]

In AZ a speed limit is considered moot if there has not been a road study done on that road. Then "reasonable and prudent" prevail and that's up to 65mph and not 20 over the posted limit, conditions permitting. Almost no one knows this and there are a ton of main, heavily traveled roads where they don't bother with road studies. I got a ticket on one (63 in a 45, so under 20 over) and, in my research prior to the court date, got an email from the city dept. of trans. that they had, indeed, not done a road study where I was stopped. I was all ready to argue this in court, but the cop didn't show and I was dismissed.

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by brp914

When you get the letter in the mail you can pay online or request an extension. Request an extension of arraignment (= 2 or 3 mo). The day before your arraignment go online and request night court, if possible (= 1 or 2 mo). Show up to your arraignment and plead not guilty and request hearing before judge. Waive your right to speedy trial (= 2 or 3 mo). On the hearing date, which by now is over a year later, look at the gathering of people outside court. See your officer? In my last case, I wasn't sure. I walked up to a cop and asked if he was Officer so-and-so. "Nope". Phew! He asked if I was so-and-so. "Nope". You listen intently as roll is called once in court. Talk about high anxiety. If he answers "Here!" your goose is cooked and you plead guilty when your case is called, otherwise home free. It's worked 2/3 times.

I'm sure we're responsible adults not doing 100 in a school zone. But here in CA, the state tacks on a nonsense 40% fee of their own. I really hate the games, but a simple speeding ticket can be several hundred $ plus a point on you record and higher insurance.

And now the governor has signed off on speed cameras. Cops can't be doing much traffic stops with all the crime that is happening. Enter the camera to do the cop's work. It's gonna be mayhem. I hope the courts have funding to quadruple their staff. Otherwise It might get real easy to work this system.

I predict that speeding tickets will go up 5000% in the number of citations. If I drive the speed limit anywhere, streets to freeway, I'm holding up cars.

Meanwhile, the Long Beach City Council just voted to reduce the speed limits on 1/3rd of our streets. I think the timing of all of this is really gonna hit the courts hard.

I'm so happy to be 78 and getting set to just die. I want no part in what's going on. If I don't die I will definitely not be owning any cars within 2 years. People who consider a car to be some sort of freedom are going to be sorely disappointed and SOL real soon.

[sc_rufctr]

I may not be understanding something... Why not just pay the $145 ticket and move on?

[ramonesfreak]

Get a radar detector. Mine detects speed cameras. Been using radar detectors since 88 and have never gotten a ticket. Use Waze too. Of course without an expensive laser jammer you’re still vulnerable but there is no reason to fear speed cams. Geez Paul and now you always glad you’ll be dead soon doesn’t give me hope…my goal is to make it to 100…just me a Kieth Richard’s hanging buy the pool

Originally Posted by Zeke

And now the governor has signed off on speed cameras. Cops can't be doing much traffic stops with all the crime that is happening. Enter the camera to do the cop's work. It's gonna be mayhem. I hope the courts have funding to quadruple their staff. Otherwise It might get real easy to work this system.

I predict that speeding tickets will go up 5000% in the number of citations. If I drive the speed limit anywhere, streets to freeway, I'm holding up cars.

Meanwhile, the Long Beach City Council just voted to reduce the speed limits on 1/3rd of our streets. I think the timing of all of this is really gonna hit the courts hard.

I'm so happy to be 78 and getting set to just die. I want no part in what's going on. If I don't die I will definitely not be owning any cars within 2 years. People who consider a car to be some sort of freedom are going to be sorely disappointed and SOL real soon.

[ramonesfreak]

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr

I may not be understanding something... Why not just pay the $145 ticket and move on?

Because here, in most if not all states certain violations add points to your license which increases your insurance and if you get enough points, can lose the license all together. It’s always best to fight them so you can go get more tickets :-)

[Jeff Higgins]

Lots of advice being given here, of course, but none of it seems to apply to your particular jurisdiction. All states are different, that much has already been mentioned. In light of that, I think it might be important to get to know and understand the "landscape" in your particular jurisdiction.

About the only way to do that is to consult some traffic attorneys practicing in your jurisdiction. Many will provide free consultations, no obligation. From these consultations you should be able to glean what, if any, chance you may have in court, prior to court with the DA, or any other options.

Here in Washington, for example, you would be left with the impression that you, as an individual representing yourself, have essentially no chance whatsoever of prevailing. Not in any sort of a pre-trial bargain with the DA, and certainly not in court. You would be left with the impression that our system, in this state, is so horribly corrupt and revenue driven that your only chance will be to hire a lawyer. And you would be right.

I recently did just that. I got a b.s. ticket much like yours, except mine was 20 miles from the nearest town or, for that matter, intersection, out on a very lonely country road. 10:00 am on a weekday. Literally not another soul went by in the fifteen minutes it took for the officer to write me. Not a one. Not a structure in sight. Nothing but barbed wire and cows. Wrote me for 51 in a 35. Hell, I periodically follow the school bus on that road at 60 mph. Just no reason for it to be marked at 35 mph, other than to collect revenue.

One would think one could "reasonably" argue such a thing in court. Not a chance. My traffic attorney will not even attempt that approach. The only thing she does is look for some manner in which the officer failed to "cross all of their 't's' or dot all of their 'i's'". That is her only hope - paperwork or procedural errors, and she makes that very clear. Arguing the actual merits of the case is fruitless. Never win. Fortunately, the paperwork is so onerous that she can always find something. I cannot. I don't even know where to look. She does, so it's worth it to me to pay her to do so.

Hopefully your state is not nearly as corrupt as mine when it comes to traffic law and enforcement. If it is, however, your only chance will be someone who knows the game. You should find out if that's the case.