maybe time for an air pistol?

[look 171]

Old CO2 stuck in my old air gun with rat trapped in front of me had me thinking about buying a more reliable air pistol. For those of you that didn't read my post, fking rat got away and still in the house and my wife is going nuts . A simple pump gun may be the way to go but I like to muti pellets instead of single shot this time for a better kill rate. No long guns. Suggestions, please?

[look 171]

I have this now

[id10t]

Crossman made/makes a 8 or 10 shot revolver. Mine may or may not have accounted for squiirels and doves out to 25 yards back in my youth.

[FOG]

Don't know how close you are to MAC-1 in the greater LA area but Tim is one of the best airgunsmiths for this type airgun in the country. I suggest you at least give him a call and talk about fixing/upgrading it.

S/F, FOG

[Jeff Higgins]

Kind of a can of worms here. You can get a repeater, and some very high quality ones today, but almost none of them have the power to kill a rat. It's generally considered that about ten foot pounds of muzzle energy is about the minimum for this duty, and the repeaters generally just don't get there.

The exception are some of the pre-charged pneumatics, but they are expensive and require some support gear to make them run. They need to be charged with high pressure air. Most guys use a SCUBA tank and just get it refilled at a dive shop. Kind of a hassle just for some rat control. Hatsan makes a good one, their Velox model.

Single shots are still the way to go for reliable rat killing power. Crossman still makes a dirt cheap, reliable, powerful pump up pistol. It has the power and accuracy you need for rat killing. I'm pretty sure they are the only game in town these days. Pump guns just aren't popular anymore.

Next up would be a spring piston gun. There are a lot of cheap ones out there that just don't have the power either, but there is one really good one. Kind of spendy, but really top drawer quality. The Weihrauch HW 45 is one of my all time favorites. One of the most powerful air pistols (at least self contained ones) you can buy today. Mine is an oddball on .20 (5mm) caliber, but they make .177 and .22 as well. A real rat killer, believe me.



Another option would be an older Sheridan or Benjamin pump pistol. They are essentially the same gun, with the Sheridan in their normal .20 caliber and the Benjamin in either .177 or .22. They can be found on eBay and other such sites fairly cheap these days.





So, while somewhat limited, there are options for a "rat pistol". Not as many as there used to be, some fairly expensive examples, but at least one cheap and proven option.

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by FOG

Don't know how close you are to MAC-1 in the greater LA area but Tim is one of the best airgunsmiths for this type airgun in the country. I suggest you at least give him a call and talk about fixing/upgrading it.

S/F, FOG

Absolutely. I have two vintage Sheridan Bluestreaks Tim modified into his "steroid" guns, one new Benjamin in .22 caliber, and one of the last modern Sheridan rifles that I gave to my younger son.

All of these rifles exceed 20 ft lbs of energy. The Benjamin, shooting the 25.39 grain JSB Exact Monster, is my "big bore" back yard controller. It kills larger suburban pests with far more authority than the standard 14 grain or so .22 pellets. Way overkill for a "rat gun" at that level, but toned down with only five or six pumps and a standard weight 14 grain pellet it can do that too. The beauty of the old pump guns - variable power.

So, yeah, email Timmy Mac at MAC-1. Don't call him, if he answers at all he gets pretty irritable. He's a one man show, and if he's talking to you he's not working on guns. He'll answer your email. Last I talked to him (he called me...), he wasn't working on many pistols, but if you want it fixed (he won't be able to upgrade that pistol), it's worth asking. Oh, and I have asked him to "steroid" my old Sheridan pistol, but he does not make the parts necessary.

[jcwade]

Try a Byrna. Not an air pistol (co2) but I had an opportunity to fire one and it put dents in a stop sigh.
A rat would not stand a chance.
Kinda pricey, though.

[LWJ]

I had the pleasure of killing a rat with a Sheridan Blue Streak back about 1976. Shot clean through the neck. Pop. Rat no mo.

[Heel n Toe]

Crossbow?

[jyl]

Lasso!

[Heel n Toe]

Cairn Terrier!

The Cairn Terrier is a terrier breed originating in the Scottish Highlands and recognized as one of Scotland's earliest working dogs.

Cairn terriers originated in the Scottish Highlands and the Isle of Skye.[1] Prior to 1873, terriers in Scotland were collectively referred to as 'Scottish Terriers'.[2] In the early days of the breed's establishment, the name 'short haired Skye Terrier' was used.[3][4] After concerns raised by the Skye Terrier Club, the name 'Cairn Terrier' was given to the breed instead.[2] The name 'Cairn Terrier' comes from Cairn, where the terriers often flushed out vermin.[5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cairn_Terrier

The word “cairn” refers to a stack of stones, formed either naturally or by human hands, that is used as road markers and memorials. These are prime real estate for mice, rats, and other small vermin, and the dogs were developed to go in and flush them out.

They do not give up. There is a story of a working Cairn in Britain whose job was to help clear otters from seaside rock formations. The terrier grabbed the otter and held tight, even after the animal plunged into the sea. His owner had to dive underwater to rescue his dog and found the little terrier with his teeth still in the otter. https://www.akc.org/expert-advice/lifestyle/7-facts-cairn-terrier/

[gregpark]

Originally Posted by LWJ

I had the pleasure of killing a rat with a Sheridan Blue Streak back about 1976. Shot clean through the neck. Pop. Rat no mo.

Like this big fatty? Right through the neck with my Gamo 177.

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by LWJ

I had the pleasure of killing a rat with a Sheridan Blue Streak back about 1976. Shot clean through the neck. Pop. Rat no mo.

I've had the one in the above photo since I was ten or twelve years old (the year was 1970 or so, it was manufactured in 1963). I've lost track of how many rats it's dispatched. I found it laying in a ditch under water in a local park and brought it home. It didn't work (much to my mom's relief), but my dad said I could keep it if I could make it work. He offered to pay for the parts, and ordered a rebuild kit for me. So, yup, one of my first mechanical projects, and I did most of it myself.

Fast forward to about ten years ago, and it was getting awfully tired. The barrel had separated from the pump tube at the muzzle, it would no longer hold air, etc. I had by then acquired another example, made in 1978, and essentially "new in box". Not nearly as pretty wood, but it does have the newer rocker safety, a vast improvement.



I sent the old one off to Timmy Mac when it became no longer functional. He called me and said "no way, can't save it, it's a real POS. Looks like some kid has been working on it. I'm sending it back". So I replied "well, it's my POS, and I was that kid some 45 years ago" and told him the whole story. So he said "that's fantastic, I'll get right on it. I don't care what it takes". He repaired it, upgraded it to his "steroid" build, and I've been killing rats with it again ever since. He really is a great guy. Oh, and he eventually did the new one as well. Very worthwhile mods, even if you will never use the full power.

[Ayles]

Jeff, is this the crossman you are talking about?

Found this one cleaning out my dads garage:

[Jeff Higgins]

Yup, that's the one. It's been manufactured for probably as long as either one of us has been around. Classic design, solid, reliable, and very inexpensive. The older ones that still had wood grips and pump arms are really cool.

[Racerbvd]

Who else has, had one of these??

[look 171]

Originally Posted by Ayles

Jeff, is this the crossman you are talking about?

Found this one cleaning out my dads garage:

Is that a pump version of mine which is driven by Co2? You guys are losing me on some of the gun terminologies like muzzle energy and have no idea what 10 lbs is on that. Only way I under it is FPS and that's it. I am not sure if i want to spend a lot of money to have the air gun guru do his magic on my Crossman? He's 1/2 hour away at Long Beach. I wonder version is more poreful compare to my old Co2 gun?

[id10t]

Originally Posted by Racerbvd

Who else has, had one of these??

And screwed it up by trying to make the springs more powerful.....

[Ayles]

Originally Posted by look 171

Is that a pump version of mine which is driven by Co2? You guys are losing me on some of the gun terminologies like muzzle energy and have no idea what 10 lbs is on that. Only way I under it is FPS and that's it. I am not sure if i want to spend a lot of money to have the air gun guru do his magic on my Crossman? He's 1/2 hour away at Long Beach. I wonder version is more poreful compare to my old Co2 gun?

Not sure! Jeff is the expert on this stuff.

[id10t]

Originally Posted by look 171

Is that a pump version of mine which is driven by Co2? You guys are losing me on some of the gun terminologies like muzzle energy and have no idea what 10 lbs is on that. Only way I under it is FPS and that's it. I am not sure if i want to spend a lot of money to have the air gun guru do his magic on my Crossman? He's 1/2 hour away at Long Beach. I wonder version is more poreful compare to my old Co2 gun?

muzzle energy is just mass*velocity*velocity

Except when talking guns mass is usually in grains (7000 per pound) and you are working in feet per second, and the NRG value is expressed in ft-lbs so there is a bit of unit conversion math involved before you can run the three multiplication operations.

My pump crossman pistol certainly outperformed my crossman CO2 pistol *unless* it was a hot day and the CO2 cartridge was fresh (first 20 or so shots)

If you want to play with the big boys you can get into larger calibers and PCP (precompressed, so you are feeding w/ scuba tank or similar or a compressor capable of putting out 2k+ psi). Saw one guy at the range, the price he quoted on his rig was "new small car or maybe a machine gun" but then it would monitor gas pressure, allowed dial-a-velocity, auto-adjusted scope drop based on bullet weight/BC and velocity, was suppressed, etc. Shooting much smaller 50 yard groups than I was with my 10/22 build. His was 22 caliber since he only did target stuff....