"All that serves labor serves the nation. All that harms labor is treason. If a man tells you he loves America yet hates labor, he is a liar. If a men tells you he trusts America yet fears labor, he is a fool. There is no America without labor, and to fleece the one is to rob the other."

I think Sup that you need to take the conditions of general labor at the time that statement was made into consideration. This was during a time when those with money could literally own people without it. People were desperate and many businessmen took advantage (child labor, 80 hour weeks, low pay, etc..) That simply is not the case any longer. Opportunities abound and the worker has much more inherent power now.

I truely doubt that he meant for things to end up the way they are now.

and lendaddy - that is what I meant about us may as well being on Mars and comparing it Ben's time.

Labor unions better get on the wagon or all the jobs of their members will be shifted overseas. They've been jumping up and down about H1B visa's and the amount of visa's approved - well guess what - no need for the visa's if companies just shift the work over seas - and no tax base for the US for earnings...

unfortunatly ( or maybe fortunatly depending how you look at it )I have no memory of the actual hit but... everyone else that was there does and according to them, the car struck the hill side became airborn landing in the position as seen in the original pictures. according to them the car did not slide along the hill side then come to a rest. as for the speed since I never hit the breaks and the cars behind me were going between 45 to 50 and we were on a down hill slope it's easy to say this was a 45 to 50 MPH hit ( believe me I wish it wasn't )

32 years ago I was involved in a rather strange accident I'm not going to go into all the details but... I watched a honda strike the back end of a 62 chevy impala at approximately 45 to 50 MPH on a down hill slope and after striking, the honda bounced backwards like a kids toy and then ran of into a school yard fence
I was the first one to reach the honda after it hit the fence, the engine was still running and both the driver and passinger were unconscious, later I found out they were both OK just really badly banded-up. from talking to the guys about my accident I think a simular thing happend.

The move to OT was well timed. When the political content outweighed the Porsche content, it was moved.

Here are a few morehttp://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1062644170.jpg

zzzhttp://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1062644240.jpg http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1062644250.jpg

Now that is a scary picture.

Don't worry Sam, it's a Targa. ;)

Hitting a deformable barrier - another car - is not nearly as damaging as hitting a rigid barrier - a wall, or mountain.

He estimated the speed to be less than 45MPH by analyzing the structural deformation of the vehicle. Only an estimate, based on his considerable experience. Like all estimates, it is only that, an estimate. The estimated speed of an impact is often over estimated by those involved in a crash. Often, not always. The angle offset of the crash also makes it difficult to determine the actual speed of impact. You can take his opinion or not.

The bottom line is that this was a major crash event, the Porsche structure performed very well, as designed. It's a good thing it did and more importantly that you wore your seat belt, of it would have been much worse.