take the class..I will not waste that much of my time.....you obviously have more to learn than one could teach on a BBS if you think credit card debt is part of the Federal Deficit.

1. But of course you won't "waste your time." Because you can't back up the claim that taking a cruise and putting it on the national deficit would reduce said deficit.

2. The whole conversatoin started with the dollar declining in value and how the national debt has a play in it.

Then, of course, you and your conservative twisting tactics attempts to claim that I think credit card debt is part of the federal deficit.

You guys are so predictible.

No I don't. Nor can I have a cell phone or do personal things on my computer. Guess that is the price one pays....

Your own door? Good for you! Sounds like you have done well under the Republican administration.

1. Ok, but only briefly:

Clearly it would not increase the debt as you implied.

If you booked it through an American travel firm, or went on an US chartered cruiseline, or purchased airfare to the port....You would create taxable income for each of those entities which (taxes collected) would result in lowering the federal deficit.

2. Yes...you are wrong about that too.

Actually do well because of a couple things: 1. college. 2. hard worker.

Then, under the Bush administration, I was laid off for the first time in my life. Was lucky to find a job...there was one in all of chicago at that time in my field....I worked hard and studied tons of interview questions since I had only one chance.

So, sorry this administration didn't do anything for me.

What was you major?

Bush admin caused you to get laid off? When was that? Did you work for the federal government before?

You said that I've done well under the Bush administration. I said I got laid off for the first time under the Bush administration.

I'm simply telling you I did more poorly under the Bush administration than ever before in my career, so this statement "you did well under the Bush administration" is simply NOT TRUE.

What new crap are you going to make up on my statements now flintstone??????

1. So If I add a million dollars to the deficit, there will be enough taxable income in these purchases to not raise the debt, and in fact may lower it?

2. If you're going to declare I'm "wrong", then you really should have enough decency to tell me why you believe I'm "wrong." Tell me how the ballooning deficit is not affecting the value of the dollar.

The implication was clearly the Bush admin had something to do with it. I was only wondering how/why? What line of work (with their own door) did worse in Chicago due to Bush policy? Lots of new graduates in the class of 2003 got their first during the Bush administration too. Is that because of his policy or simply coincidence (their grad date)?

As far as you doing well under the current administration:

You sure read a hell of a lot of crap into my words. I honestly don't blame Bush for the downturn in the economy in 2002, but I can't honestly say I was doing well under this administration either.

How are you going to twist this statement?

Don't think the gov't really cares if YOU run up $1Mil of YOUR OWN debt -. Have the credit rating for it? They don't care. What they want is to TAX you for it. Gues where the tax goes? Paying for things the GOVT. ran up.

I think there is a bit of a misunderstanding between personal debt and defecit.

rjp

1. If you are a million dollars in debt....yes...you have helped lower the national debt via taxes paid by those who supplied the million doallars worth of services. Your personal debt has no effect in increasing the national deficit.

2. You have changed the question. Your original premise was that the decreasing value of the dollar was increasing the deficit.

There is a lot of crap in your words.

Um actually you twist my words. There is no crap in my words...just the crap you make up in your head!

I think there is misunderstanding on your part. My original statement was this: charge for a cruise for everyone and send the bill to the government to pay...to add to it's deficit. Not using my own credit card.....

Now we all know this will never happen. However what I posted is in fact how it works. Trust me. ;)

rjp

THERE YOU GO AGAIN! Twisting, changing what was said!

1. The bill for this trip is to be sent to the government to add to the deficit, since it doesn't matter anyway. I'm not putting it on my credit card. I'm sending it to be added to the deficit. It doesn't matter....we can run up the national deficit as much as we want with no reprocussions, right?

*****
10-24-2004 05:20 PM
Ok you know what, I give up....go ahead, endorse high deficit...it's awesome, a beautiful thing....will not affect anything...we can go on like this forever!

Yea...party's on me. The deficit means nothing! Wanna take a cruise with me? Everyone...come along! We'll just add it to the deficit since it doesn't matter.

*****


2. The original premise was the increasing deficit plays a part in decreasing the value of dollar.

*****
10-24-2004 02:01 AM
You do realize this type of fiscal politics is very damaging in the way of the value of the dollar/inflation, etc...right?
*****

You're out of control.

http://www.cnn.com/2003/BUSINESS/12/01/us.boeing/index.html

Maybe you do have a way of getting Uncle Sam to pay for my cruise? You're in Chicago right? Your name isn't Darleen by chance?

Only way you make sense.

You guys are incredible. It was a smartass remark.

Get a life!

As far as the economy goes, private debt is just as critical as the federal debt. There are only so many pockets out where that loan money can come from and both private and public debts are fighting for it.

I guess in fints super duper financial education they forgot to bring that up. :rolleyes:

I can only respond to what you actually post:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by cool_chick
The massive U.S. Federal deficit, the equally massive U.S. trade deficit, and attempts by the government to stem the flow of manufacturing jobs to low cost economies all conspire toward even lower value for the U.S. dollar.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

And you get THIS from my post:

Your original premise was that the decreasing value of the dollar was increasing the deficit.

LMAO

You're silly.

It was not germane to the discussion....clearly a shortage in money for loan would increase interest rates...not cause them to be at record lows.

Oh...you have an MBA too? I'll match my education in economics with your's anytime.

You people almost had it....but again you miss the forest for the trees of partisan politics....go back to the charts posted and take a look at WHEN all the debt of the USA began to pile up....1975. The USA is borrowing more and more to stay afloat....the tax laws promote SPENDING instead of saving and have done so since Kennedys Administration...funny but it took only 10 years for the USA to go thorugh it's savings and for the debt to start piling up...

Another point that is missed how much of that debt is on RE specfically Home Mortgages?

I think America is trying to live a life style we can't afford due to increased competition in the world. That the engine of economic activity is now based on the US consumer SPENDING and going into debt...This is a vicious circle....We keep spending and borrowing and the people we owe can't cut us off because they would be outa work, becausse they make the stuff we buy...

One thing can be certain though the party will come to an end sooner or later...

I guess I needed to post more of what you said to view it in context:

quote:

If I am mistaken regarding the point you were making...I apologize.

However; if you are saying that a large deficit tends to decrease the value of the dollar...I can buy that. But then, what is your complaint regarding a weak dollar? A weak dollar is a good thing when trying to keep jobs from going overseas.

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/7...selhoffrj8.gif

This is a test............

I agree with Tabs also....and everything you posted except #1 and #2.

This is not a Partisan issue but a Systemic one...that transcends both political parties....

Tax laws need to changed to promote savings and investing but the other edge of the sword is ..that if we cut spending the engine of economic growth slows....Both political parties don't want to deal with the issue, because there is no easy answer that doesn't involve pain...Americans are living a lifestyle WAY beyond their means....we're the best and we deserve it....instant gratification....this wasn't the NORM 50 years ago...the meantality then was if you can't pay for it with cash you don't buy it...With the rise of Credit Cards in the 1960's and 1970's we found we can have it today and pay for it later....which is fine if your wages are on the rise...however with the increased competition in the world the reverse is true our wages are decling..coming more into balance with the rest of the worlds...we are overpaid in comparison..so is it any wonder a company will take it's business to a place that that offers it a better bottom line....it only makes good business sense....

Another point which I am only going to allude to and that is Globalization...or the decline of the Nation State

Secondly here is the state that American eductaion is in with regards to staying competive in the world.. Andy Grove the CEO and Chairman of Intel thinks that the USA is going to lose it technological edge with 10 years to CHina, India etc simply because so many more of their students are taking Science and math courses than Americans who seem to feel that they don't have to work hard anymore because America has made it the land of mild and honey.....sorry charlie...but it's only a matter of time when you wake up and find yourself living in a trailer park watching the Ball game on TV while drinking a beer, and collecting your welfare check while all the jobs have gone yonder...

I have to agree with you there. I also feel that what really needs to be done is a revamping of spending in government. I think too much money is wasted. If our government was held responsible for it's spending, we would have all the services covered, taxes would be dropped, and the deficit would greatly decrease.

That's why I liked Perot.

Ok ....thats understandable....NOw I think again the problem is systemic...based on a faulty belief...that the well of money is bottomless and both political parties can drink at the trough of excess...we in the USA have gotten used to having all these services because we can afford it...instead of looking around and saying hey maybe we can't afford to take every child with us...we can't afford to help every last soul on the planet...WE HAVE LIMITATIONS...and have to choose wisely...but thell that to a Politican...none of them want to tell you the truth that there are HARD choichs to be made...they owuld rather lie to you to get reelected that everybody can have everything....well the poor planet is telling you we are allredy running on empty and not nearly everybody has theirs yet...

This is true...it also tends to reduce the trade deficit, but fears are as such:

- Foreign nations we rely on to finance the U.S. budget deficit less apt to buy Treasury securities. The reason: a falling dollar reduces their returns when they translate their gains back to their home currency, so they might demand a higher premium to compensate them for the currency risk, which would result in higher U.S. interest rates.

- making exports to the U.S. more expensive and thus increasing the price U.S. consumers must pay for those goods, a weakening dollar can lead to higher inflation.

- More expensive exports from euro-zone countries may hurt foreign businesses that export products to the United States, thus threatening the fledgling economic recoveries in various European countries and Japan. Ultimately, stronger economies in Europe and Japan help the United States because a good number of American companies depend on those nations to buy their products and services.


summary: higher interest rates, higher inflation, Carter days.

So your saying that we are in a world of hurt here? The USA has always been a safe haven for capital in the world...a stable economy and political system...there can't be too much said for transparency in business and government when it come to financial dealings...if either one of those things I outlined have chnaged then foreign capital will be at the least hesitant to cmoe to our shores....

Further the US Dollar acts as the Foreign Reserve ZCurrency for the world....and we do manipulate the **** out of the perks we have from having that status...the world must dance to our tune even if it means jumping off the financial cliff for them...maybe not that bad but close..

I'm saying we're not heading in a very good direction......no world of hurt yet. But it can happen.

I agree....

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/7...selhoffrj8.gif

This is a test............