looking for wayne krieger

[vonsmog]

Try sliding your fingers under the VIN # by the smugglers box and see if you can feel if it has been welded in. Also pull the pass side knee pad and see if the # under the glove box matches. I have seen these welded in from other cars. If they don't match, ask for your deposit back right then and there. If not call the police and have them stop over right away for someone selling you a stolen car. Let him worry about it not being hot.

[john walker's workshop]

Negative/Neutral Feedback received by porsche-aircooled-engines

[scottbombedout]

Originally Posted by john walker's workshop

Negative/Neutral Feedback received by porsche-aircooled-engines

Reading that feedback at first I just thought wowww. But as it went on it became really sad with all those people scammed.

Surely this guy will be found face down in a ditch one day?

[TRE Cup]

Try sliding your fingers under the VIN # by the smugglers box and see if you can feel if it has been welded in. Also pull the pass side knee pad and see if the # under the glove box matches. I have seen these welded in from other cars. If they don't match, ask for your deposit back right then and there. If not call the police and have them stop over right away for someone selling you a stolen car. Let him worry about it not being hot.

The first sentence is correct advice. The second is NOT !

The factory assigns a production assembly number to the chassis. That number is stamped below the radio , on the metal dash frame. After that the chassis is assigned its vehicle identification number according to the production order.
They never will the same. The factory has records of the two numbers, along with engine and transmission serial numbers.
It is a very good idea to check that the assembly number area has not been tampered with, and removing the kneepad is a good way to start checking on this.

General comments: It takes time to receive the information from Porsche, regarding numbers on their cars. AT BEST; if you have a friendly contact in the dealer system they can only confirm or deny that the numbers match the chassis. Why don't dealers get COA on their cars ahead of time? LOTS of reasons, and i suspect mainly length of time to receive it, some cost, and the fact that these cars are not registered in their name. They are just selling and not hanging on to their product.

Buyers should ALWAYS spend resources to get a car checked out. Reputable dealers/ sellers will welcome dealing with experienced inspectors, independent, or dealerships. If they refuse, then time to walk away

[G60SuperCharger]

Originally Posted by TRE Cup

[U]Try sliding your fingers under the VIN # by the smugglers box and see if you can feel if it has been welded in. Also pull the pass side knee pad and see if the # under the glove box matches.

Actually, this is true for '65-68 911s and 912...the numbers will match. Starting in 1969 (including this car), they will NOT match and the kneepad number is just the production number.

Run far away from sellers like this. That deposit you lost (I would try to recover it through Paypal) is a small price to pay.

[TRE Cup]

g60supercharger

thank you for the correction

[sammyg2]

Originally Posted by TRE Cup

g60supercharger

thank you for the correction

LOL, all I could think of was Luke saying:

I used to bullseye womp rats in my T-16 back home. They're not much bigger than two meters.

[GWN7]

Originally Posted by SpawnyWhippet

I put a deposit on a 1969 blue 'Bruce Anderson built' 911E that Rich Krieger is selling today (Porsche 911 Coupe Mild RS Tribute | eBay), then subsequently found this thread.

He is currently operating a business called 'Air Cooled Engines' from Petaluma (ebay ID is porsche-aircooled-engines), with another premises rented at 540a Barnevalde St, San Francisco. He has been spectacularly difficult to meet to view the car, and cancelled many appointments or did not show up at all.

The business does not seem very official, with no signage, his work order sheet was on headed paper Born2nfast with that crossed out and written 'Air Cooled Engines' in pen right next to it.

I noticed during the inspection that the number on the A pillar VIN plate was missing, but thought nothing of it at the time. On closer inspection, do these VIN's seem unusual to anyone? The one stamped into the chassis by the smugglers box seems very irregular, but I have not seen that many of them.

The car is missing most of its history and paperwork, he says it is matching numbers but has not yet shown any evidence of this. My instinct tells me to run away, but I will lose my deposit, and I think I will lose my last chance of an affordable 911E?

Here's my 69 E's tag to compare. The Smugglers serial number was painted too much to help.

[SpawnyWhippet]

Thanks very much for all your very useful advise, its great to have such a community of resourceful people around who freely help each other out.

I've called Porsche to validate the numbers, then if they check out, I'll have to locate a Porsche PPI specialist in Petaluma who can go to Kriegers premises as he says his cars cannot be taken away for insurance reasons.

[onlycafe]

good luck.

[regency]

How about.......making an appointment at the local CHP station for a VIN verification? Flatbed the car there and back.

Steve

1973 911 T MFI Coupe, Aubergine

[t-tom]

Thanks very much for all your very useful advise, its great to have such a community of resourceful people around who freely help each other out.



I've called Porsche to validate the numbers, then if they check out, I'll have to locate a Porsche PPI specialist in Petaluma who can go to Kriegers premises as he says his cars cannot be taken away for insurance reasons.

His cars can't leave for insurance reasons means he does not have insurance. Might be fun to go slip and "fall" while looking at the car. Not to be mean but you seriously want this car don't you? A huge red flag for would be not letting the car go for a ppi you're going to spend 50 grand on a 44 year old car and not have a real ppi done. That does not sound like a good idea

[john walker's workshop]

look at the painted over rust holes in post 125. the whole car is going to have that issue. they were not galvanized and many have tons of rust requiring a complete teardown and tons of time and money to end up as a "repaired rust bucket", basically. better to lose the deposit than the whole investment.

[SpawnyWhippet]

Below's a copy of the email thread between me and this Rich/Wayne/Krieger/McKrager guy, just for the information of anyone else who is considering to buy a car from him. Perhaps if he spent more time preparing his car for sale and less time insulting his potential customers he would have a better reputation.

Originally Posted by Rich/Wayne/Krieger/McKrager

From: Rich Mc krager [mailto:acengines@yahoo.com]
Sent: Monday, November 18, 2013 12:05
To: Andy
Subject: Re: Vehicle condition: spawnywhippet sent a message about Porsche : 911 coupe mild RS tribute #171152072656

What a waist of time you have been and cost me lost of money. Maybe you should just go buy a new MBZ . you are not a Porsche guy for sure. But keep dreaming and have a nice day.


On Sunday, November 17, 2013 10:31 PM, Andy Dickens wrote:
Rich,

I've discussed this 911 at length with my wife, who is strongly against buying it.
The car was actually over my maximum budget and I was going to be taking money from other sources to buy it, on the grounds that I'd not be able to afford a 911 E again and this car looked like it had a good history. Now that there is no documentation from the previous owner, the car is essentially a no-history car with unusual paint. No subsequent buyer would believe me or pay more for any undocumented history that I passed on verbally.
In addition, I'm in a very unusual position - more than 10 people I have never met have contacted me to advise me not to buy from you with various stories of past transactions.

Therefore, I no longer feel comfortable buying this car for the asking price. Any deal that could still be done would have to give me room to maneuver with an professional PPI and leave me cash in the bank to deal with any contingencies.

Regards
Andy

> On Nov 16, 2013, at 9:06 AM, Rich Mc krager wrote:
>
>> Andy I just thought I would go to the car and double check the engine # and sure enough I gave you the wrong engine pix , that was from one of my other engines I have in stock , we have well over 50 porsche engines. so here is the fresh new pix of the engine in the car . 6290362 sorry for the mix up that 6301449 is for the engine I have listed on ebay .
>>

On Nov 16, 2013, at 8:58 AM, Andy Dickens wrote:

> Rich,
>
> I got a voicemail from Porsche- neither the engine nor color codes match. Pls could you forward a pic of the engine in the car, with numbers visible.
>
> Regards
> Andy

On Nov 13, 2013, at 10:01 PM, Andy Dickens wrote:
Hi Rich,

as you have been in the business for 40 years, you will certainly appreciate that a new customer who has never dealt with you has reason to be cautious about buying a $50k 40 year old sports car, especially when the only references available are not positive.
I have built, setup and run race cars and done my own road car maintenance and repairs for 20 years, so I am aware how much labor is required to replace 2 seats in a Porsche.
As I said earlier, I will await the call from Porsche COA dept. If the numbers check out, I'll get a specialist over to you to inspect the car, although I am quite surprised as a car dealer that your insurance only covers vehicles on your premises.
Andy

On 12 November 2013 17:34, Rich Mc krager wrote:
well Andy You saw the car and checked it out, as you read in my listing all inspections need to be done before making and offer or buying the car , But you are welcome to have certified inspector come and check out the car at my shop in petaluma . I will not take the car out and leave it at a shop , my insurance only covers the car at my shop and there are plenty of these guys out there. And for your information the guy tat called is from the pelican chat and he has a buddy that may want the car, if the deal falls through. Most of the **** you hear on those chat spots is bull **** anyway. I have been doing porsche over 40 years now and never pay any attention to those guys and I'm very busy building engines and cars keeps 5 guys working and making money , must be doing something right . But what ever floats your boat , the deposit is not refundable and you know that . The cost to bring the car back to Petaluma and change out the seats is about $500 at least and we have done that and then we have to change it back, so you will owe me that if this deal does not go. Let me know when the inspector is coming to petaluma 94952 .

________________________________________
From: Andy Dickens
To: Rich Mc krager
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 4:42 PM
Subject: Re: Vehicle condition: spawnywhippet sent a message about Porsche : 911 coupe mild RS tribute #171152072656

Hi Rich,
I had a surprising discussion with a friend in the Porsche club who asked me about the car I bought. When I told him about the 911E and that I was buying it from you, he advised me to google you and be very careful about the pre-purchase inspection. I have since read a few forums (356, early911 and Pelican) and discovered what he was referring to. Obviously there are 2 sides to every coin, and I do like the car, but I will need to get it properly checked on a ramp by a Porsche specialist before we finalize the deal. Do you have any problems with that?
If this causes you any issues, then no problems, you can refund my deposit and show the car to your friend. Otherwise, if the engine numbers and PPI all check out fine, then I am happy to proceed with the purchase.

regards
Andy

On 12 November 2013 14:51, Rich Mc krager wrote:
OK they must be busy , but thats cool, you will get the engine # by friday . Like I told you there is no paperwork from bruce , but maybe the old guy comes up with something . Bruce built the engine 20 years ago and coached the guy how to set the car up, there is no real cash value there. The car is just a nicely set up car and done well, its a cool car . So somebody called me and said you were not going to buy the car and he has a buddy that wants the car, so should I show it?


On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 12:25 PM, Andy Dickens wrote:
Thanks, I've called Porsche for the COA details, they said will take 3-5 business days to pull the Cardex and get back to me. Did you get anywhere with the paperwork from the old owner? I really to want to get that info, it makes a large portion of the value of the car to me. Also how can I verify that Bruce Anderson did the setup and tuning of the car?

On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 10:47 AM, Rich Mc krager wrote:
OH SORRY ABOUT THAT TRY THIS ONE . WHY DON'T YOU HAVE A STODDARD PARTS CATTALOG??


________________________________________
From: Andy Dickens
To: Rich Mc krager
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 10:07 AM
Subject: Re: Vehicle condition: spawnywhippet sent a message about Porsche : 911 coupe mild RS tribute #171152072656

I think you sent me the wrong page of the book - it appears to be for 1970 cars and does not list the correct number ranges for either the car or engine. Could you please check and resend.

On 12 November 2013 09:30, Rich Mc krager wrote:
Ok andy att are pix of the engine number and a pix of the page from the stoddard book showing the 69E vin and engine numbers . if you want to vefifi the engine is the one that came in the car , you can call Porsche COA dep 1-800- porsche and tell them you are going to buy a car and want them to verifi the engine number , they will for free. I got the original engine with the car and I did verfi it, but did not buy a COA engine is correct .

________________________________________
From: Andy Dickens
To: Rich Mc krager
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2013 9:05 AM
Subject: Re: Vehicle condition: spawnywhippet sent a message about Porsche : 911 coupe mild RS tribute #171152072656

Can you please forward pics of the engine number and the documentation showing that the numbers are matching. I need to be able to verify the car before we finalize the deal.

Thanks
Andy

On Nov 12, 2013, at 8:58 AM, Rich Mc krager wrote:
OK I will get after all the things on the list . I will want two checks from your bank , but how about some cash ? Like $10,000 if possible . I can go to the bank with you to get it. rich


________________________________________
From: Andy Dickens
To: "acengines@yahoo.com"
Sent: Monday, November 11, 2013 5:15 PM
Subject: Re: Vehicle condition: spawnywhippet sent a message about Porsche : 911 coupe mild RS tribute #171152072656

Hi Rich,
glad we finally got it together on the car.
I think in my hurry to get home, there were a couple of items we forgot to add to the work sheet:
- Lube the suspension bushes that were clunking
- Spare original door / interior side panels (non-RS) that you had lying around, (ones without the door pockets)
- Do you have a steel front bumper for this car, in case I decide to put it completely back to stock at a later date?

Can you confirm that you are OK to take a Citibank bankers check for the balance payment of $44,740. I can get this drawn up in advance and you call Citibank to verify the check, or we can go to a local Citibank together and I'll get the check cut with you there.

With regards to the blue license plate, how do I get that applied to the car instead of those white ones?
regards
Andy


On 28 October 2013 14:31, Andy Dickens wrote:
Hi Rich,
I've tried a few times to come and view the blue 911. Please get in touch when you can arrange a viewing, as I have several others on my shortlist and am waiting to pull the trigger on one.
thanks
Andy

Car is relisted here

[matt711]

Write a letter to the mayor claiming that he is preying on the LBGT community in SF, that should get some action...

[ossiblue]

That email thread is textbook for his dealings--including the final message that insults and blames you for "waisting" (sic) his time. If you lost only your deposit, consider yourself lucky, as I'm sure you do after all of this.

[genrex]

This thread is old, and the OP has not logged in for more than 8 years.

Wayne Krieger is probably in hell by now...

__

[SpawnyWhippet]

Wayne Krieger is probably in hell by now...



__

No, if you read my posts, you'll see he is alive and kicking and still selling Porsche cars and parts

[dad911]

Originally Posted by genrex

This thread is old, and the OP has not logged in for more than 8 years.

Wayne Krieger is probably in hell by now...

__

OP yes, but it came back a few days ago with a Krieger eBay sale.... which looks like the buyer lost a considerable deposit to this guy......

I guess seller thinks 5 failed sales at $10k each are better that a good sale at $50k. Maybe financially, but I couldn't sleep nights and would return a deposit if something did not check out.

Good luck Andy, hope you can get your money back...

[ossiblue]

Originally Posted by dad911

OP yes, but it came back a few days ago with a Krieger eBay sale.... which looks like the buyer lost a considerable deposit to this guy......

I guess seller thinks 5 failed sales at $10k each are better that a good sale at $50k. Maybe financially, but I couldn't sleep nights and would return a deposit if something did not check out.

Good luck Andy, hope you can get your money back...

And that (bold), is it in a nutshell. And Andy, I too wish you luck.