Now I hate APPLE, too!!! (Not just Dell)

BlueSkyJaunte · 01-19-2005, 02:01 PM

What is it with computer companies these days? Has quality gone completely down the toilet? Do they hire microcephalic idiots off the street and give them badges that say "Genius"?

My 15" Al PowerBook has this really irritating issue of intermittently failing to "wake up" when "put to sleep" (maybe 5% of "wake" attempts). The screen stays blank but caps/numlock work and all I can do is restart the machine. This only happens when using it on battery power and with WiFi active and being used. I learned to live with it because when using it in situations where I'd want to "sleep" it, I wasn't doing anything important (like graphics/video editing, taxes, etc.). If it didn't take a geologic era to reboot, it wouldn't bother me much. Well, the infamous "white spots" screen issue arose so I decided to bring it in to my friendly neighborhood Apple Store to get both problems fixed.

The AlBook came back with the screen fixed and a stick of RAM attached to a letter that said, basically, "We found this 3rd party junk RAM in your laptop, it's not our fault that the laptop doesn't wake up properly with it in your computer." Apparently when I bought the laptop from MacMall their RAM upgrade consists of some 3rd-party "unauthorized" RAM manufacturer's product.

The friendly neighborhood "Genius" said if I bought the super-special handy-dandy high-qualilty $300 Apple RAM and used it instead, I'd be back to my 768MB with no worries. "Bull*****," said I, but he promised to refund the money if the problem re-emerged with the Apple RAM. You see, I've owned 10 different laptops/desktops of my own, and administrate a lab that's had over 50 boxes cycle through it in the past 5 years. The only time I've had "bad RAM" was back before most computers came with with 640k.

Well, I can't get by with the mere 256MB in the AlBook so I bought the RAM and went home. Tried using the machine for a while at 256MB anyway, and didn't see the problem come up. Promising. Installed the RAM, and whaddaya know, same problem. Maybe the 5th time it froze when waking up.

Brought the machine back in. They sent it out. It came back a week later with a different stick of RAM in it and a note that "the problem's all fixed now!"

You can see what's coming next.

During the drive home my wife was playing with the computer trying to get the problem to come up and it happened within the first 15 tries.

Turned around and handed it back to "Mr. Genius".

They sent it out.

It came back, "Unable to reproduce problem."

Now it's at the store where they've been trying to reproduce the issue for the past two days. How? By repeatedly opening and closing the damn computer. WTF? That's not normal usage! Open the computer, DO SOMETHING WITH IT YOU MEATHEADS, then close it and try to wake it up again. Now I'm waiting to see if they can reproduce the problem, or if I have to drive in and do it for them.

Though the most recent "Genius" that I spoke to said that since it happens only when there's extra RAM in the expansion slot, it's good grounds to replace the "logic board" (sound like a catch-all fix to me).

I've been out a machine for the past month because of these retards. And I suspect I'm out $300 because I'll bet my original "awful" RAM module wasn't faulty to begin with. Grrrr........

Just needed to vent. I really like the looks of the miniMac but after this nonsense I suspect I'll never buy another computer...EVER. From ANYONE. I've had it!

cegerer · cegerer's Garage

Here's a genius who could fix it!

lendaddy · 01-19-2005, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BlueSkyJaunte
Well, the infamous "white spots" screen issue arose so I decided to bring it in to my friendly neighborhood Apple Store to get both problems fixed.

The infamous what now?

Dude, your life is in danger! You have revealed "issues" with MACs. Good god man, delete DELETE! You still have time!

island911 · 01-19-2005, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BlueSkyJaunte
.. . Well, the infamous "white spots" screen issue arose so I decided to bring it in to my friendly neighborhood Apple Store to get both problems fixed. . . .

Well, damn, if White-out can't fix the mistake . . .

id10t · 01-19-2005, 03:59 PM

I've had "not bad but not good enough or quite the right spec" ram a few times, but usually only in multiprocessor machines, and never when using the specific ram the manufacturer of the motherboard recommends (usually crucial). Only thing I can think that may be causing it I've seen happen on XP laptops, where the suspend/sleep area is actually a separate partition that must be the size of the memory, since it dumps all ram contents to disk when it sleeps. Add ram, and you suddenly have problems if it can't read back in something from ram it needed as opposed to missing something that wasn't in use, just cached from the last use. Note that I'm not sure how OS X does "sleeping" or how it manages memory that isn't being actively used (flush, cache, etc).

BlueSkyJaunte · 01-19-2005, 04:18 PM

Hmmm..... maybe.

But IMHO 4 bad memory modules in a row isn't a coincidence (the very first RAM module I got from MacMall when I bought the laptop caused kernel panics etc. at random. They overnighted a replacement. I lied about the "never" getting bad RAM), it's an indicator of another underlying issue. Especially when two of the RAM modules were direct from Apple.

id10t · 01-19-2005, 04:50 PM

Yeah, in that case I'd assume something bad in a connection somewhere... does You say you have 768mb, and the original chip is 256. I'm guessing that means you have a second slot with a 512 in it? If so, does the 512 run fine in the slot where the 256 is alone (so you have 512mb)? if it does, that would indicate something wrong with your second ram slot, which means new mobo.

BlueSkyJaunte · 01-19-2005, 05:11 PM

Didn't try taking out the 256 and putting the 512 in its place. Silly me, I expected the Apple jerks to try that--after all, that's why I paid for the "AppleCare" service, right...?

SLO-BOB · 12:19 PM

This is a test...............

BlueSkyJaunte · 01-19-2005, 08:10 PM

Sebring,

Other than this one issue (and the "white spots" issue which was repaired FOC and PDQ) the computer has been flawless.

Can't say that about the other laptops I've had. Not by a long shot.

I don't consider this a hardware or software issue...it's a service issue. Too many mo-rons passing themselves off as "techies".

JavaBrewer · JavaBrewer's Garage

Sorry to hear about your issues. Computer problems are a PITA. I for one am glad to see someone voicing dirty laundry about a Mac. I know first hand that they (fustrated Mac folks) are out there. It's just that most seem to keep quiet less risk losing their allotment of koolaid.

techweenie · techweenie's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by BlueSkyJaunte
The AlBook came back with the screen fixed and a stick of RAM attached to a letter that said, basically, "We found this 3rd party junk RAM in your laptop, it's not our fault that the laptop doesn't wake up properly with it in your computer." Apparently when I bought the laptop from MacMall their RAM upgrade consists of some 3rd-party "unauthorized" RAM manufacturer's product.

I have the same exact PowerBook and had the same exact problem: added RAM to 768MB and everything was fine. Pulled the stock 256MB stick & put in a 1GB stick and started having 'wake from sleep' problems.

Tried everything else, including reinstalling... and it was the RAM. Apple has very high standards for their RAM, and I found another third-party supplier whose RAM was good enough. Stopped the 'waking' problems altogether.

It's conceivable that something got scrambled in OSX from the faulty starts -- but that's unlikely. Sorry you're having trouble. OSX is the most bulletproof OS I've seen in 28 years of computer experience.

Aurel · Aurel's Garage

Same here,

I have an older Ti 400Mz powerbook, and since I added a 512 Mb stick to the original 128 Mb, I have had the wake-up problem. At some point, I considered upgrading the OS to 10.3, but since there is the same problem with more recent Ti Books, it seems more hardware related. Now, I am just waiting for a G5 powerbook...

Aurel

stomachmonkey · 01-20-2005, 03:46 AM

Quote:

I've been saying this all along. The stuff is *****. Nice ergonomics and great when it works (software and hardware incompatibility issues not withstanding)

What hardware and software incompatabilities are you talking about?

Example
Bought a bluetooth adaptor for one of my older ti-books, opened box, took out adaptor, stuck it in, computer says "hey look, bluetooth adaptor, were's another device that I can pair with, pointed it at my bluetooth phone and it started syncing my addresses so I took the time to look at the included manuals, 2 of them chock full of info on how to get this thing running under Windows, Oh yeah, out of the 15 or so pages there was a half a page for Apple installation, it said plug it into your computer.

2 weeks goes by and my COO buys the same adaptor, we spend 1 1/2 hours to get it to work in his Windows laptop.

Software incompatability? Please clarify, do you mean that more software is available for Windows? I've asked this before, name 1, just 1 commercially available piece of software that the average consumer could need that does not either have a Mac version or comparable alternatives.

I've been using Macs for 15 years and PC's nearly as long.

I have consistently been impressed with the quality and ease of use of my Macs and just as consistently frustrated and dissapointed with my PC's.

And again, PC's are NOT cheaper when you compare systems of comparable performance and feature sets.

Scott

SLO-BOB · 12:19 PM

This is a test...............

id10t · 01-20-2005, 05:18 AM

stomachmonkey - tell me where I can get a dual cpu mac for under $700? (thats what it cost to build my current dual amd box)

Sebring77 - of course kazaa doesn't work on a mac - its a win32 product. but limewire does, and its not spyware laden. and, it connects to the same gnutella network.

techweenie - ever play with [free|net|open]BSD?

lendaddy · 01-20-2005, 05:31 AM

I read some articles stomachmonkey posted before "showing" MACS were not more expensive. Talk about subjective mumbo jumbo. One guy was giving extra points for the MAC cause he "liked the mouse better" Uhhhhhh? Then it wnt on to say that the MAC was faster at some Adobe PS app. Well when I searched I found that Adobe themselves did their own test and concluded the PC was significantly faster. I don't have the links, but I've given enough info for a google.

Now Blue, I agree that this is the Moron factor at work. I cannot believe some of the people put out to interact with the public by some companies, it's unreal.

stomachmonkey · 01-20-2005, 05:52 AM

So I said

Quote:

I've asked this before, name 1, just 1 commercially available piece of software that the average consumer could need that does not either have a Mac version or comparable alternatives.

And you replied

Quote:

Go to Kazaa and see if you can download with your Mac. There are myriad other software not suitable for Mac. This is old news, however. If you are a software developer, who are you going to design for-Ten guys or 100 guys? It's economics, nothing more.

Kazaa is P2P, chock full of fun stuff from the Gain Network that loads your PC with so much advertising crap that it hurts.

I would not use it if it was available for the Mac, I prefer Hotline, Limewire, Bearshare or any of the other P2P services readily available and devoid of annoying "add ons"

Quote:

Beyond that, I don't like Apple's stance on music downloads. No. I don't want to pirate MP3s, but I would just like to direct copy a disc that I own. Apple tries to make that difficult.

I'm confused, what does Apples iTunes downloads have to do with copying a cd that you own? You do understand that the entertainment industry is not going to give anyone a license to sell music online without some effort on thier part to deter unauthorized duplication? Talk to Sony about that, not Apple.

Are you talking about duping a disc of music that you bought on the iTunes site? If so I have no problems doing that on my Mac, must be a Windows thing

Quote:

I know that there are people that prefer Macs. I know that Macs do certain things better than Windows computers. I also know that the average user will be far happier with something else.

I agree with the first 2 points but the last is an opinion and not really a fact.

And personal preference I have no issue with, people like what they like. If you take an honest unbiased look at PC's vs Macs you will find that neither really has any advantage over the other in any way. End of the day they give and take and for the most part they balance out.

The difference really is which one the user is more comfortable with.

So I have no issue with a statement like "I just prefer this one to the other", fine I like blue better than red, it's a preference.

I do have an issue with the reasons that people give, price, software, that just are simply not true. Imagine if I said "blue is cheaper and easier to get". You'd all be screaming BS.

Scott

stomachmonkey · 01-20-2005, 05:59 AM

Len,

I posted links so you could read them and make a decision for yourself as to the validity of the information that I was using to support my position.

If you think it's mumbo jumbo then that's fine.

But if you are going to poke sticks at it at least provide some support for your position.

id10t,

We are talking about the average cconsumer that will go buy a turnkey system, not a poweruser like yourself that can build one on their own.

Scott

SLO-BOB · 12:20 PM

This is a test...............