Where did the WMD go?

[kang]

• "He has not developed any significant capability with respect to weapons of mass destruction. He is unable to project conventional power against his neighbors. So in effect, our policies have strengthened the security of the neighbors of Iraq..." - Colin Powell, 24 February 2001

• "The sanctions, as they are called, have succeeded over the last 10 years, not in deterring him from moving in that direction, but from actually being able to move in that direction... And even though we have no doubt in our mind that the Iraqi regime is pursuing programs to develop weapons of mass destruction -- chemical, biological and nuclear -- I think the best intelligence estimates suggest that they have not been terribly successful." - Colin Powell, 15 May 2001

• "We are able to keep arms from him [Hussein]. His military forces have not been rebuilt." - Condoleezza Rice, 29 July 2001

[fintstone]

These qutoes certainly don't make your point. "Significant capability" in WMD is not required to do a great deal of harm.

[gavinlit]

No you're right fint. Just having a thought or goal of using wmd's is sufficient to do a great deal of harm. Just ask any of the dead bodies who died as a result of our invasion.

[fintstone]

they are still finding potential WMD in Iraq.

Iraqi Chemical Stash Uncovered

Post-Invasion Cache Could Have Been For Use in Weapons

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/13/AR2005081300530.html

By Ellen Knickmeyer

Washington Post Foreign Service
Sunday, August 14, 2005; Page A18

BAGHDAD, Aug. 13 -- U.S. troops raiding a warehouse in the northern city of Mosul uncovered a suspected chemical weapons factory containing 1,500 gallons of chemicals believed destined for attacks on U.S. and Iraqi forces and civilians, military officials said Saturday.

Monday's early morning raid found 11 precursor agents, "some of them quite dangerous by themselves," a military spokesman, Lt. Col. Steven A. Boylan, said in Baghdad. Combined, the chemicals would yield an agent capable of "lingering hazards" for those exposed to it, Boylan said. The likely targets would have been "coalition and Iraqi security forces, and Iraqi civilians," partly because the chemicals would be difficult to keep from spreading over a wide area, he said.

Boylan said the suspected lab was new, dating from some time after the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq in 2003. The Bush administration cited evidence that Saddam Hussein's government was manufacturing weapons of mass destruction as the main justification for the invasion. No such weapons or factories were found.

Military officials did not immediately identify either the precursors or the agent they could have produced. "We don't want to speculate on any possibilities until our analysis is complete," Col. Henry Franke, a nuclear, biological and chemical defense officer, was quoted as saying in a military statement.

Investigators still were trying to determine who had assembled the alleged lab and whether the expertise came from foreign insurgents or former members of Hussein's security apparatus, the military said.

"They're looking into it," Boylan said. "They've got to go through it -- there's a lot of stuff there." He added that there was no indication that U.S. forces would be ordered to carry chemical warfare gear, such as gas masks and chemical suits, as they did during the invasion and the months immediately afterward.

U.S. military photos of the alleged lab showed a bare concrete-walled room scattered with stacks of plastic containers, coiled tubing, hoses and a stand holding a large metal device that looked like a distillery. Black rubber boots lay among the gear.

The suspected chemical weapons lab was the biggest found so far in Iraq, Boylan said. A lab discovered last year in the insurgent stronghold of Fallujah contained a how-to book on chemical weapons and an unspecified amount of chemicals.

Chemical weapons are divided into the categories of "persistent" agents, which wreak damage for hours, such as blistering agents or the oily VX nerve agent, and "nonpersistent" ones, which dissipate quickly, such as chlorine gas or sarin nerve gas.

Iraqi forces under Hussein used chemical agents both on enemy forces in the 1980s war with Iran and on Iraqi Kurdish villagers in 1988. Traces of a variety of killing agents -- mustard gas and the nerve agents sarin, tabun and VX -- were detected by investigators after the 1988 attack.

No chemical weapons are known to have been used so far in Iraq's insurgency. Al Qaeda announced after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks on the United States that it was looking into acquiring biological, radiological and chemical weapons. The next year, CNN obtained and aired al Qaeda videotapes showing the killings of three dogs with what were believed to be nerve agents.

[stuartj]

OMG!

First a nukular thingie majig under someones sink, now this!

If thats not reason to start a war right there, I dont what is.

[gavinlit]

yeah but they've found chemicals!!! OMG - chemicals. I just hope they don't go looking in anyones bathroom or pool shed. They're even 'precursors' capable of 'lingering'. Sounds like some paricularly hot vindaloo or pizza to me

[stuartj]

Man, tell you what. Take Kamal's vindaloo from my local Indian over there and it would all be over quick smart.

But if the US Army found this Vindaloo in a shed, they'd invade Iran as well.

Good one Fint. Informative as always.

[fintstone]

Sorry if the article was a bit too technical for you boys.

[gavinlit]

yeah sorry fint. Was just too hard to wade through. But I think I caught the rough idea:
(a) The military have found a concrete room with hoses, containers and boots AND chemicals
(b) The chemicals are precursor agents which may be combined with other stuff to produce lingering effects. ***** you could say the same thing about bleach or battery acid or water for that matter. When the tests come back indicating the type of chemical and what it was ready to be used in, then you can try for some kind of justification. Best hope they don't uncover a factory anywhere with metal in it - that would have shown that Iraq was ready to bomb america.

[HardDrive]

WMD?

Keep on kicking....that horse ain't getting any deader.....

[fintstone]

"It is the person who is blind to what goes on around him that is most surprised when the same things happen to him. "
M. Thompson

[gavinlit]

"We also know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling."
Henri Poincare (1854 - 1912)

[MichiganMat]

Whats more telling about this whole situation are the collection of quotes posted recently on DailyKos from the Kosovo days. Kosovo, a truely worthwhile cause that ended "Mission Accomplished". I've posted these on a few other threads but they are worth putting up again. Just a few of the zingers:


"You can support the troops but not the president."
--Rep Tom Delay (R-TX)

"Well, I just think it's a bad idea. What's going to happen is they're going to be over there for 10, 15, maybe 20 years."
--Joe Scarborough (R-FL)

"Explain to the mothers and fathers of American servicemen that may come home in body bags why their son or daughter have to give up their life?"
--Sean Hannity, Fox News, 4/6/99

"[The] President . . . is once again releasing American military might on a foreign country with an ill-defined objective and no exit strategy. He has yet to tell the Congress how much this operation will cost. And he has not informed our nation's armed forces about how long they will be away from home. These strikes do not make for a sound foreign policy."
--Sen. Rick Santorum (R-PA)

"American foreign policy is now one huge big mystery. Simply put, the administration is trying to lead the world with a feel-good foreign policy."
--Rep Tom Delay (R-TX)

[jyl]

Gosh, the WMD justification keeps shrinking. First it was an arsenal of WMD. Then it was some WMD. Then it was any WMD at all. Now it is "potential WMD" and "precursors".

And it isn't even Saddam's WMD anymore! Did you catch this line from the article?

"[Lt Col] Boylan said the suspected lab was new, dating from some time after the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq in 2003."

Now are war apologists going to use a chemicals warehouse put together post-invasion by the insurgents (or their pool cleaners, who knows) to justify the pre-invasion falsehoods?

I look forward to hearing Cheney spin this one.

[CamB]

Originally posted by fintstone
"It is the person who is blind to what goes on around him that is most surprised when the same things happen to him. "
M. Thompson

Have to agree with what John said - quoting:

Boylan said the suspected lab was new, dating from some time after the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq in 2003.

A weapons lab, of (currently) dubious effectiveness, established after the invasion, provides virtually zero evidence of WMD.

[Victor]

Originally posted by stuartj
Man, tell you what. Take Kamal's vindaloo from my local Indian over there and it would all be over quick smart.

But if the US Army found this Vindaloo in a shed, they'd invade Iran as well.

Good one Fint. Informative as always.

Now thatI can vouch for personally. His beef korma needs rabies shots before you can eat it.

[Don 944 LA]

I saw a report once thats said...
This guy, who was rather trustworthy,
Knew this girl, not just an aquantance, but knew her
overheard, at a Starbucks
that this dudes cousin worked with a guy
that was over there, as a tourist
and talked to this one dude, who looked important
that said he overheard this guy ( that looked bad )
say that he once saw,
this other guy, tell someone
that he had a bullet

There you go ........

[fintstone]

Originally posted by jyl
Gosh, the WMD justification keeps shrinking. First it was an arsenal of WMD. Then it was some WMD. Then it was any WMD at all. Now it is "potential WMD" and "precursors".

And it isn't even Saddam's WMD anymore! Did you catch this line from the article?

"[Lt Col] Boylan said the suspected lab was new, dating from some time after the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq in 2003."

....

Brilliant observation as usual...I can't believe you fished that out of the article fineprint where the bad neocons hid it. duh...the title of the article was:

"Post-Invasion Cache Could Have Been For Use in Weapons"

[fintstone]

Originally posted by CamB
Have to agree with what John said - quoting:

Boylan said the suspected lab was new, dating from some time after the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq in 2003.

A weapons lab, of (currently) dubious effectiveness, established after the invasion, provides virtually zero evidence of WMD.

So where exactly did this WMD found in this new lab come from? In one of the Red Crescent care packages?

[stuartj]

There were WMD found in the lab, were there? Please show us where.