F1: so can we now ask, "wtf is up with Ferrari?"

nostatic · nostatic's Garage

ok...are we deep enough into the season to ask, "what is up with Ferrari?"

Just bad luck? Overconfidence in the off season? All Bridgestone's fault? Drivers not making necessary adjustments for new rules?

Jeff964 · 05-09-2005, 08:34 AM

What about BAR's violation and subsequent point deductions and race suspensions for two races.

motion · 05-09-2005, 09:07 AM

Looks like it might be the tires. Maybe it's time for Ferrari to go with the Michelins?

http://f1.racing-live.com/en/index.html?http://f1.racing-live.com/en/headlines/news/detail/050509160835.shtml

Jims5543 · 10:26 AM

Quote:

"I was thinking that it wouldn't be possible to follow Kimi because he was too quick at that start," Alonso said.

"I was also being conservative with the tyres because I knew that was a risky part of the race for them."

The team altered his tyre pressure in his first pitstop, after which Alonso was noticeably quicker. However, the Renault driver admits that by then there was no chance he could catch Raikkonen.

"The car got better after lap 25 and it was perfect by the end of the race but by that time I was too far behind and it wasn't worth pushing as I couldn't catch him."

Quote:

The World Champ's hold on the title is hanging by a thread after retiring from Sunday's race. Having struggled for pace in the early stages of the 66-lap race, Schumi seemed to be building up for one of his famed charges when he suffered punctures in successive laps.

Asked by ITV if he knew what the problem was, Schumi replied: "No, not really."

"I can guess that I may have picked up some debris from the circuit although I didn't see any, but that's the only explanation as it was so unusual."

I'm sorry, were the new rules supposed to make the races more interesting? I am finding that most of the drivers are holding back in an effort to save tires and engines.

"Well, I am 10 seconds behind the leader, may as well just pace myself because I dont want to wear out my car trying to catch him."

Sorry, its not cutting it for me. I am finding this years races to be pretty boring compared to years past. Yeah last weekend was exciting watching MS and Alonso battle it out even though the faster car was forced to follow for 10 laps because the slower car would not let it pass. I thought the new rules were made to get more passing and more excitement?

Monoco is the passless race so basically after the qualifying we will have an pretty good idea who the top 10 will be..... unless their tires fail. Which is very likely on that road course.

So one of 2 things will happen there will be horrific crashes from tire failures or everyone will be driving 75% to conserve their cars.... really exciting.

The Tire rules are stupid plain and simple and its making the races more dangerous.
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BRPORSCHE · 05-09-2005, 09:35 AM

Don't mean to hijack this thread but I really want to know what channels these races air on. I always see the highlights on ESPN but i never seem to actually find the race. I don't have any special cable just the basic stuff. Speed?

djmcmath · 05-09-2005, 10:10 AM

Stupid question: what's the "Tire Rule?" TIA

nostatic · nostatic's Garage

http://www.formula1.com/insight/rulesandregs/13/511.html

From 2005, drivers will have access to far fewer tyres and must make a single set last through both qualifying sessions and the entire race. A tyre can only be changed during this time if it is punctured or damaged.

Races are on Speed. CBS will broadcast a handful (they've done the last two, but Speed does their own broadcast the following Friday, and has much better analysts).

Superman · 05-09-2005, 10:30 AM

The tire thing is bull****. I think I'd probably slam on the brakes about 2/3 into the race, just before the pit area, and limp in with four damaged tires.

But I did notice one thing. THOSE F1 CARS ARE FAST. I think most folks would have trouble maintaining consciousness. Looks like Niagra Falls in a barrel would be a smoother, safer ride.

LeRoux Strydom · 05-09-2005, 11:49 AM

Ferrari needs to dump Bridgestone. A blind man with a white cane can see that. How many races have BS won this season? The new tyre rule rules!

LeRoux

Jims5543 · 05-09-2005, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Superman
The tire thing is bull****. I think I'd probably slam on the brakes about 2/3 into the race, just before the pit area, and limp in with four damaged tires.

But I did notice one thing. THOSE F1 CARS ARE FAST. I think most folks would have trouble maintaining consciousness. Looks like Niagra Falls in a barrel would be a smoother, safer ride.

I wonder if there are any rules against damaging your tires prior to a pit. Possibly a puncture device that puts holes in all 4 on pit row 20 feet before the stop.

I was doing some research, if you want to get somewhat close to what an F-1 car drives like go drive a 125 Shifter Kart. I know there is a member here with that name I am sure he can attest to the sheer speed and performance of them.

I am still trying to reason why I am still playing with cars and I an not racing a shifter.

Deschodt · 05-09-2005, 12:29 PM

Hell, this is the first remotely interesting season in what, 5 years or so ?

Renault kicking ass early and sorta running out of steam (a bit)...
McLaren - Finally - coming back in form
Toyota - Finally - making good use of their budget and running real well
BAR apparently on the right track again, never mind the cheating hickup

Ferrari's not doing anything wrong per se, the competition finally pulled their heads from their collective asses (Williams excepted) and challenged Ferrari.

Can't blame them for sleeping a tad at the wheel this season after winning countless championships in a row - it's hard to stay focused when you're at the top. Add to that a clear Michelin egde over bridgestone, and you finally got an interesting season.

My predictions: Ferrari to come back and mount a serious end of season challenge. Renault to run short of developments (smaller budget) but Alonso making do till the end thanks to his nice cushion of points and the small gaps in points allocations between 1st-2nd-3rd...
BMW pulling out of Williams sooner or later and purchasing SAUBER to build their own team next year....
Mark Webber actually causing a bad wreck with one of his patented "you can't pass me" moves.

Another comment, the nice thing about CBS coverage is that is makes you realize how good the SpeedTV coverage is !

BGCarrera32 · 05-09-2005, 01:11 PM

All I hope for is a nice rain about 2 laps in and a win by Minardi...

Jims5543 · 01:53 PM

If you are looking purely at wins and losses, yes, its a more interesting season. The new rules have given other drivers an opportunity to shine.

If you read the quotes I posted above you have to agree, no one wants to watch a race where the drivers are only giving 80%.

I thought racing was about going all out to the finish. Who can get there faster. Not, who can get there faster while managing blistering tires and failing engines.

These rules were supposed to lower team costs. I think the opposite has happened. 1 set of tires per weekend will not cut costs. It will increase R&D spending to find the perfect compound that will last and give good traction.

Same goes for the engines, the FIA has caused teams to spend lots of money on R&D to develop an engine that will last 2 weekends. I think it might have been cheaper to let them change the engines when they need to without penalty.

All that R&D for a V-10 to last 2 weekends and now they have to develop a V-8 to do the same and be competitive. [sarcasm]Yeah that has saved the teams millions I am sure.[/sarcasm]

Like I said before Carburetors and restrictor plates are not too far off.

Also Kudos to drivers like Fisi and MS for pushing their cars hard and running fast laps of the race. The most exciting thing about Italy was MS's ability to run laps faster than the rest of the field and up through it. Spain looked like a repeat.

When driving at 100% no one drives as well as MS in these races. When throttled back to 80% they are all about the same then its more of a game of good tires than driver ability.

kycarguy 935 · 05-09-2005, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BRPORSCHE
Don't mean to hijack this thread but I really want to know what channels these races air on. I always see the highlights on ESPN but i never seem to actually find the race. I don't have any special cable just the basic stuff. Speed?

Yes its on Speed most of the time.

johncj8989 · 05-09-2005, 02:29 PM

Combination of things. Ferrari raised the bar and the competition was slow catching up...this coupled with the fact that there are a couple hot drivers on the rise have made it pretty interesting. Stay tuned race fans... I think the end of the season is going to be the best in years.

But Bridgestone does suck.

Oh Haha · 05-09-2005, 05:52 PM

Does MS realistically have a chance at winning the championship this year? What does he have now, 1 point? At what point is it mathematically impossible?
I am a McLaren fan and it was nice to see Kimi finally win a race. He just needs to not get so excited on the podium. Jeez, I thought he was going to fall asleep. I guess that is why he is the Iceman.
My wife keeps asking me about the new rules and I have yet to explain them to her without them changing.

Az911 · 05-09-2005, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jims5543

These rules were supposed to lower team costs. I think the opposite has happened. 1 set of tires per weekend will not cut costs. It will increase R&D spending to find the perfect compound that will last and give good traction.

Same goes for the engines, the FIA has caused teams to spend lots of money on R&D to develop an engine that will last 2 weekends. I think it might have been cheaper to let them change the engines when they need to without penalty.

All that R&D for a V-10 to last 2 weekends and now they have to develop a V-8 to do the same and be competitive. [sarcasm]Yeah that has saved the teams millions I am sure.[/sarcasm]

So true, Bernie Ecclestone needs to go away he is trying to ruin F1 by limiting everything (technology, cost, etc). The top teams are always going to spend what ever it takes to find the last .0001sec

Cdnone1 · 05-09-2005, 07:35 PM

All I know is it s@cks being a JV fan. Has that guy lost the will to live? He has certain found the will to blame everyone and everything but himself! He can't even out qualify his teamate!
I miss watching his fathers old races cause his son hs become a spoiled self serving brat thats not fast enough to get ot of his own way.
Steve

Deschodt · 05-10-2005, 04:45 AM

Agreed... I was hoping for a JV resurgence after the penultimate race, but in spain he was back to his normal 12-14th spot in the race. It looks bad when Massa is a second a lap faster... JV is the new Panis, with attitude ;-)

On the previous topic, I actually don't mind the tires tule...I just wish they'd also ban refueling and we'd go back to 80s style races where drivers have to manage their cars and think a bit. Oh, and pass people on the friggin' track !!! The end of the race would be fascinating, people who saved their tires more mounting comebacks, front runners running worn tires etc... I also am no fan of the V8 rule but remember the V8s are going to run around 20000 RPM, they should still sound exciting !

MFAFF · 05-10-2005, 10:04 AM

Gotta agree with Deschodt... bring back the 80s...turbo'd cars. no refuelling and no new tires...and who made it exciting...Senna, the Prof, Nige and Nelson.

Never anything boring about that...

The refuelling and tire changes are great ways to bring the teams more into the action as opposed to the driver...

Its all swings and roundabouts....its not about money, except for how much BE gets to trouser...

Its also all about trying to keep people like BMW/Merc/Honda in this game and not let them realise they would actually be better investing in other racing forms where the car resembles a road car.