The USGP: NEVER AGAIN!!!!!!! - Page 3

Serge914 · Serge914's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by BGCarrera32
Well, Indy F1 only had 6 cars on the grid but at least they raced the whole thing without 135 caution flags and the pace car out every lap...

Do you realy believe that those 2 red cars were racing each others ?

trj911 · trj911's Garage

There was no racing going on. It was like on long boring parade and we all knew the parade princess would come in first.

BGCarrera32 · 06-20-2005, 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Serge914
Do you realy believe that those 2 red cars were racing each others ?

Well, when every other Nascar race goes down someone wins under caution, and that's not racing either.

VINMAN · 06-20-2005, 11:04 AM

It was a plot by the French to sabotage us.!!

Jeremy Cottrell · 06-20-2005, 08:38 PM

I will always love Formula One. I will always love the cars, the speed, the technology, the sound, etc. Mostly I love the history and the great stories. I will continue to celebrate the birthdays of Ayrton Senna and Gilles Villenueve. I have fought for years with friends to embrace the greatness of this form of motorsport. Many just don't get it. Unfortunatly, I have to hang my head in shame at the behaviour of those indivduals involved with this disaster, namely Michelin, Ferrari, and Ecclestone. This happened at the absolute worst time in the absolute worst place it could have. I can only hope that this was a crazy isolated incident, and nothing like this will ever happen again. The fans do come first and I hope these guys have learned a valueable lesson. Hopefully the American support if F1 can recover.

jfw834 · jfw834's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy Cottrell
I will always love Formula One. I will always love the cars, the speed, the technology, the sound, etc. Mostly I love the history and the great stories. I will continue to celebrate the birthdays of Ayrton Senna and Gilles Villenueve. I have fought for years with friends to embrace the greatness of this form of motorsport. Many just don't get it. Unfortunatly, I have to hang my head in shame at the behaviour of those indivduals involved with this disaster, namely Michelin, Ferrari, and Ecclestone. This happened at the absolute worst time in the absolute worst place it could have. I can only hope that this was a crazy isolated incident, and nothing like this will ever happen again. The fans do come first and I hope these guys have learned a valueable lesson. Hopefully the American support if F1 can recover.

AMEN, rev.

motion · 06-21-2005, 05:52 AM

Jeremy,

Why are you blaming Ferrari? I believe they did the right thing on all counts.

Jims5543 · 06-21-2005, 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy Cottrell
I will always love Formula One. I will always love the cars, the speed, the technology, the sound, etc. Mostly I love the history and the great stories. I will continue to celebrate the birthdays of Ayrton Senna and Gilles Villenueve. I have fought for years with friends to embrace the greatness of this form of motorsport. Many just don't get it. Unfortunatly, I have to hang my head in shame at the behaviour of those indivduals involved with this disaster, namely Michelin, Ferrari, and Ecclestone. This happened at the absolute worst time in the absolute worst place it could have. I can only hope that this was a crazy isolated incident, and nothing like this will ever happen again. The fans do come first and I hope these guys have learned a valueable lesson. Hopefully the American support if F1 can recover.

I blame Michelin and all the teams that refused to race because they were not going to be fast. They came to the race with the wrong gear, asked for the rules to change so they would be allowed to use a 3rd set of tires and were rejected. Then they asked for the rules to change again for a chicane to be added and were rejected.

There was a solution to the problem, manage the tires, stay off the banking and go a little slower. Was Ferrari going to clobber them? Yes. Who's fault was that? No one seemed to mind when Ferrari was struggling with tire issues so far this season and probably will continue to have issues.

The FIA has summoned all the "boycott" teams to a hearing. I would imagine at the very least they will be fined, they might also loose championship points for this fiasco as well.

I am at a loss why Ferrari is the bad guy in all of this. They came to race and race they did.... sort of. I guess Ferrari is just an easy scapegoat.

RallyJon · 06-21-2005, 06:40 AM

More...

As predicted, the Michelin seven have been charged with bringing the sport into disrepute during the Indy fiasco by the FIA.
In a letter sent to all seven of the teams, the FIA declared that at next Wednesday's hearing, they would 'answer charges that, in breach of the above, you committed one or more acts prejudicial to the interests of a competition, namely the 2005 United States Grand Prix and/or to the interests of motor sport'.

The specific charges against the Michelin teams are that they:

- failed to ensure that you had a supply of suitable tyres for the race and/or
- wrongfully refused to all allow your cars to start the race and/or
- wrongfully refused to allow your cars to race, subject to a speed restriction in one corner which was safe for such tyres as you had available and/or
- combined with other teams to make a demonstration damaging to the image of Formula One by pulling into the pits immediately before the start of the race.

'And that you failed to notify the stewards of your intention not to race in breach of article 131 of the FIA Formula One Sporting Regulations.'

scottmandue · 06-21-2005, 07:12 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by pwd72s
Hooboy...hey guys, the Champ cars are running in Oregon today...it's a road course. You might see some racing, even...and it's free on network TV. !

I like Champ cars... but, my gawsh that race was one yawnfest!

I love F1 also, hope they can get their act together.
Laguna Seca? Long Beach? yeah baby!

Either if those venues could pull their ass out of the fire.

Jeremy Cottrell · 06-21-2005, 09:26 AM

Ferrari was one of the groups who would not allow the chicane to be installed AFAIK. If it meant that the show would go on, I think they should have agreed to it.

motion · 06-21-2005, 09:33 AM

And if it rained, and the Michelin teams' rain tires were not good, maybe Ferrari should go ahead and run on slicks so that things were equalized a bit? Yep, sounds fair to me.

badcar · badcar's Garage

The blame is all around. Like the Masters tournament in golf. You are not allowed to hit from the ladies tee because your clubs suck, you still play with the clubs you brought on the course as it was designed. If you know you are playing Augusta National, you come prepared, play hard, do your best. You don't give up. This is the 6th time on this course, resurfaced or not, the track is the track.
Ferrari did what they should have done, they came prepared to run, and did. It was just really lame...

turbo6bar · 06-21-2005, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy Cottrell
Ferrari was one of the groups who would not allow the chicane to be installed AFAIK. If it meant that the show would go on, I think they should have agreed to it.

The Michelin teams would not agree to go slower in Turn 13. Doing so would have meant the show would go on.

If Bridgestone tires were bad, instead of Michelins, I don't think the outrage would be so strong. What are the chances 9 teams would allow a chicane if Ferrari needed it to be competitive?

MichiganMat · MichiganMat's Garage

The thing that makes this discussion difficult is that there are only two tyre manufacturers, there are no alternatives if there is a problem. Michelin's problems caused problems for a significant number of cars, enough cars to warrant a change in the rules, IMO.

Yes, they could/should have tested more.
Yes, they let down a lot of people by not providing a safe tyre.

So what are you, as a race organizer, going to do about it?

When you have lemons, you make lemonade, period. If the fans are the heartbeat of the sport, then I, if I were the organizer, would do everything to make sure they got to see what they paid for. Would a race with the majority of the cars limping around the track at half speed with a million pit-stops make for a good event? I don't think so.

If it rained at INDY and one car brought rain tyres in a field of 20, would you want to watch? {snorrrrrr}

Jims5543 · 06-21-2005, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy Cottrell
Ferrari was one of the groups who would not allow the chicane to be installed AFAIK. If it meant that the show would go on, I think they should have agreed to it.

Ferrari had nothing to do with that. It has been stated numerous times not only by Ferrari but by other teams as well. It was up to the FIA to decide to BREAK THE RULES because a tire manufacturer screwed up. Its really that simple.

Michelin did this not Ferrari, the teams chose not to race rather than to not be competative. There was a safe way around the track the teams decided to not race rather than race that line.

This was nothing more than a tantrum by the Michelin teams. If I was Ferrari I would be pissed as hell for them pulling that stunt. I applaud them for going out and somewhat racing. Opening up their radios for us to hear them was cool too. They, at least, tried to put on a show.

I know I will never buy a Michelin tire.... never.

http://www.planet-f1.com/news/story_20012.shtml

smoak · smoak's Garage

What's the big deal with these "tyre" things anyway, what do they do?

Jeremy Cottrell · 06-21-2005, 10:32 AM

I was misinformed about Ferraris role, my apologies.

Spud · 06-21-2005, 11:15 AM

Michelin was to blame. There was no easy answers available to this problem. How can you add a new chicane an hour prior to starting the race withought giving the drivers ample time to learn the new course? Have the Michelin drivers slow for turn 13? Not a good idea with the speed differentials involved, that would not have been the safe thing to do. Like I said, no easy answers to this problem.

However, how we got here is fixable. Requiring 1 set of tires for quali and race day is what got us to this point. Would have never had these issues had that gawd aweful rule never been born. All that rule has managed to do is make the cars more dangerous.

BlueSkyJaunte · 06-21-2005, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by MichiganMat
Would a race with the majority of the cars limping around the track at half speed with a million pit-stops make for a good event? I don't think so.

You're right.

Now, if they'd actually attempted to WIN instead of being a bunch of crybaby pantywaists then it would've been a show!

More crashes than a NASTYCAR event! Think how popular F1 would be in the US!