Why do liberals have such a hatred for WalMart?
 

WalMart has been a lifesaver for many lower-middleclass folks who can't afford to shop in the trendy establishments patronized by the leftist elites. Since lefties are always purporting to champion the poor and down-trodden, it seems ironic that they want to drive WalMarts out of business. Please don't give me the excuse that WalMart doesn't pay employees enough, it goes deeper than that. After all, living in SoCal, I've never met a well-to-do liberal who had any qualms whatsoever about hiring an illegal housemaid at sub-minimum wage to tidy up their million dollar home.

I'm not a liberal, but I'm not a big fan of WalMart because they have moved in and essentially closed down most of the places that I used to shop. Now I have to drive miles from home to stand in line at a Super WalMart that has 42 checkout lanes and 3 cashiers working.

And that's just the tip of the iceberg. I hate Walmart.

Mike

Ever see the South Park on Wal-Mart?

While it doesn't directly address this question, it does address the phenomena of Wal-Mart.

Cause it aint the way they remember it as kids. So that means they are getting older and will one day die.

I kind of miss the creaky wooden floor in LH Martins....

Ditto, except I refuse to set foot in a Walmart.

One of my aunts is a rabid walmart hater. I asked her why she hated them so much and I got a flood of obscenities, incoherent statements, outright lies, and just plain idiocy. Made no sense whatsoever. Any partial point she made couldn't be explained when I asked her to clarify. She hates walmart because she thinks she's supposed to, yet she still goes there.

My former boss doesn't shop at walmart, because his wife's fabric store was forced out of business when Walmart moved to town. He goes to the grossly overpriced radioshack and other downtown businesses and grocery stores. Instead of rambling like an idiot, he has this one valid point that he uses. That's good enough.

I love walmart.

I don't particularly like to shop in WalMart either, but that's not my question. Why do liberal elites want to prevent people from shopping there if they want/need to? Answer: In reality they don't give a ***** about lower-income people, they just want their votes on election day.

aways, do you think that will change when/if walmart workers unionize? I remember hearing rumblings about unionization a few months ago.

My wife and I do most of our grocery shopping at Wal-Mart. Why? Because I prefer to pay $2.50 for a box of Cinnamon Toast Crunch instead of $3.75 for the exact same box at Jewel. The produce at Wal-Mart always sucks, but the produce at every grocery store has sucked this summer because of the drought. We've taken to buying produce at the local farmer's market in the summer (it only goes on during the summer).

Bottom line? Wal-Mart is good brand name stuff, but I avoid them for everything else. I don't hate them because they have a successful business model. I just take advantage of them where it suits me.

My father-in-law does not like their business practices. He has been a supplier of several different products to them(at one time, his magazine accounted for more revenue than all other magazines' revenue, combined). I can't remember exactly why or how... But his gripe was they have such huge buying power, it drives both the competition and suppliers out of business - unless you play ball (at their price) exactly how they dictate.

btw, he is Ultra-Conservative.

- Skip

What pundit claimed it was a liberal/conservative issue?

The loss of small, neighborhood businesses that are responsive to local needs will ultimately be destructive to smaller communities (that's true of all mass discount stores, but WalMart is the most successful, and therefore the key target of protest).

WalMart has had policies of skirting minimum wage and hourly rules in order to avoid paying legally-mandated employment benefits. Many WalMart employees in the past have been able to qualify for public assistance, food stamps, etc. while still working all the hours WalMart was willing to give them. That may or may not be current policy -- I haven't kept up.

Skip,

I've heard this about Wal-Mart. I also remember hearing it about Sears 20-30 years ago. The fact is, that over time, many suppliers will decide that the increased sales are not worth selling each unit at or near a loss (but we all know you can make up per-unit losses on volume ;)). Further, it puts them in a precarious position should Wal-Mart ever decide to walk away. You can't sell products without suppliers.

See that! Ask a question, then 20 minutes later, ignore the responses and answer the question yourself.

The problem with political dialogue in this country is perfectly mirrored on this board. Everyone is just talking over each other's heads. Hoping to hear the echo of their own voices bounce back to them I guess.

Now back to your regularly-scheduled preconceived notions and biases ...

I do like your car though :)

Don't hate da playa, hate da game.

With respect to pricing of commodity products, such as legion's Cinnamon Toast Crunch (and many other items): shouldn't you be much angrier at the sleazy rapacious bastard of a local retailer who was overcharging you before Wal-mart came along and showed you how much you were overpaying?

And let's not forget that the main battle is between giants, and bigger giants. Wal-mart is putting much more of a squeeze on supermarket chains, low-end clothing chains, and other category killers like Home Depot than it is harming small specialty stores. A retailer who differentiates with superior service and high quality, branded product that Wal-mart can't or won't sell, will do just fine. A smalltown "general store" selling basic household products who's overcharged his customers all these years with a warm folksy smile better be afraid, though.

That exactly what he did. He walked and won't do business with them any longer..

I believe WalMart also likes binding exclusivity. Once they get you locked in, they beat your price down...

It's apparent there are two side which dislike WalMart, for very different reasons.

My .02... If an employee needs to make more money, they are free to go to another employer who will pay them what they are worth. Somethin about free economy comes to mind.... where's Supe when you need him? ;)

I wonder if the difference between procurement price between local retailer & walmart could have anything to do selling price by the same?

- Skip

Here's another one of my preconceived notions: Liberals will take any issue an personalize it, usually through an ad hominem personal attack.
Let me guess: You're a liberal.?

Thanks for the compliment on my car though. :)

I'm not going to fault a potential supplier for refusing to do business with Wal-Mart either, they have to do what is right for them. If I were running a small business, I wouldn't put myself in a position of relying on one customer even if it meant foregoing huge short-term profit.

Predatory business practices among other things...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wal-mart#Criticism

I don't like Wal*Mart because of how they treat suppliers. If we wanted to get into WM, we'd make a pitch and instead of haggling on price, they'd say: we know that shirt costs you $5.50. We'll pay $4.75. if we couldn't come down to $3 by ripping our suppliers a new one for us to make it worthwhile, and they really liked the style, they'd just rip off the designs and do it themselves. Happened to Too Shy, a very well established pre-teen brand two years ago. FBI was involved.

I also like to buy to local. Why? Information and peace of mind. I could have bought my Miller 135 MIG at least $200 cheaper on eBay. But I bought local cause the store owner spent about an hour with me on welding technique, through in a pair of gloves and if I have any problems, I can take it back.

With Cinnamon Toast Crunch, WM is great because they've got volume and inventory management on their side. With anything important, I try to buy local.

Lastly, as a self-described "asset buyer," that is I will save for something of quality and and go without before I will buy something just to have it. WM carries lowest common denominator products, so not much a reason to buy there other than basic commodities.

no work

Re: Why do liberals have such a hatred for WalMart?
 

Unions...plain and simple...They do not care if they provide cheap products to the poor, or employ many, or bring up depressed areas...it is all about union jobs and strongarming.

Re: Re: Why do liberals have such a hatred for WalMart?
 

Do a search on Wal-Marts efforts to build a store in Chicago...

Uhhh, yeah! Consumers have choices: quality, location, prestige, store environment, customer service... the list goes on.

WM is all about efficient flow of inventory, lower quality goods and no-frills shopping environment.

Macy's is about efficient flow of inventory against season, good quality goods and a pleasant shopping environment

Your local boutique is about "what's hot now exclusivity," very high quality, and a refreshing cup of cucumber-lemon water as you enter the store where the owner has invited you down to get a first look of the new stuff in that she knows will fit your daughter.

Difference on price? Yeah. It's called capitalism, and it works.

Re: Re: Why do liberals have such a hatred for WalMart?
 

I think you're right. Unions would mean slightly higher wages for WM employees, but ultimately higher prices for consumers as WalMart passes along the increased cost of doing business, leading to an inflationary spiral that hurts the poor the most...

I hate unions!:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

Re: Re: Re: Why do liberals have such a hatred for WalMart?
 

Store employees aren't the biggest cost.

And WalMart (and many others) skate around the political issues of Made in (insert third world country here) labels by going to places like Saipan where it's legal (thanks, Tom DeLay) to use a "Made in USA" label, but have working conditions that would horrify American consumers.

I'm not sure that Wal-mart could handle a union. Think how bad their customer service is now, then stack the usual "they can't fire me" union worker apathy on top of that. The checkout lines would be even longer, if that's possible...

Re: Re: Re: Why do liberals have such a hatred for WalMart?
 

Given scale, I think this is a myth. WM sales could absorb A LOT of increased costs. I give them kudos for the best example of data management known to man. I think, if they wanted to, they could give a little more to the average worker and the bottom line would only be increased with happier employees and more productivity.

it's a tough to strike this balance: happy employees who understand they have a stake in the welfare of the company vs. overpaid employees who are just sucking it dry. Complicated to be sure, and so much has to do with management, but at the core of low-cost shopping. I htink WM has overall done a good job with some exceptions. I think if they were magnamous iwht a healthy raise for all it first be well received and then later abused.

I'm not a big fan now either Skip. Very important in their day, now all we need is Management to be cognizant of everyday worker needs, and that includes $ and non-$ things.

Unions today are more about saving their own skins vs. getting anything done for their base.

If I post information related to the substance of your question, it will be for the benefit of others. You my friend, are using some stereotypes that betray your information sources, and your lack of historical perspective. Until very recently, "liberal elites" was an oxymoron and it has been sheer marketing genius that has contrived this perception that libs are the rich folks, and cons are the working poor. For eighty years this country knew that the opposite was true and still is. The largest and most expensive vehicles I see are the ones with the Bush/Cheney stickers still on, and the Subaru Legacy Wagons are where I find the liberal bumper stickers. The party of business is the Republican party, and the "social" party is the Democratic party.

So, whether I post some information about why Wal-Mart stores are avoided by communities (libs and cons alike) because of the damage they do, I don't think you are in a position to assess the information objectively anyway.

Your question....."Why do liberal elites hate it when poor people have a place to go shopping?" is similar to "When did you stop beating your wife?" It's worse, in fact.

the 'liberals' that have responded thus far have absolutely owned the topic starter.

I could not even begin to address the Problems with Wal-mart in a forum such as this.

Kudos to those that are able to summarize more quickly coherently than I'd be able to.

and the problem with that is they end up pushing the higher-end and specialty stores out. Same way with Lowes and Home Depot. You WILL use their product selections or shop forever looking for what you really want. Chinese tools, warped lumber, crap. Try to find anyone who knows anything other than possibly what isle something is in. I can find anything I want on the internet, cheaper too, it just takes a week to get it.
I really miss real hardware stores....

Supe- Are you claiming there is not a sub-section of liberals who are rich/elite? Like, ohhh I don't know, Hollywood?

Which liberals do we hear from? The poor wons who are starving? Or, John Kerry and his catsup lady?

Come on man... He didn't say the liberals, all who are elite.

- Skip

Re: Re: Re: Why do liberals have such a hatred for WalMart?
 

no aways, I am absolutely right...there is no question about it...The very reason our cars are crap, our union manufactured goods are too expensive and crap, and jobs are driven out of the country. If you do not play by the union's playbook then they will badmouth you and attempt to destroy your business. Democrats are in the unions back pocket and, therefore, have to bad-mouth corporations and support whatever the union cause (they scratch eachother's backs).

We still have one in town. I was looking for new handles for my shower. Turns out my shower has valves that are not made anymore (Milwaukee/Universal Rundle). I had to take off work early to go to the hardware store (hours 9:00 - 5:00, M-F). When I got there, I got ignored because I was not a "regular". After waiting for 45 minutes to be acknowledged, I was told that they did not carry what I was looking for. Haven't been back since.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Why do liberals have such a hatred for WalMart?
 

they're thugs & crooks.

Re: Re: Why do liberals have such a hatred for WalMart?
 

You are correct for a change. It is about strongarming. When a large business gets to bargain with each worker separately, the business hold all the cards and has all the clout. Wal-Mart strongarms both its suppliers and its workers. Unionization would give the workers a single voice. Unionism, pure and simple, is about workers pooling their clout so that discussions of wages and working conditions is a fair fight. Yes, unions sometimes misbehave. So do businesses. But if a business is allowed, like Wal-Mart has been allowed, to completely avoid and evade dealing with workers' representatives, then it maintains the upper hand.

Frankly, American commercial interests should be a bit negative on Wal-Mart for this reason. There has been a constant weakening of the NLRA, or at least there has been a more and more business-friendly NLRB lately, and Wal-Mart is illustrating why the NLRB should go back to its original mandate which is to make businesses recognize workers' representatives where the workers have properly elected that representative. In other words, Wal-Mart is likely to remind the Board of its mission, which will tip the balance back toward working men and women. That's got to be a little scary for business barons who see the Big Picture.

The thing that bothers me most about unions is that it is a one-time decision. The workers vote to unionize and which union will represent them and it is done and set in stone. From that day on, the workers no longer have any power over the union, and can not de-unionize even if they wanted to.

Imagine if presidential elections worked this way. Back when the country was founded, you would vote for a party, and all future leaders would come from that party...