"Press"ing Plame

[Victor]

Originally posted by fintstone
Don't be desperate Victor, the media will ensure that the truth about Wilson and Plame is kept relatively quiet.

This is teal! Ha - I love this function. And by the way, I could care less about Wilson and Plame. It's all about font colour here.

[Rodeo]

Well, this is all very interesting propaganda.

Luckily, we have a public record to refute this baloney:

Was Plame's identity known outside the intelligence community prior to the admin smear machine going after her? With all due respect to RoninLB, I'm sure you are an upstanding member of your community (or not, who the heck knows anything on the web?), but I'll take Fitzgerald's word for it, not yours:

"Prior to July 14, 2003, Valerie Wilson’s employment status was classified. Prior to that date, her affiliation with the CIA was not common knowledge outside the intelligence community. Disclosure of classified information about an individual’s employment by the CIA has the potential to damage the national security in ways that range from preventing that individual’s future use in a covert capacity, to compromising intelligence-gathering methods and operations, and endangering the safety of CIA employees and those who deal with them, the indictment states."

As to how Wilson was sent to Niger, the Special Prosecutor tells us that as well:

"The CIA decided on its own initiative to send Wilson to Niger after an inquiry to the CIA by the Vice President concerning certain intelligence reporting. Wilson orally reported his findings to the CIA upon his return."

And finally, Mul is up to his old tricks. Why don't you tell people that the "analysts' assessments" Wilson's trip confirmed were that THERE WAS NO NIGER/YELLOWCAKE CONNECTION. And I’m pretty sure you switch from quoting the Senate Committee Report to quoting the minority (Repub) report without telling us, but I’m not going to bother to chase that down.

Can you guys really be so twisted to believe that the "16 words" the president withdrew from his State of the Union Address were TRUE, and that the intelligence that led him to make that unprecedented withdrawal was FALSE?

How can you even function day to day this disconnected from reality?

Wilson told the truth. The president and vice president and Libby lied. Face up to it, ok?

[fintstone]

Originally posted by Rodeo
......."

And finally, Mul is up to his old tricks. Why don't you tell people that the "analysts' assessments" Wilson's trip confirmed were that THERE WAS NO NIGER/YELLOWCAKE CONNECTION. And I’m pretty sure you switch from quoting the Senate Committee Report to quoting the minority (Repub) report without telling us, but I’m not going to bother to chase that down.

.....

Would you explain exactly how Wilson's trip confirmed anything and what, if any evidence he cited which you would use to contradict the position of the intelligence experts experts.

[Rodeo]

Wilson's oral report back to the CIA, as Mul quoted, confirmed and agreed with two earlier conclusions of CIA analysts -- there was NO Niger/Uranium connection to Iraq.

Today we know conclusively that Wilson was right, the two previous CIA assessments were right, the initial and tenuous evidence of any connection was based upon a forged document, and that the president withdrew his State of the Union claim because it was false.

Yet for some unfathomable reason, you and the other admin apologists simply refuse to accept these indisputable facts. You are not helping your case by continuing the smear campaign that hopefully will someday land Libby in jail, where he belongs. Give it up already.

If you still want to defend Bush/Cheney, move to other grounds.

[fintstone]

Originally posted by Rodeo
Wilson's oral report back to the CIA, as Mul quoted, confirmed and agreed with two earlier conclusions of CIA analysts -- there was NO Niger/Uranium connection to Iraq.

..

Once again, Would you explain exactly how Wilson's trip confirmed anything and what, if any evidence he cited which you would use to contradict the position of the intelligence experts experts.

In other words, what information did Wilson bring back to confirm anything? Did he get a witness, a document, pictures? Exactly what evidence did he cite that there was no Niger/uranium connection to Iraq?

[stevepaa]

Is this about the yellow cake nonsense that the FBI tracked down as being false and having come from an ex Italian intelligence officer?

[fintstone]

The only publicly released information I have seen so far is what was released by the senate committee that investigated. The following is a excerpt fro the Wash Post on the committee's findings. It appears that, not only did Wilson not find out anything regarding the Yellowcake, he actually bolstered the case with the little info he did find out. He was also caught lying multiple times.

"Administration officials told columnist Robert D. Novak then that Wilson, a partisan critic of Bush's foreign policy, was sent to Niger at the suggestion of Plame, who worked in the nonproliferation unit at CIA. The disclosure of Plame's identity, which was classified, led to an investigation into who leaked her name.

The report may bolster the rationale that administration officials provided the information not to intentionally expose an undercover CIA employee, but to call into question Wilson's bona fides as an investigator into trafficking of weapons of mass destruction. To charge anyone with a crime, prosecutors need evidence that exposure of a covert officer was intentional.

The report states that a CIA official told the Senate committee that Plame "offered up" Wilson's name for the Niger trip, then on Feb. 12, 2002, sent a memo to a deputy chief in the CIA's Directorate of Operations saying her husband "has good relations with both the PM [prime minister] and the former Minister of Mines (not to mention lots of French contacts), both of whom could possibly shed light on this sort of activity." The next day, the operations official cabled an overseas officer seeking concurrence with the idea of sending Wilson, the report said.

Wilson has asserted that his wife was not involved in the decision to send him to Niger.

"Valerie had nothing to do with the matter," Wilson wrote in a memoir published this year. "She definitely had not proposed that I make the trip."

Wilson stood by his assertion in an interview yesterday, saying Plame was not the person who made the decision to send him. Of her memo, he said: "I don't see it as a recommendation to send me."

The report said Plame told committee staffers that she relayed the CIA's request to her husband, saying, "there's this crazy report" about a purported deal for Niger to sell uranium to Iraq. The committee found Wilson had made an earlier trip to Niger in 1999 for the CIA, also at his wife's suggestion.

The report also said Wilson provided misleading information to The Washington Post last June. He said then that he concluded the Niger intelligence was based on documents that had clearly been forged because "the dates were wrong and the names were wrong."

"Committee staff asked how the former ambassador could have come to the conclusion that the 'dates were wrong and the names were wrong' when he had never seen the CIA reports and had no knowledge of what names and dates were in the reports," the Senate panel said. Wilson told the panel he may have been confused and may have "misspoken" to reporters. The documents -- purported sales agreements between Niger and Iraq -- were not in U.S. hands until eight months after Wilson made his trip to Niger.

Wilson's reports to the CIA added to the evidence that Iraq may have tried to buy uranium in Niger, although officials at the State Department remained highly skeptical, the report said.

Wilson said that a former prime minister of Niger, Ibrahim Assane Mayaki, was unaware of any sales contract with Iraq, but said that in June 1999 a businessman approached him, insisting that he meet with an Iraqi delegation to discuss "expanding commercial relations" between Niger and Iraq -- which Mayaki interpreted to mean they wanted to discuss yellowcake sales. A report CIA officials drafted after debriefing Wilson said that "although the meeting took place, Mayaki let the matter drop due to UN sanctions on Iraq."

According to the former Niger mining minister, Wilson told his CIA contacts, Iraq tried to buy 400 tons of uranium in 1998.

Still, it was the CIA that bore the brunt of the criticism of the Niger intelligence. The panel found that the CIA has not fully investigated possible efforts by Iraq to buy uranium in Niger to this day, citing reports from a foreign service and the U.S. Navy about uranium from Niger destined for Iraq and stored in a warehouse in Benin."

[Mulhollanddose]

Originally posted by stevepaa
Is this about the yellow cake nonsense that the FBI tracked down as being false and having come from an ex Italian intelligence officer?

Would you believe the Nixon slayer Bob Woodward?

(notice the oft repeated talk-show strategy of 1 moderate Republican, 3 to 4 confirmed lefties)

[Mulhollanddose]

Originally posted by fintstone
Wilson said that a former prime minister of Niger, Ibrahim Assane Mayaki, was unaware of any sales contract with Iraq, but said that in June 1999 a businessman approached him, insisting that he meet with an Iraqi delegation to discuss "expanding commercial relations" between Niger and Iraq -- which Mayaki interpreted to mean they wanted to discuss yellowcake sales. A report CIA officials drafted after debriefing Wilson said that "although the meeting took place, Mayaki let the matter drop due to UN sanctions on Iraq."

The famous "16 words", as the DNC/Wilson product launch slogan goes, made no mention of Niger specifically.

[Mulhollanddose]

Originally posted by Victor
I never realised we could change colours to further emphasize utter desparation when posting here..... ROCK ON!

Since there isn't a "pop-up book" function (for intellectually impaired lefties here), I made due.

[RoninLB]

Originally posted by Rodeo


Well, this is all very interesting propaganda.
-------- The far left's mission is to create a fight. Advocacy groups make their money by advocacy.Their mission is to polarize. Without a fight there is no reason for their existence.

Luckily, we have a public record to refute this baloney:
-------- exactly. The Libby cartoon show will be fun to watch.
What won't be fun is the fact that Fitz has made politics a criminal act. Reporting on politics might never be the same unless Congress passes a new law protecting journialists.

Was Plame's identity known outside the intelligence community prior to the admin smear machine going after her? With all due respect to RoninLB, I'm sure you are an upstanding member of your community (or not, who the heck knows anything on the web?), but I'll take Fitzgerald's word for it, not yours:
--------- Fitz is going to have fun proving that Libby lied based largely on the testimony of 3 journalists. Libby's lawyers and the whole US will really "Meet the Press". So far the info used to justify throwing Miller in jail has not been unsealed yet. That info was used by the judge against Miller. Fitz and the judge set a precedent that surely will be used in the future to throw reporters in jail. Fitz is now on a mission to justify his existence after he found out that there was no criminal act of mentioning Plame.
"but I'll take Fitzgerald's word for it, not yours".. No prob. Go for it. You pushed a logical position.

"Prior to July 14, 2003, Valerie Wilson’s employment status was classified. Prior to that date, her affiliation with the CIA was not common knowledge outside the intelligence community. Disclosure of classified information about an individual’s employment by the CIA has the potential to damage the national security in ways that range from preventing that individual’s future use in a covert capacity, to compromising intelligence-gathering methods and operations, and endangering the safety of CIA employees and those who deal with them, the indictment states."
------- the '82 IIPA act was carefully worded. It was designed to protect national security vs allowing free speech. It was not designed to protect the CIA or its employees against all public criticism. The act criminalizes when a person "clearly represent a conscious and pernicious effort to identify and expose agents with the intent to impair or impede the foreign intelligence activities of the United States. " The act doesn't forbid the identification of anyone in a "classified" status. Only real covert agents were protected.
So.. Plame was not undercover overseas or even has been posted overseas since 1997, she was living under her own name, Wilson published her name in his bio, etc.
The reason Fitz didn't charge anyone with leaking was because no crime had been committed, not because as Fitz claimed there was "insufficient evidence". Plame's name & CIA was used to rebute the implication that Wilson was selected by Cheney. There was not anything even unethical about using Plame's name. The public will understand this as Libby goes thru his trial. Fitz stated your above quote to cover his ass, as his case should have been dropped when he found this out.

As to how Wilson was sent to Niger, the Special Prosecutor tells us that as well:
"The CIA decided on its own initiative to send Wilson to Niger after an inquiry to the CIA by the Vice President concerning certain intelligence reporting. Wilson orally reported his findings to the CIA upon his return."
-------- Wilson's trip was to determine the accuracy of info. He was not sent as a covert agent. It was like an accounting audit by a somewhat outsider. The CIA's move was understandable and happened because they were skeptical of the Niger connection to Saddam.


Wilson told the truth. The president and vice president and Libby lied. Face up to it, ok?
-------- maybe Libby lied? Libby and his lawyers don't think so. Wilson was dropped by Kerry after his bs was outed. Wilson's original briefing to the CIA supported the fact that Saddam tried to get obtain yellowcake. Somehow Wilson didn't mention that in his Bush rant. Wilson is currently being used by Sen Reid to support his rants to the far left that Bush "lied us into war".
BTW... The 2004 Senate Intelligence Committee said "The committee did not find any evidence that that administration officials attempted to coerce, influence or pressure analysts to change their judgements related to Iraq's weapons of mass destruction."
The British's Butler Report found no evidence of "deliberate distortion"
The 2005 Robb-Silberman report on WMD " no evidence of political pressure to influence the Intelligence Community's pre-war assessments of Iraq's weapons programs"
Even Fitz said that "This indictment's not about the propriety of the war,"
So everyone who has looked into this so far has not found a pre-planned Bush decision to go invade Iraq.. except Wilson.

[Rodeo]

Wow. Ok guys, I'm not playing. I learned my lesson; some people will do or say anything to support this administration, and nothing I nor the special prosecutor nor anyone else can say will change your minds.

Most rational people begin with this basic fact: When Wilson published his op-ed piece in the NY Times, Dick Cheney did not come out and refute Wilson’s message -- that the “Niger connection” was a fiction.

Instead, he and his chief of staff set out to destroy the messenger. They did so by going after his wife, who had nothing to do with any of this. To most people, that speaks volumes. Not to you.

Thankfully, you are down to 35% of the population and sinking fast. Hopefully fast enough to save our country from more sleazy and incompetent blunders by this administration.

[fintstone]

Sorry, we did not mean to make you uncomfortable. We just sorta thought you had at least one small bit of evidence to support what you posted.

Of course Cheney did not lower himself to refute a clearly lying, has-been, hack like Wilson. Unlike Wilson, Cheney had a "day-job."

If you have any eveidence that Cheney sent anyone out to destroy anyone, please post it...otherwise you fall into the same category as Wilson.

[RoninLB]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Rodeo
Wow. Ok guys, I'm not playing.
-------- no prob. If I'm incorrect anywhere please let me know.. thx

, and nothing I nor the special prosecutor nor anyone else can say will change your minds.
-------- about what ?

Most rational people begin with this basic fact: -- that the “Niger connection” was a fiction.
------ that's why the CIA sent Wilson to audit the info. Wilson did report to the CIA that Saddam was trying to get the Niger connection but failed. And Wilson failed to mention that afterwards in his Bush attack.

Instead, he and his chief of staff set out to destroy the messenger.
------- defending the President against Wilson's lie sucked Plame into it.

Thankfully, you are down to 35% of the population and sinking fast. Hopefully fast enough to save our country from more sleazy and incompetent blunders by this administration.
-------- maybe you mean that Bush can't push his agenda? He's been pretty successful so far no matter what the polls infer. Even Minority Leader Reid can't stop him. I don't think the Dem's were very happy about being eventually forced to support Samuel Alito to the supremes because of his wide public support. Even the NY Times supports Alito. Every politician does want to get re-elected. It seems that many bright Dem's support the notion that a Supreme Court nomination should not be politicized.. except Sen Reid.

The real scandal is that the same Dem's who read the same info Bush did and drew the same conclusions and who voted to go to war are trying to rewrite history.. good luck.

[fintstone]

Now that witnesses have come forward and claimed that Wilson actually bragged about his wife's work as a CIA operative and that it was common knowledge in DC circles due to Wilson using it to attempt to ingratiate himself to the press elite..will we see the special prosecuter indict Wilson?

Also, isn't it interesting that the Special Prosecutor did not depose Wilson or Plame? Surely he should have asked them regarding this under oath.

[Mulhollanddose]

Nothing to see here....moveon please.

[Rodeo]

Originally posted by fintstone
Now that witnesses have come forward and claimed that Wilson actually bragged about his wife's work as a CIA operative and that it was common knowledge in DC circles due to Wilson using it to attempt to ingratiate himself to the press elite..will we see the special prosecuter indict Wilson?

Also, isn't it interesting that the Special Prosecutor did not depose Wilson or Plame? Surely he should have asked them regarding this under oath.

You are one move away from "Fitzpatrick is a lefty scum." Just say it and get it over with. Its your response to anyone and anything that you disagree with.

[RoninLB]

The Lib's policy brain for attacking Bush related to the war was on C-span or C-span2 early this morning. He's the lead lawyer for the gangsters down at Gitmo. His 1/2hr rant is that the gangsters should have "due process" and be tried under Geneva conventions. That Bush is manipulating the US constitution. That the administration are all crooks. That everyone has to get the word of this out to colleges and high school students. That Wilson is a patriot. That the war is illegal. That the military is being deceived.

After listening to this guy it became evident that he really doesn't truly believe we are at war and the type of war it is. He really hates Bush and everything the right wing believes in. He also seemed very pissed off that he doesn't have more population support and that the supremes is being remapped.

Anyway he pushed big time for getting his "word" out there. The talk was held at a Long Island college to a packed auditorium. The crowd was very quiet thru the whole talk as he tried to pump them up.

So this guy seems like a Lib opinion leader as I could see his exacts words have been repeated in the NY Times and by other Libs in one way or another.

Bingo.. I found one source of many hate Bush fans. Hooahhh

[fintstone]

Originally posted by Rodeo
You are one move away from "Fitzpatrick is a lefty scum." Just say it and get it over with. Its your response to anyone and anything that you disagree with.

If you had a clue you might be dangerous. No matter what I post, your next post implies I said something else. What exactly would saying that what Fitz did or didn't do was "interesting" would would cause you to believe that it meant "Fitzpatrick is a lefty scum?" No wonder liberals are so confused...it must be a reading comprehension problem. When confronted with new issues...before move-on.org or a liberal blog has prepared a position for them or some sort of bumper-sticker, catch-phrase...they have nothing coherent to say. Too bad innuendo and name-calling only pass for an argument in liberal land.

Perhaps Fitz did not depose Plame/Wilson because he intends to indict Wilson for "outing" Plame...or because he already had clear info that Plame was not covert...in which case there was no crime to convict Wilson on when he outed Plame and no reason to ask the question.

[RoninLB]

Originally posted by fintstone

Also, isn't it interesting that the Special Prosecutor did not depose Wilson or Plame? Surely he should have asked them regarding this under oath.

nope.. Fitz would have dug himself into a deeper hole.

Libby's lawyers are going to produce a soap worth syndicating. I wonder if they have it timed around next yrs election? Plame and Wilson have a chance to become Hollywood stars in their own program. It could be aired after the "West Wing". The far lefty Phil Donahue could be their tech adviser since he's retired and is really pumped into hating the Bush crowd. Right now ole' Phil is relegated to giving hate Bush talks at colleges etc.

The hate FDR crowd during WW2 seems like the same formula as the hate Bush crowd. Back then I think it was Time mag's owner Henry Luce that was the leader instead of the current NY Times.

Fitz better secure his nut sack before it's ripped open and he loses something.